What has happened to the ash the Parkhomov and MFMP reactors?

1st Official Post

    I am wondering what happened to all the ash. Even from Rossi's I do not hear any current talk of it. Even with standard procedures we should have some knowledge by now. I may have missed it but please help me out. No final reports?

    I have all the data from Padua cell re-heat, but there are so many data (approx 40GB) and lot of work around that it is really hard to do analysis quickly.
    I hope that I can put at least part of it for the public inspection too.


    Basically everybody is busy in preparation for another runs as each time we know what can be done better so setting everything up is taking more and more time if you want to do it well.

    I can imagine very well, that after last few successfull reports it is really hard for other replicators if they want to present successfull report.
    There are so many questions always that:
    a) they want to investigate phenomenon very carefully to exclude any possible error - this can take months.
    b) they dont want to publish results because of own interests or they are afraid of publicity.


    Basically if you are lucky, you can probably replicate it with cheap components. But if you want to do things really good, it can take you years. And when your test is nearly prepared, you will check that there is another major issue that should be solved. And this is just beginning.


    If you want to make serious LENR research you will spend enormous time on it. If you want to bring something to the market, you have to create really reliable device and this is obviously very hard task. If something with high temperature should run for few years, then development may take tens of years even with good funding. Thus I dont see anything strange about Rossi delays..
    The worst is, that if you are doing it in a small group, after all the work you will find something much better that old one is not worth to produce yet.


    This is the reason why we should work together and find the best way much faster.. But it is strange loop, because without scientific reports it will be just ignored. So we have to also believe and trust other groups in their results if it is not perfect.

    Quote from me356

    I have all the data from Padua cell re-heat, but there are so many data (approx 40GB) and lot of work around that it is really hard to do analysis quickly.
    I hope that I can put at least part of it for the public inspection too.


    Crowd sourcing is the answer. Let the interested people do the analysis while you work for the next version of the experiment .
    You need not approve or disapprove the analysis, because people who are analyzing it can interpret it differently.


    40GB is a lot. But removing the camera data and compressing (rar) the rest should bring it down, I guess. The important data is of IR temperature, power/current/voltage and pressure, the rest can be optional.

    Quote from Rigel

    I am wondering what happened to all the ash. Even from Rossi's I do not hear any current talk of it. Even with standard procedures we should have some knowledge by now. I may have missed it but please help me out. No final reports?


    Thanks for the responses. But there should be someone reporting in from all the separate labs on the 'ash' analysis by now. I seem to recall that when MFMP did a run several different groups offered to do the ash analysis, so something must be happening by now. I am also surprised that I do not see anyone asking this question. It (transmutation) seems to be the agreed make or break results that would/could shock the LENR sphere. The replications happened all over the world certainly someone (or some group) moves with some urgency. I understand and appreciate the replicators positions as folks stated, but the lack of movement is puzzling. While reproducing either AR or AP or MFMP or ME method/setup is the goal there seems to be something missing here. Maybe I do not get the big picture here but a lot of work is being spent on the calorimetry but no one is interested in the what could point out what the real theory could point to with the ash results. I hear SSP, solitions, plasmons etc. but in my mind the answer seems to lie in the ash. -Thanks

    The answer to the RATE of energy gain is in the ash.


    The inner workings of the process is not in the ash, I am pretty sure of that.
    Why?


    Because we know a lot about isotope nuclear chain reactions but the mystery part is in the beginning of the process,
    How does the ultra-slow-neutron form??? Neither Widom-Larsen, Cook-Rossi, Storms or other theorists have explained this initial part
    of the process in a conclusive way that explains ALL path of LENR (PdD and NiH and D-D and...)


    Please help fill out this gap, what did the theorists say about the details of the initial part of the process?
    - NAE is correct but at an abstract level of understanding
    - CECR is correct but not the only way to trigger LENR
    - ...


    This presentation goes well with the question: http://anstd.ans.org/wp-conten…15/07/5043_Popa-Simil.pdf
    See slide 48 for example of theory at a level detailed enough to explain and by that optimize and design LENR.

    Quote

    If something with high temperature should run for few years, then development may take tens of years even with good funding. Thus I dont see anything strange about Rossi delays...


    That makes no sense at all. If LENR at high power were real, it could be demonstrated properly in days or weeks. Patent protection would be easy to get with a working demonstrator that could be properly tested and shown. It would not require months, much less years, to provide more power than could be obtained by chemical or storage means... by FAR (orders of magnitude if it really is a nuclear process)! Then, it would be very quick to obtain vast amounts of research and support from giant companies and immensely wealthy individuals. It would not require Rossi's sitting in a silly steel container with some bizarre collection of multiple "reactors" for a year, believe me. Nor would the customer be anonymous. Nor would [lexicon]IH[/lexicon] be silent. NOTHING would develop as it has if Rossi really had a working reactor -- especially if he had it in 2007 as he claims in his original patent application, and it was heating an entire building as he said.

