If You Were in Andrea Rossi’s Shoes, What Would You have Done? (Andy Kumar)

Back to the subject that's of interest on this forum. Now that we understand what catalyst really works and how to control catalyst poisoning, hydrogen fusion is run of the mill. Problem is that there is a lot of profit in burning our vast oil reserve. As my ancestors would say, "it'll be many moons" before we have hydrogen fusion as our energy source. Please note that fission is a completely different subject and now very profitable. Especially when using a breeder to increase the energy yield a thousand fold. Fusion has to await its turn. My enthusiasm related to nanoscale fusion stems from first viewing my NiO/FiberFrax reactor producing excess energy.

"Stating that "Volcanic activity in one large scale eruption overwhelms many years of our contribution of CO2, SO2 and H2S" reveals a reliance on very poor sources, which suggests you are happy to follow someone else's agenda."

No, I watched and read the reports from the Mt. St. Helens volcanic eruption. I'm relying on good sources. Do you have someone else's agenda that you're following?

"A CENTURY LONG? Screw that. If I get a reactor that has a COP of over 6, I'm releasing it commercially and the construction open source ASAP."

Fortunately there's the overseers of the World Economy that you would have to contend with. Your release and open source construction would have to wait until the effect would be considered beneficial.

Quote from ogfusionist

"A CENTURY LONG? Screw that. If I get a reactor that has a COP of over 6, I'm releasing it commercially and the construction open source ASAP."

Fortunately there's the overseers of the World Economy that you would have to contend with. Your release and open source construction would have to wait until the effect would be considered beneficial.

Your kidding. Overseers of the 'World Economy' will stop me? That is ridiculous. Please, let's be a little more modern and realistic here.

Quote from ogfusionist

"Stating that "Volcanic activity in one large scale eruption overwhelms many years of our contribution of CO2, SO2 and H2S" reveals a reliance on very poor sources, which suggests you are happy to follow someone else's agenda."

No, I watched and read the reports from the Mt. St. Helens volcanic eruption. I'm relying on good sources. Do you have someone else's agenda that you're following?

In 2013, we pumped 39.8 BILLION tons of CO2 into the Earth's atmosphere. A decent sized puff from a volcano would only consist of a fraction of that. Not to mention that the amount we pump into the Earths atmosphere is increasing every year.
It is true that it is natural for the Earth to heat up like it is but to say that a SINGLE eruption could overwhelm YEARS of our CONTRIBUTIONS of C02 is ridiculous. That would mean roughly 100 billion tons of CO2.

"Fusion must wait its turn."

What, like someone in line to get into a concert?
"Oh sorry, we can't let you change the world for another-" Checks Watch "200 or so years. Sorry about that, the Great Overlords Of The World Economy said so." You said got back to the topic on hand, that is not what the topic is. The topic is making it work reliably, with high COP and change the world's perspective on it. After that, it's getting it to market and into the hands of every person on the globe.
Not how many years we will have to wait before 'the overseers' say we can.

"The topic is making it work reliably, with high COP and change the world's perspective on it. After that, it's getting it to market and into the hands of every person on the globe."

Let's see how well you have thought this out. You've received the formula for constructing a fusion reactor that produces unlimited power from recirculating hydrogen with practically no consumption of the hydrogen. Very cheap to construct and would power every household. Now tell me what your next move would be. Careful, you might want to research the fate of previous inventors that jumped the gun. Real threats are terminated one way or another.

What would you get into the hands of every person on the globe? The chance for no more electric and gas bills? Then what?

Quote from ogfusionist

"The topic is making it work reliably, with high COP and change the world's perspective on it. After that, it's getting it to market and into the hands of every person on the globe."

Let's see how well you have thought this out. You've received the formula for constructing a fusion reactor that produces unlimited power from recirculating hydrogen with practically no consumption of the hydrogen. Very cheap to construct and would power every household. Now tell me what your next move would be. Careful, you might want to research the fate of previous inventors that jumped the gun. Real threats are terminated one way or another.

What would you get into the hands of every person on the globe? The chance for no more electric and gas bills? Then what?

I like these questions. They make you think about the economical side of LENR.

First I spend half a year building several prototypes. I then secretly distributing the invention amongst several trusted, smart individuals. I then back up everything I know about it across multiple servers on 3 continents. So, if I get killed or whatever the invention is now in the hands of many. I then go online and simultaneously release the information across hundreds of websites and forums across the internet. I do a major publicity stunt where I power an entire town with it, or something to that effect. I send out prototypes to universities for review.

