IH preventing Rossi from publishing ERV, according to Dewey Weaver


    This type of paranoid fantasy is insane! What possible reason would IH have to sabotage the "customer" that they are supposedly supplying heat to?
    Never mind. It was rhetorical. I don't really want to know what scheme you'd come up with. You forget, at this point it's supposedly a partnership between Rossi and IH. If all goes well they manufacture E-Cats together and both make a lot of money. It's only if Rossi has nothing that it all goes sour.

    Edited once, last by Mark H ().

    Like 3
    Quote from Dewey Weaver

    Axil - Now let me get this straight. You say that IH has a strategy to starve Rossi out over legal expenses for litigation that Rossi filed against IH. Is that what you meant to post? That takes "Circular Argument Fabrication of the Week" right on the spot. It also knocks 10 IQ points off your running estimate. You don't have many points left to lose before you're right in the mean with the rest of Team Rossi.


    But so glad that it is happy happy joy time on Planet Rossi. Oh darn.....is that an asteroid alert going off?


    I am only going from what you said, the threats that you made toward Rossi. You were very aggressive. I must have misunderstood you. I guess after thinking about it, those threats were illogical. I did not get that illogic in those threats, sorry.


    Form now on, I will take what you say and remember that you are the passive party and Rossi is the aggressive one. It is Rossi who has the power and not IH, I understand now, it must have been the FUD that confused me.

    Para - I understand. Well, I guess we'll just have to reconfigure the stage and adjust some scripts then. Shouldn't be that much of a problem. Blu Skywalker is available - do we need him?

    Uh.....okay Axil - thanks for clearing that up. I'm going to give you back 5 IQ points on a conditional basis but remember, you're drifting dangerously low to the Team Rossi mean and any further setbacks would be devastating to your ongoing interplanetary cred.

    Quote from Jack Cole

    He has enough data to perform calculations and says it is consistent with values that Rossi has already released.


    With some assumptions on my part. For example, I doubt the pressure was actually 0.0 bar. I did not take all of the data at face value. If I did, I would agree with Rossi's conclusions. His numbers do add up.

    Quote from JedRothwell

    With some assumptions on my part. For example, I doubt the pressure was actually 0.0 bar. I did not take all of the data at face value. If I did, I would agree with Rossi's conclusions. His numbers do add up.


    Ok, so the problem is the error bars or Penon makes different assumptions?

    Quote from Abd Ul-Rahman Lomax

    At that time, he said he had private sources who had seen the Rossi reactor and that they were saying it was real. What we now know is that many saw it and many thought that. Jed trusted the competence of his sources, but Rossi was able to fool many competent experts.


    Those people claim that they did the tests in New York when Rossi was in Italy. They used their own instruments. They sent me some summary data and photos. It looks to me like ordinary HVAC style calorimetry.


    This is the one of the most disturbing aspect of the Rossi story. It makes me suspect he may have had real excess heat at some point. Perhaps he has forgotten how to make it. I have heard that he does not keep prototypes or notes, so he may have forgotten how to make a reactor type from years before. Jim Patterson had this problem.


    Quote from Abd Ul-Rahman Lomax

    Jed can tell the story, but Jed was about to fly to Italy, Rossi told him he would not be allowed to use any of his own instruments, and I think Jed bailed.


    I was never about to fly to Italy. The discussion did not get that far. I was about to fly to Greece to see Defkalion one time. A few hours before the flight they told me not to come. They revised the date twice, as I recall, and then cancelled. By that time I was pretty sure they were incompetent or fake. I did not know for sure until Gamberale published:


    http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/GamberaleLfinaltechn.pdf


    Quote from Abd Ul-Rahman Lomax

    In spite of how suspicious that was, he still believed that Rossi had a real technology.


    Well, I certainly expressed doubts from time to time.


    Quote from Abd Ul-Rahman Lomax

    disallowing Jed and others to do objective tests,
    He did that.


    He did that often, with many people, not just me.