    You have not understood my response.
    Obviously Rossi do not need to convince anybody at the moment. He have enough money to continue. With demonstrations he can maybe only loose. As he learned from the previous demonstrations, each one will reveal more information. The last one ended so we have enough data for replication what mean new competition for him.


    If you know that something is working you do not need to loose time with demonstrations. You will finish your product and then sell it. In the final stage you will need just marketing, but in case of LENR devices it is nearly useless. Customers will come to you if other customers are already satisfied.

    Makes perfect sense for people not suffering from paranoia on the subject. I have a reactor that produces excess heat by proton interaction to produce helium. I'm not paranoid when viewing the reaction and can appreciate the positive side as well as the negative. Everything will be negative for you. You're great help for institutions that will suppress this energy source until burning oil is no longer immensely profitable.


    Sorry that with your mentality you're incurable. Excuse for my post is that other readers become aware.

    Quote from ogfusionist

    Makes perfect sense for people not suffering from paranoia on the subject. I have a reactor that produces excess heat by proton interaction to produce helium. I'm not paranoid when viewing the reaction and can appreciate the positive side as well as the negative. Everything will be negative for you. You're great help for institutions that will suppress this energy source until burning oil is no longer immensely profitable.


    Sorry that with your mentality you're incurable. Excuse for my post is that other readers become aware.


    Correct me if I am wrong but you have mentioned a reactor a few times I think. It would be of great interest if you could post a picture of it or a link if you have already. Thanks.

    Quote

    You will finish your product and then sell it. In the final stage you will need just marketing, but in case of LENR devices it is nearly useless. Customers will come to you if other customers are already satisfied.


    That's very naive. Suppose Rossi did have a product and started to sell it. Rossi and [lexicon]IH[/lexicon] are small potatoes! Their $10 million investment is trivial compared to the resources which can be brought to bear from the likes of Google, Walmart, General Electric, Elon Musk and so on. As soon as the product was sold, it would be duplicated and improved. Without patent protection, Rossi's puny effort would be crushed like the cockroach that he is, probably within a month.


    Of course, Rossi claims he can't get patent protection and that is correct. But it is because patenting a product or process requires disclosure of how it's done or made in all details. Rossi hasn't done that so he would be vulnerable to any organization which wanted to sell his ecats cheaper than he can. Any idea what would happen if the Chinese government decided to copy the ecat and offer billions of units for sale?


    Of course, this is all silly talk because all Rossi has is an ordinary electric heater. Doubt it? Ask him to loop back the heat and disconnect the electricity.

    "Correct me if I am wrong but you have mentioned a reactor a few times I think. It would be of great interest if you could post a picture of it or a link if you have already. Thanks."


    Glowfish, my working hydrogen fusion reactor dates back 50 years. It was the center piece on my desk while at work. I've been retired many years and correspondence with people now in the lab don't know what I'm asking about. Replication would be easier than trying to locate the lost reactor. I've posted the design and ingredients on this forum. The key is deposition of a nanoparticle slurry of NiO on alumina fibers. The hydrogen must be purified of hydrogen sulfide before contacting the NiO. Hydrogen fusion initiates at exactly 830 C. if the catalyst has not been poisoned. Sulfur replaces oxygen on the catalyst surface and renders it useless. This process has remained obscure because of the difficulty in maintaining an active reactor free from the effects of hydrogen sulfide.

    "The inner workings of the process is not in the ash, I am pretty sure of that."


    You are correct. There may be some high amu transmutation but the main transmutation involves helium. I've shown this with high resolution GC of the eluent hydrogen.


    I want to thank you for this. I appreciate that pdf and recommend highly, I am surprised that I have not seen it with all the lurking/reading I do on LENR and E-Cat world. It will take some time to study it properly. I also appreciate the link to the data by Barty from ME. (and your work ME). This will also take sometime to go through.

    Quote from Mary Yugo

    Of course, this is all silly talk because all Rossi has is an ordinary electric heater. Doubt it? Ask him to loop back the heat and disconnect the electricity.


    Well, he has already done that. For example, 6th of october 2011, he unplugged the e-Cat that was under demonstration, and let it run for a few hours without any electrical input. Several scientists and engineers, including Mats Lewan, were there and verified this.


    You can listen to what Mats Lewan had to say about this, from 2:30 in this video:

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    I think it is easily understandable that Rossi is not concerned with demonstrations right now. At the same time I agree that if the e-Cat works as promised, he really should have been able to get enormous investments, billions, not a few millions, and have thousands of scientists working on the development of this technology. But Rossi is quite eccentric, so it is not always easy to know his reasoning for the way he does his business.


    There are good reasons to think that the e-Cat may be real, and there are some good reasons to be sceptical as well.
    I think the wisest thing to do is to keep an open mind.

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