If I get killed or whatever, there are now hundreds of thousands of people across the globe that know about this new invention, thousands that have seen it in work and dozens of people examining already made ones. I have several trusted individuals also launching to market alongside me in separate companies.
Ideally, that's what I would do. That's because I'm not concerned with making a shit-ton of money, a view I think plenty of people on this forum share.

You see, the difference between then and now is that you can distribute the knowledge amongst millions and millions of people with the click of a button. You might be able to kill me easily, but you would be hard pressed to destroy my work entirely.

"What would you get into the hands of every person on the globe? The chance for no more electric and gas bills? Then what?"
I think you misunderstand me. I would be offering to build power stations or individual home units that give you electricity at a very small fraction of the cost. Not free, just very cheap to run. After that however you have to think broad. One that comes to mind immediately is aerospace applications. Such an incredible source of energy could be of tremendous use. One could even argue that it could revolutionise space travel. Alongside that, you would be doing this little thing called running a company. Nothing is finished however and improvements would constantly be worked on. Besides, what's stopping me from using the money I make to create even more products?

The point I am trying to make is that the world is not what you think, its much more free spirited. And there seem to be very significant holes in your arguments that I think you should reconsider. It is true that whoever succeeds in LENR fully might well find themselves in a car 'accident' organised by a big oil company. Yet the idea and their successes will not be contained within them if they have a good heart. It would be on the internet.

Maybe I am naive. I'm only 14 after all, I haven't experienced the world that you folks might have. But I know that if I was in that position, I know exactly what I would do.

Wow, 14 years old. Thanks for your well thought out responses. Renews my hope that we may survive a bit longer, although Yellowstone may cause a fresh start. Forgive my jaded outlook, I'm very near 90 years old.

I'll pass on the secret of a working fusion reactor. Sulfur is the principal catalyst poison and can be effectively controlled with a silver getter. The catalyst is sub micron particle size nickelous oxide deposited onto an alumina FiberFrax substrate. The catalyst array is positioned into an alumina tube that is heated to 830 C with a wire wound resistance heater. Hydrogen gas passing through this reactor will fuse to produce helium with the production of heat. Water at high pressure is used as the heat exchange medium to drive a turbine while controlling the heat to stop runaway meltdown. It works, I've had a working prototype in my lab. Now you have the secret, good luck with it. I'll leave you to consider the method for utilization. I've publicized this to minimize any threat to your safety.

Quote from ogfusionist

Wow, 14 years old. Thanks for your well thought out responses. Renews my hope that we may survive a bit longer, although Yellowstone may cause a fresh start. Forgive my jaded outlook, I'm very near 90 years old.

I'll pass on the secret of a working fusion reactor. Sulfur is the principal catalyst poison and can be effectively controlled with a silver getter. The catalyst is sub micron particle size nickelous oxide deposited onto an alumina FiberFrax substrate. The catalyst array is positioned into an alumina tube that is heated to 830 C with a wire wound resistance heater. Hydrogen gas passing through this reactor will fuse to produce helium with the production of heat. Water at high pressure is used as the heat exchange medium to drive a turbine while controlling the heat to stop runaway meltdown. It works, I've had a working prototype in my lab. Now you have the secret, good luck with it. I'll leave you to consider the method for utilization. I've publicized this to minimize any threat to your safety.

Sorry for being so venomous, I have a short temper, sorry. Yellowstone I must admit is a constant source of worry for me, although I am rational enough to realise it is only one of several hundred thousand pretty ways for humanity to go bang. Which of course only makes me worry more

Noted your method, although haven't searched through it technically yet just mindlessly jotted it down. You have one in your lab working? Wow, that is incredible if true. Would you be able to tell what it's COP is? You mentioned driving a turbine so I'm assuming it's higher then 5.

Careful with the tenses there Backyardfusion. Ogfusionist had one working some decades ago. I'm taking that at face value, at least for the purposes of potential utility. It is an interesting possibility, but you will see that one needs to be cautious and plan at least a full replication. I understand Ogfusionist would like to see this as well.