    Quote from Abd Ul-Rahman Lomax

    Not to mention his past.
    Right, we won't mention his past, because that would not be nice, and we are nice. (Donald Trump pulled this trick in his campaign. "I would never call my opponent a complete bumbling incompetent idiot, because that would not be nice", or the like of that.)


    That's called praeteritio. See the video of Trump using the technique here: "Donald Trump’s Debate Strategy Is Stolen From 8-Year-Olds and Cicero . . . 'I’m not going to say it … '":


    http://www.slate.com/articles/…_praeteritio_is_also.html

    Quote from Jack Cole

    Ok, so the problem is the error bars or Penon makes different assumptions?


    it is a little hard to characterize the differences. I think the error bars are huge. I do not think Penon does. It is a little difficult for me to know what assumptions he is making because I am looking at only bare-bones conclusions.


    Here is an aspect of it which has come up in the discussion here. The pressure is shown at 0.0 bar. That makes no sense. That cannot be a vacuum and it seems equally improbable that it would only be 1 atm (gauge pressure). I think there has to be some pressure. I have seen steam generators of 20 kW and 60 kW. There is tremendous pressure in the pipes. Here is a 20 kW steam cleaner with a valve to regulate steam pressure from 0 to 150 psi (10.3 bar):


    http://www.amerivap.com/xtreme-steam-20kw.htm


    Let's take Rossi's description at face value, that the fluid is going through a heat exchanger, and it cools down from 103 deg C to 60 deg C. You have to force fluid through a heat exchanger or radiator. Granted, there is not a lot of pressure when you cool water from 50 down to 30 deg C. The pressure drop in that case is only 0.08 bar:


    http://www.enggcyclopedia.com/…ressure-drop-calculation/


    Cooling water or steam from ~103 deg C down to 60 deg C calls for more tubes and friction. Given the low starting temperature of the fluid, just above 100 deg C, with pressure in the pipe significantly above 1 atm, I think it is likely that little or no water boiled. It does not take much pressure to raise the boiling point:


    https://durathermfluids.com/pd…ressure-boiling-point.pdf


    Okay, that is a stretch. Maybe that is too much speculation by me. I don't like to speculate, but what can you do with 0.0 bar? Anyway, there are other reasons why I suspect the water was not all boiled. Plus I think the flow meter must have registered a number far too high, for various reasons. Sorry I cannot be more specific.


    Although it is very difficult for me to estimate what these numbers indicate, I think Penon's conclusions are wildly incorrect. The COP might be somewhat above 1, depending on pressure and other factors that I can only guess. The data is sketchy; it is not clear they even measured pressure. Your guess is as good as mine. While it is hard to estimate the COP, I do not see how it could be 50 times input.


    I am sure that an I.H. expert on site could make a few measurements with his own instruments and arrive at a much more accurate estimate of the heat balance. So I trust the I.H. experts who say the reactor was "inoperable." I also see what they mean about the instruments being flawed and unsuitable.

    Quote from sifferkoll

    You should listen to the Munger speech. I find that a number or misjudgements that clearly fits [so-and-so] like a glove, and those are only simple human misjudgements ... Then there are the malicious ones; he could very well be a professional cryptodenialist advocating a slower than possible LENR roll out for any number of reasons ... And finally; he could be contracted, even threatened, by the [redacted] hitmen, like [so-and-so] et al.


    http://www.sifferkoll.se/siffe…-dewey-fred-jed-together/

    I finally made it onto sifferkoll's blog! But he mispelled my name! Drat!


    He refers above to the Munger speech. He links to audio of it. However, a transcript is available. This is twenty years old. http://www.rbcpa.com/mungerspeech_june_95.pdf (the link says "pdf" but it is actually a doc file, apparently.)
    The Psychology of Human Misjudgement


    This kind of stuff is my bread and butter. I was intensively trained in transformative technology (fairly recently, 2011-2013), and what Munger covers is well-known, thoroughly studied, and the subject of training by experts. Many people involved in the training are management consultants, and very fun people to get to know. They talk a lot like Munger. (They are not at all the kind of management consultants Munger talks about. They are really trainers in individual and group transformation.)


