What are you talking about?!? Where and how have they made $50 million "disappear?" They got a $50 million investment, but they have not spent it. It has not disappeared. It is in their bank account. They are using it to fund cold fusion research other than Rossi's, so it will be used up eventually.
You say many strange, senseless things because you are in the thrall of Rossi.
It was the test that produced the 50 million, not the other projects. Do you suggest bait and switch?
Quote from "JedRothwell"Unless you have $11 million you want to contribute to research, I suggest you stop making this inane comment. I know dozens of researcher who worked with practically no funding for decades, grew old, and died. They accomplished little, because they did not have the money. Decades of hard work by dedicated scientists came to nothing, for lack of money.
And you think that's funny. Just hilarious. Oh so very funny, let's make joke about it, hey, what's $11 million -- a trivial sum. Yeah? It is far more than most people earn in a lifetime.
You are disgusting.
Dude, I don't work for your Military-Industrial Complex which is the elephant in the room, so it's not me you have to be angry at. And yes, $11 million is a trivial R&D sum for such an energy production device. Do you know that routinely there are video games with up to fifteen times that budget? Let that sink in for a minute.
Ask yourself why this proven effect never got serious funding?
It was the test that produced the 50 million, not the other projects.
First, you do not know it was the test. That seems unlikely to me, because -- as I mentioned -- I.H. told me they were not happy with the test, so I doubt they would fail to tell an investor.
Second, whatever they used to get the money, the money has not disappeared, which is what you claimed. It is still there. It has not been spent yet. If the investor decides I.H. got it on false pretenses, he can probably cancel the agreement and get it back.
So, your statement about "disappear" is nonsense. You assertion about how they got the money is baseless speculation, and wrong on the face of it.
You need to step away from the Rossi Distortion Field house of mirrors. It infects everything you say, and make you babble nonsense about every subject that comes up.
Display More
First, you do not know it was the test. That seems unlikely to me, because -- as I mentioned -- I.H. told me they were not happy with the test, so I doubt they would fail to tell an investor.
Second, whatever they used to get the money, the money has not disappeared, which is what you claimed. It is still there. It has not been spent yet. If the investor decides I.H. got it on false pretenses, he can probably cancel the agreement and get it back.
So, your statement about "disappear" is nonsense. You assertion about how they got the money is baseless speculation, and wrong on the face of it.
You need to step away from the Rossi Distortion Field house of mirrors. It infects everything you say, and make you babble nonsense about every subject that comes up.
First, You don't and can't know it was't.
MITCHELL FRASER-JONES
AUTHOR says:
September 30, 2015 at 9:34 am
Hi Alain,
It would be inappropriate for us to share our due diligence, but please be reassured that this investment is the result of a long and rigorous process.
Kind regards
Mitch
Second, Rossi's money has not disappeared. It will be used for massive production.
It would be inappropriate for us to share our due diligence, but please be reassured that this investment is the result of a long and rigorous process.
That does not say anything about "we were convinced by Rossi." It does not even hint that.
Second, Rossi's money has not disappeared. It will be used for massive production.
Massive production = real estate in Florida
Yah, sure.
Ask yourself why this proven effect never got serious funding?
I don't have to ask myself. I know why. I was there nearly every step of the way. I knew every major cold fusion researcher, living or dead, and most of the minor ones too, plus I know most of the prominent opponents.
I also know that it will be even harder to get funding if the Rossi story gets blown up in the mass media.
Should Rossi be the fraud you so vehemently describe he is, do you think his scam will matter much, as more and more replications are popping up all over the world?
If not him, someone is soon going to present something that works at an industrial level, and then do you think funding will be shy?
Display MoreFirst, You don't and can't know it was't.
MITCHELL FRASER-JONES
AUTHOR says:
September 30, 2015 at 9:34 am
Hi Alain,
It would be inappropriate for us to share our due diligence, but please be reassured that this investment is the result of a long and rigorous process.
Kind regards
Mitch
Second, Rossi's money has not disappeared. It will be used for massive production.
Rossi's investors money funded his collection of homes he bought around Florida right after he got paid....