The main attraction here is the simplicity. If one can get around some of the details in his original setup--- such as a high vacuum bake out in hydrogen. And the ball milling of NiO for weeks. These seem to be issues with work-arounds. But who knows. The ball-milling surely introduces some of the ball material (also alumina?) into the pulverized NiO. The temperature of the meltdown is curiously right about the temperature of softening for Pyrex.... so there is some concern there that it simply reached the softening temperature and then fused onto the Fiberfrax.

As usual, thanks Longview for your precise contribution to this discussion. Your comment on tenses is right on. This goes back ~50 years. Would really like for someone to repeat this experiment and settle the question of whether fusion actually does occur.

Big question for me is why/how did I stumble on using silver in the hydrogen purification before interaction with the nickelous oxide? What's obvious to me now is that it's critical. Sulfur/sulfides must be completely removed from the catalytic reaction. Because of free machining consideration sulfur will be present in stainless piping and introduce trace levels of H2S. Combustion analyzers (Leco) are very useful for trace sulfur analysis. The catalyst must be sulfur free and should be checked before use.

So let's say I repeated the experiment. Fusionist would you be able to tell me the sort of levels of excess heat you think you experienced?

If you have heated laboratory grade pyrex tubing in a burner flame, it softens slowly. As 830 C was approached on the reactor, the run away quickly melted the tube housing the reactor fuel. Thermocouple tracing shot above 1000 C. If I were to try a repeat, a mixer on the hydrogen supply to dilute helium into the reactor is what I'd use. Again when the fusion triggers all hell breaks loose; something like having captured the sun in a bottle. Very similar basic fusion process.

If you try a repeat spend some time assuring that the hydrogen gas, nickelous oxide and FiberFrax are sulfur free. A silver getter immediately before the catalyst but with its temperature kept near 500 C is an absolute requirement. My lab supply was hydrogen boil off from liquid hydrogen but the pipes leading to the lab introduced enough H2S to poison the catalyst unless a getter was used just before the catalyst. Also, use an alumina (silica free) tube to house the reactor charge. Its translucent properties are very revealing, the area opposite the reactor charge will glow very bright when fusion initiates. The idea of having a light pipe in the reactor to measure brightness temperature is also interesting

Warning at my age reality and dreams get confused although I recall this experiment as one of the big surprises in my life.

Quote from ogfusionist

If you have heated laboratory grade pyrex tubing in a burner flame, it softens slowly. As 830 C was approached on the reactor, the run away quickly melted the tube housing the reactor fuel. Thermocouple tracing shot above 1000 C. If I were to try a repeat, a mixer on the hydrogen supply to dilute helium into the reactor is what I'd use. Again when the fusion triggers all hell breaks loose; something like having captured the sun in a bottle. Very similar basic fusion process.

If you try a repeat spend some time assuring that the hydrogen gas, nickelous oxide and FiberFrax are sulfur free. A silver getter immediately before the catalyst but with its temperature kept near 500 C is an absolute requirement. My lab supply was hydrogen boil off from liquid hydrogen but the pipes leading to the lab introduced enough H2S to poison the catalyst unless a getter was used just before the catalyst. Also, use an alumina (silica free) tube to house the reactor charge. Its translucent properties are very revealing, the area opposite the reactor charge will glow very bright when fusion initiates. The idea of having a light pipe in the reactor to measure brightness temperature is also interesting

Warning at my age reality and dreams get confused although I recall this experiment as one of the big surprises in my life.

Woah, that is a serious increase in temperature. While I currently can't begin work on your reactor, I would certainly like to build a replication in the coming months. Unfortunately I'm only in Year 8 so a lot of the equipment you guys have access to is far out of my reach so it might be difficult for me to produce the reactor.

If you want a successful replication take care with the hydrogen used in the reactor. I had access to boil off from liquid hydrogen, dissociated NH3 and molecular sieve purified hydrogen. All poisoned the reactor. The delivery pipes all contaminated the hydrogen with H2S and poisoned the reactor. A getter for sulfides immediately before the reactor charge is absolutely necessary. Also, make sure that the catalyst isn't already poisoned with sulfides before use.

Sonoluminescence has been ignored as a topic related to lenr. The energy released by sound induced bubble collapse has a spectral range indicating solar temperature. This then suggests hydrogen fusion. After long term sonic agitation the interest would be to test for helium in the containment vessel. Also a spectral signal for helium in the emitted light.

Thanks. I see it has been considered.

What's happening in the collapsing bubble that emits white light? I'd suspect hydrogen fusion at the nanometer level.