    Now, here is something that should be obvious but often isn't. All this is useless and even dangerous when used to judge others. It is useful when one sees the described responses, correctly identified by Munger as survival responses, in oneself. People who are very smart often become quite good at seeing the errors of others -- or imagining them and fitting them into a logical framework that has, for them, high explanatory power. But that may miss that the road taken is headed off a cliff.


    Seeing these errors in others is useful in two ways: if we recognize that we are human beings, like others, and if others do a thing, we might become able to recognize these things in ourselves, and that is, in fact, how the early stages of the training I mention work. The Leader sets up a situation where a participant is on-stage, demonstrating confirmation bias in her own life, say, talking about her husband always being such a jerk, as an example. The Leader points it out the "story", then turns to the crowd. "And you all have a story that the problem isn't her husband, it's her!" At this point maybe half the crowd "pops." OMG! I do this all the time! That is, we make knee-jerk judgments based on far too little information, and these are about good and bad, right and wrong, like/dislike.


    No charge.


    The other way is in coaching, which generally requires an agreement from the person being trained to be 'coachable," which requires a certain level of trust. It is not an agreement to agree, but rather to try on ideas and see how the world looks through those glasses. Or no-glasses, as the best set of glasses, if one is ready for that.


    This is what Munger doesn't talk about. Maybe he knows it, maybe not. How do we know when we are operating out of these survival responses? Reason and logic don't help us, because, when these responses are at play, the reactive lizard brain is in charge and the massive association engine of the cerebral cortex is turned entirely to the service of survival and all the survival goals, which includes proving that one is right. The brain is designed that way. If the tiger is about to eat you, no time for reflection, careful thought, patience, detachment. You just act. Or you are dead.


    However, when we are not in immediate danger, the survival brain will, for most of us, continue to operate, trying to figure it all out. This is the sign: in the real of survival, one is never safe. Joy is fleeting or missing entirely. There is no unconditional love. One is unhappy. Very smart people will often be frustrated, since nobody really understands them. There is often fear, and then anger. If one fails, it is caused by enemies, or conditions beyond one's control. The most noticeable sign would be the body states of fear. The voice becomes a whine, of complaint, when one tries to explain what is happening. The theme becomes, "Something is happening and it's Bad."


    These are signs that one is operating in the realm of survival, where there is no safety or peace. Hearing this, the survival brain will argue: but they really are out to get me! Or I'm really right! Or any of many survival responses. Yes, if they are really out to get you, act! But if you are carrying this around with you, you are caught in a trap that will ruin your life. Most worrisome, the survival brain is not all that smart. It can be downright stupid, even if the person, when calm and detached, could be a world-class genius. Faced with an actual battle, I'd bet on the martial artist who is trained to not react, to let go of any fear immediately, to detach. Classic judo. The master watches as the person tries to attack him, steps out of the way, the attacker hits a wall and hurts himself, and the master walks away, a bit sad that someone would hurt themselves like that. Not angry.


    I the training, I was totally busted. I was right -- and I actually was right! -- but because my survival responses were activated, I was a basket case. I did exactly the wrong thing, confused. It took me several hours to realize what had happened and nothing has been the same since. It had nothing to do with being right or wrong, it was about the state of mind I was in. Shift the state of mind, I immediately became able -- in person -- to communicate successfully with large numbers of people. Part of that was that I was no longer convinced that they were wrong and would not understand me. (Even if they were wrong! -- or, more accurately, as I learned to say it, something was missing in their thinking). Rather, I would, now, speak for them, keeping contact with them, creating the pleasure of recognition. It;s really fun. I was a performer, years ago. What a blast!


    So, if one recognizes the signs, what to do? You can spend thousands of dollars in training (which could be very well spent, though I paid much less than that), or you can simply start to learn. The techniques are available, once one recognizes the value and starts looking for them.

    Note that steam heat exchangers have a lower pressure drop than water heat exchangers. In other words, they have less friction. However, assuming Rossi's description is accurate, this has to be a condenser as well as an exchanger. The fluid comes back as water which has cooled down to a remarkable extent, down to 60 deg C.