It blows my mind that some here cannot see this whole situation from the outside. Brilliant people have been working for decades to make LENR a viable technology...the closest anyone has gotten is anomalous indicators of some excess heat, but far from anything controllable or sufficient for an actual usable device. Then enter the good doctor...while everyone else works to just find a spark...Rossi not only figured out the magic to do this, but to a level of selling 1MW plants!! How can intelligent minds not see the divide here???? Scientists and engineers around the world cannot get LENR past experimentation...yet the brilliant Rossi has taken it SO far past all others that he even has products on the market. And now the newest unicorn sprinkled in faerey dust...a 1mm tube that can make heat, light, electricity and thrust...what a fantasy!!!! Wake up people....seriously wake up!
It blows my mind . . . Wake up people....seriously wake up!
While it is tempting to distill life down to an anecdote, i.e., something simple and black and white, aka Mary Yugo style, the fact is that life is usually more nuanced. This is not a clear cut "wake up people" type of situation. It is highly complex--probably the most complex situation within LENR's history, and perhaps the most complex in all of the "free energy" genre of all time. You have, on the one hand, renown scientists vouching for the anomalous nature of Rossi's invention, while at the same time a group of investors clamoring that it cannot be substantiated, even after having apparently substantiating it. Throw in the mix the probable astroturfing taking place, and you have one big confusing mess.
I lean Rossi over IH in this dispute because of the blatant inconsistencies coming from the likes of Dewey, but I am not entirely sure about anything. New facts and new evidence can persuade me. We should all keep an open mind.
Quote from "Jed"First, you do not know it was the test. That seems unlikely to me, because -- as I mentioned -- I.H. told me they were not happy with the test, so I doubt they would fail to tell an investor.
...
Second, whatever they used to get the money, the money has not disappeared, which is what you claimed. It is still there.
...
I knew every major cold fusion researcher, living or dead, and most of the minor ones too, plus I know most of the prominent opponents.
I think this sums up Jed nicely. Jed was the hero, who knew everyone. Then IH came along and funded some of his close friends (the angry LENR entities being ex; Brilloiun, Lenuco, Letts, Biberian, etc etc.) with peanut cash and a lot of toilet paper IH stock on the promise that IH would supply them with Rossi IP thru the back door, so thay could make leaps in R&D. This turned out to be a bad strategy since Rossi did not "behave" as planned ...
IH came along and funded some of his close friends (the angry LENR entities being ex; Brilloiun, Lenuco, Letts, Biberian, etc etc.) with peanut cash and a lot of toilet paper IH stock on the promise that IH would supply them with Rossi IP thru the back door, so thay could make leaps in R&D.
Sifferkol, whether or not this conjecture is true, it seems you stil haven't understood that IH bought exclusive rights to Rossi's IP including the right to sub-license it to whomever they chose.
Rossi did not "behave" as planned ...
Exactly! Rossi did not transfer the IP as he was contractually bound to do. Maybe IH will make some counterclaims ....
While it is tempting to distill life down to an anecdote, i.e., something simple and black and white, aka Mary Yugo style, the fact is that life is usually more nuanced. This is not a clear cut "wake up people" type of situation. It is highly complex--probably the most complex situation within LENR's history, and perhaps the most complex in all of the "free energy" genre of all time. You have, on the one hand, renown scientists vouching for the anomalous nature of Rossi's invention, while at the same time a group of investors clamoring that it cannot be substantiated, even after having apparently substantiating it. Throw in the mix the probable astroturfing taking place, and you have one big confusing mess.
I lean Rossi over IH in this dispute because of the blatant inconsistencies coming from the likes of Dewey, but I am not entirely sure about anything. New facts and new evidence can persuade me. We should all keep an open mind.
