When is the LENR purge itself from the Papp believers? You are crawling with cockoos and cockoo believers, and you expect to be taken seriously?
Will you please elaborate on why you don't like Papp, and why there must be a purge of "Papp believers"?
Papp and the Papp engine
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Will you please elaborate on why you don't like Papp, and why there must be a purge of "Papp believers"?
Yes, I don't like Papp because, even if by some incredible mental ability close to Einstein he would have developed an new source of energy, he would have to had an incredible mental abiility next to Buckmeister Fuller to develop in his garage a submarine capable to travel hundred of M/H (with no funds), and piloted it like Lindbergh with no GPS, and had the bad luck to sink after 99.99 of his trip has been completed.
Why there must be a purge of Papp believers?
You.
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Don't forget the train ticket from the airport to the beach that was found in Papp's pocket after the mysterious submarine trip.
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I would like to join the Papp discussion. I have also seen the rough video of the earlier explosion. Also aware of Bob Rohner and Russ Gries using a noble gas popper.
Assuming that it was nuclear based for a moment how much gas and what ratios were ionized to be useful? Then assume it did not have a nuclear fuel, how did it function?
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Assuming that it was nuclear based for a moment how much gas and what ratios were ionized to be useful? Then assume it did not have a nuclear fuel, how did it function?
When it comes to Papp's noble gas engine, I try not to assume anything. I do not assume that the engine worked, and I do not assume that it did not work. I do not assume that the gas mixture was fuel, and I do not assume that it was not fuel. However, what I glean from the hard-to-read patents is that in addition to the gas mixture, about whose ratio of constituent gasses Papp made a big deal, the electrodes that were used had an application of one or more radioactive elements on the surface (e.g., thorium). One possibility: the precise mixture of noble gasses was an intentional or unintentional red herring, and what really was happening was that the arc discharge between the electrodes induced decay in the radioactive element, resulting in prompt particles that ionized the working gas.
I do not recall Russ Gries ever pursuing the application to the electrodes of the kinds of radioactive elements that were mentioned in the patents, but it would have been nice if he had. (I doubt he has access to such things.)
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I understand. Making assumptions is how I try to think about things, it is not meant to be anything more than a construct to understand how it could work. your non-assumption regarding 'thorium' is the only way I thought it would be able to work if possible. The red herring I took away was that Russ G. proved that the gasses alone did not work. So to me, I resolved it enough to put it aside and move along.
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Axil,
I would like for this to work. I seek how it could work, then try to understand it. Some of my earlier assumptions had to be revisited then adjusted. As I learned... I was able to discriminate a bit and research a bit. Regarding Papp (for example) if a nuclear source was tried, I would assume that Bob Rohner would be at least aware of it and working that angle. You have mentioned SPP I have also looked at this, and continue to do so. It is still an open question for me. But for me it also matters not if something in theory could have worked, but did the experiment work and was it duplicated. We take this as common knowledge and for granted in chemistry. This has not been the case in our little corner of the alternate energy world. I think it is time for this to happen and that we need this discipline of repeatability and reproducibility of experiments here. Plainly speaking we need a win, and damn fast. I am a bit disheartened today sorry. I will be very happy when an experiment proves otherwise.
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QuoteIMHO, The Papp engine work through the reaction of nanoparticles just like all the other types of LENR devices. ... Both water and nobles gases can produce nanoparticles that host Surface Plasmon Polaritons. (SPP).
This is complete physical nonsense, which you haven't slightest evidence for.
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@Sherlock Holmes - we tried to move Papp to another thread. Forgetting for a minute both the sub and Feynman. Come up with a way the Papp engine could work and why it could never work. Whar your deduction b' whar?
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@Sherlock Holmes - we tried to move Papp to another thread. Forgetting for a minute both the sub and Feynman. Come up with a way the Papp engine could work and why it could never work. Whar your deduction b' whar?
Are you actuallly asking me why an engine that never existed could never work? Either you are a !!!!!!! or a surrealist.
@Sherlock Holmes I deduced that you have posted an insult and removed it. Be careful! Alan.
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Since I cannot express my sincere opinion of someone who believes in Papp's submarine, I'd rather shut up.
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Except that the Papp's engine doesn't differ so much from SunCell, Energoniva or Chernetski plasma generators.
After all, the LENR is just one step ahead of this esoteric stuff in the eyes of mainstream physicists.
We need thorough experiments and research for to decide the truth.
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@Sherlock Holmes said: "Since I cannot express my sincere opinion of someone who believes in Papp's submarine, I'd rather shut up."
Sherlock, maybe you misconstrued my meaning. Eric tried to move the you to the playground thread. It (playground) had my full reply try to read it. I will not denigrate you. Maybe you did not follow what we were both trying to get at regarding the Papp engine.
But first -- Papp absolutely did create an engine (that was proven by Feynman since he blew it up and got sued). My argument in the other thread was going to be that the engine did not work.
But this argument was related to the use of noble gasses. My quest was to see how possibly it could have worked. Eric Walker was kind enough to provide a reason. So it is clear the sub story is B.S. okay? Lets try again... (in the playground)
I do not have to believe in magic to enjoy a good show, but my interest is how a magician produces smoke and mirrors. I personally learn from how these scams work, it makes me more aware when I see one. So hopefully you do not get offended by my ignorance.
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My word of the day is ---- > aporia
an irresolvable internal contradiction or logical disjunction in a text, argument, or theory.
OR
'the expression of doubt.'
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Nice try, but Papp engine didn't utilize hydrogen - only rare gases
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One of my long-lasting 'esoteric research' group travelled to the West Coast 3-4 years ago to see Jimmy Sabori, Papp's old old sparring partner. He has ( he told my friend) Papps 'inert gas energising' apparatus in a workshop near his home, but wanted lots of money for it. I did have photos at one time, I should hunt them out.-
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VA-111_Shkval
VA-111 Shkval
Well, Axil, if he was able to build a supercavitating crew carrying submarine (orders of magnitude more difficult than a torpedo) in his garage, what a pity he did not develop an F-16 and get to France faster. I'm pretty sure the Air Force would have been more than happy to refuel him in exchange for the technology. But what am I saying? His magic engine needed no refueling...
It'd really sad that so much money was spent searching for the "Titanic". when finding Papp's sub would solve all the world's energy needs.