    I apologize for these rather vague assertions. I try not to reveal anything Rossi or I.H. have not already disclosed.

    Quote from JedRothwell

    Abd Ul-Rahman Lomax wrote:
    At that time, he said he had private sources who had seen the Rossi reactor and that they were saying it was real. What we now know is that many saw it and many thought that. Jed trusted the competence of his sources, but Rossi was able to fool many competent experts.


    Those people claim that they did the tests in New York when Rossi was in Italy. They used their own instruments. They sent me some summary data and photos. It looks to me like ordinary HVAC style calorimetry.


    This is the one of the most disturbing aspect of the Rossi story. It makes me suspect he may have had real excess heat at some point. Perhaps he has forgotten how to make it. I have heard that he does not keep prototypes or notes, so he may have forgotten how to make a reactor type from years before. Jim Patterson had this problem.

    Right. My comment at the time was that collectively we could not count on that. It was unattributed rumor. I believed you had seen this, though you have now given a little more detail. Save those documents! Why was this never published? (That is a question, not a declaration of suspicion or anything like that.) I've been asked to sign one NDA, and it was limited in duration. I think it was five years.


    I consider the possibility of what Jed suspects to be real, and it remains possible that any particular claim from Rossi is real. With IH, what appears is that he did not succeed in transferring the IP.


    As to that test, much would depend on details not disclosed. I have often pointed to the appearance that Rossi had something. If that was a truly independent test, as claimed, the probability of that goes up. That Rossi had IP and did not transfer it would not be surprising at all. That would come from lack of trust.

    Quote from axil

    The starve Rossi out strategy that IH is employing to empty Rossi's bank account via legal expenses is now negated by the cordial connections between Rossi and his new partner who will stand shoulder to shoulder through thick and thin with Rossi in any conflict with IH. Its obvious, IH is going to lose money big time via top of the line legal fees to their world's most renowned and expensive law firm in any protracted legal battle with Rossi. Under the shade of his new partner's protective wing, Rossi sees nothing but blue skies ahead just like the blue light coming from his tiny new reactor.

    Ironic, indeed. Rossi sues IH, alleging the kitchen sink (fraud, triple damages), suing not only IH and IHP, but also Darden and Vaughn personally, and then Cherokee, and then Axil comes up with his own fantasy, in which this is a "strategy" to starve Rossi out. No, it's called a legal defense. And IH doesn't mess around. Didn't Rossi realize that? What did he expect them to do, not defend against the suit? Hire some cheap Florida lawyer? Make this into a Fair Fight, their Florida lawyer just as incompetent as Rossi's?


    Now, perhaps Rossi does have new partners. We do not actually know that. However, Axil imagines that they will be totally happy to pay all these legal expenses for Rossi. After all, the IP is worth billions!


    Wait! Is it true that IH tried to use Rossi IP and it didn't work? Why would this history not repeat? Because they are Swedes and nobody ever fools and then betrays Swedes? I would think that, before investing so much, they would want to know What Actually Happened. Rossi is not likely to raise large sums in advance again. He's not going to get another $10 million based on his innocent face.


    Quark-X? Great! Send me some devices I can test myself! Give me full instructions. Yes, of course I'll sign an NDA! When can I expect the devices/


    Oh, you want payment? how much? $10 million for ten devices, in advance? I'll get back to you.

    Strong Para - as long as we're dealing with purity, renewal, scale AND resonance then I just feel like we're all going to be okay. Now that you bring it up, who was it on Planet Rossi that wrote "I'm okay, I'm okay"?


    There must be a self-help convention on the home rock today.

    Quote from Abd Ul-Rahman Lomax

    Why was this never published? (That is a question, not a declaration of suspicion or anything like that.)


    I don't know why. I have asked them for permission to distribute this but they say no.


    I try not to make a pest of myself. When authors say "no" I seldom ask them to reconsider. I have to be nice to authors. It is hard enough to get people to send papers for LENR-CANR.org. If I started uploading without permission, sending stuff out secretly, or badgering people for information I would soon get a lot less stuff.