I agree one should not distill it down as such, which is why I am looking at all of it as a whole. You have a rogue inventor with papermill degree who has had a questionable past at best (arguably fraudulent ex-convict past at worst) who not only figures out the magic to a world changing technology that no other scientist or engineer on the face of the earth has come close to (short of anomalous results) but also is able to develop it to a level that it outputs ~50COP...and now his newest iteration provides everything from heat to electricity to light to thrust. All of this without being able to really prove it outside of questionable odd secretive situations for years and years and years. At some point one has to say....this is just unreasonable. Every thing about Rossi and the E-Cat always has to be explained with an outlandish answer...when you look at it from the outside it really is madness to continue to believe Rossi has what he says. The Steorn Orbo is another perfect example....I will admit I was fooled by Shaun for quite a while back in the early days of Steorn...but you have to be a complete idiot in 2016 to still believe his lies and shenanigans....to the tune of like $28 million at this point. I just don't see how brilliant minds can still be fooled by Rossi at this point short of pure hope and faith.
Quote from "Hermes"Exactly! Rossi did not transfer the IP as he was contractually bound to do. Maybe IH will make some counterclaims ....
We don't know about that, do we?
The "behave as planned" is I guess more about that IH did not expect to be sued. The expected Rossi to continue to work en a NDA leash. And IH did certainly not expect the new independent quarkX tech to surface.
IH was outpaced by Rossi, they probably have the IP, but not the skillset on a personal level. They planned to use skillset of the other LENR folks they were making promises to (Jeds friends) paying peanuts, to replicate. But I guess they found some issues whan trying to get Rossi himself to handhold Miley, Brillouin, Letts, Cole, Biberian or whomever that really are skilled in the art through the process
They planned to use skillset of the other LENR folks they were making promises to (Jeds friends) paying peanuts, to replicate.
Did anybody ever check how many employees (not contractors.. or paid spin's) IH has on their payroll??
Is it more than one, the named captain?
Venture capitalist usually let the others work. They have only one interest: Factor in a huge margin (100-800%).
Thus it is difficult to talk about IH as a company, which is really dooing what the name pretends.
Wyttenbach
Can't find anything on 'employees'.
Best regards
Frank
IH did not expect to be sued
Of course not! Nobody expects to get sued when there is no cause. Abd has explained in detail why.
But I dare say when IH were unhappy about the IP not being transferred, Rossi threw one of his all too frequent tantrums so they were forwarned that trouble lay ahead. Consequently they started collected evidence including, as Dewey says, by arriving unexpectedly to find Rossi tampering with the flow meter. What a coincidence! Not surprisingly, nobody from planet Rossi comments on this. Fantasy is so much more comforting than facts.
We don't know about that, do we?
Just because you may not have knowledge does not mean that the rest of the world is entirely ignorant. You seem to be claiming, "not to know" if IH will make counterclaims. But you DO know that IH has not paid the $89M. Don't you think there might be a legitimate reason for this? Or do you believe that IH never intended to pay Rossi at all? If so, do you have any evidence? I note from the legal action that Rossi has presented no evidence. But maybe you know better.
I just don't see how brilliant minds can still be fooled by Rossi at this point short of pure hope and faith.
And therein lies the enigma of Andrea Rossi, and one of the things that keeps me engaged. I'm pretty certain that all of those participating in this forum are uncertain. That is why we are here.
Quote from "Hermes"Just because you may not have knowledge does not mean that the rest of the world is entirely ignorant. You seem to be claiming, "not to know" if IH will make counterclaims. But you DO know that IH has not paid the $89M. Don't you think there might be a legitimate reason for this? Or do you believe that IH never intended to pay Rossi at all? If so, do you have any evidence? I note from the legal action that Rossi has presented no evidence. But maybe you know better.
What are you talking about?
We do know that Rossi has sued IH? But we do not know yet if IH has any counterclaims. They have only issued very vague statements, no claims (well except for Dewey tantrums, but those doesn't really count, since he was psychologically instable...) And Dewey was even thrown out by IH engineer Barker he told himself, due to probably running around the lab breaking stuff...
If at some point they "Failed" it must mean that at some other point they were "Working" ... ?
Jed ... You mentioned that Rossi is a thief and "stole" 10 million dollars from IH ... How could this be true at all if the reactors were working at some point and IH tested them and agreed they were working? .... Just trying to understand your logic better.