    There are some techniques that may be used to delay entry of a judgment against a client even if the client is clearly in the wrong. These techniques are constrained by the costs necessary to engage in prolonged litigation, ethical limits placed on attorneys and the fact that some of the more aggressive techniques can backfire on a defendant. IH has a lot of money so the shy is the limit on delay tactics.


    I. PREEMPTIVE LAWSUIT


    I expect this from IH involving the IP dispute.


    II. AVOIDING SERVICE OF PROCESS


    This is not applicable to the IH strategy.


    III. MOTION TO CHANGE FORUM OR VENUE
    A plaintiff chooses the place where a lawsuit is filed. The defendant may seek to change the venue or forum where the case will be tried. This can include removing a case from state to federal court or filing a motion to change venue from one jurisdiction to another.


    IH may attempt to change the venue to North Carolina.


    IV. MOTION TO DISMISS COMPLAINT
    The next step a defendant can take is to file a motion to dismiss a complaint for failure to state a claim. The defendant is not required to file an answer to the complaint until the court rules on the motion to dismiss. If a plaintiff is not expecting much resistance the complaint may be defective and the plaintiff may be required to redraft the complaint. The defendant can still file a motion to dismiss the newly amended complaint as well.


    IH has done this already.


    V. ANSWERING THE COMPLAINT
    The defendant will eventually have to answer the complaint. At this point the defendant needs to come up with some element in the plaintiff’s answer that can be disputed. This is a rich area of delay for IH.


    VI. DISCOVERY
    An aggressive litigant can use the discovery process to extend litigation. Far reaching discovery can require an opposing party to have to continually produce further information. The more important key is that a party can use outstanding discovery as a basis for postponing any attempts by a party to obtain summary judgment.


    VII. BANKRUPTCY
    Under some circumstances a litigant can seek temporary stay of litigation in bankruptcy court. If the case is going against IH, they will go into bankruptcy.


    VIII. TRIAL
    If a defendant can survive summary judgment, a jury trial can be unpredictable. Most attorneys only handle a few trials so it is always possible that a witness will not be prepared and the jury will have a reason to rule in your favor.


    IX APPEALS
    A judgment may be stayed during an appeal. This typically requires the posting of a bond or other security.


    IX. REALITY CHECK
    This information provides just a gloss of issues a defendant can raise to extend litigation. However, in the majority of cases it is simply not feasible to launch a scorched earth litigation strategy.


    Experts


    If you have a case where expert witnesses will be involved, one dirty trick is to find all of the best experts in your area and retain them as consultants. When the other side goes looking for that expert to help with their case, they will find them already retained and unavailable. Some like to announce multiple experts will be testifying, even though only one or two will actually testify. This can create a lot of camouflage, but can also backfire since every expert suddenly becomes subject to deposition and the associated time and expense that goes with that. It is also not uncommon to hold off on announcing an expert until the last possible moment in order to keep the other side from gaining any insights into your case until it is too late to make significant adjustments.


    Rossi's attorneys will be required to counter each of these endless march of experts.

    First, the litigation costs are very high to pursue such a strategy. Most defendants cannot justify paying huge legal bills to delay in inevitable judgment, but IH can until they declare bankruptcy.

    Second, there are limits on what an attorney can do. An attorney has to sign any pleading filed in court verifying that there is a good faith basis in law and fact to support the pleading or action. In some cases an attorney will not be able to pursue every single motion and every single objection if there is simply no good faith ability to raise such a defense, but the IG law firm will pull out all the stops, good faith be dammed.

    Edited once, last by axil ().

    Like 3
    Quote from Dewey Weaver

    Now that you bring it up, who was it on Planet Rossi that wrote "I'm okay, I'm okay"?


    I have no idea what that refers to.


    However, next to Getting Away is Great Power.
    Thunder above
    Heaven below
    Steadiness is profitable.
    6. The goat butts up against the hedge so that he cannot retreat or advance. Nothing will be profitable. Difficulty, but ultimate good luck.
    5. Losing the goat easily, with no regret.

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