Florida Boiler Safety Section information

Hi all

In reply to Jed:

So once again you have reversed your position on what you said. Good that you admit when you are wrong.

Getting to be a bit of a habit though Jed, it diminishes you as a source, or is someone feeding you false reports?

I understand that you have been taking reports from IH's lawyers and IH employees, is this the standard of the things they tell you?

Do you think the spin, you are putting on your admitting you got it wrong, improves your standing in the community?

Or could it be perhaps that my pointing out this would inevitably lead to the ERV being made public, scared IH and perhaps yourself off?

Kind Regards walker

"If you have been in factories you will have seen state inspection certificates next to all types of heavy machinery, and boilers, vehicles, fork lifts, elevators, etc. No one in the first world is allowed to run a factory without safety inspections, thank goodness."

This is true for things that are sold for routine commercial use....NOT research and development site and equipment. I worked in R&D for one of the world's largest chemical firms for 20+ years (and was in and out of the "factories" (we called'em "plants") on a daily basis). No R&D would have ever happened if the level of inspection you think necessary actually had been. Pilot plants were built and operated, both inside the R&D facility and sometimes inside the producing factories/plants. For those areas and devices, the company was "self-insured", and the workers understood that extra precautions in operation were required because the special equipment was not "safety inspected and certified" by any external authority. Note though that all the fork lifts and other equipment used on the plant site "were" inspected and certified because they were .

To give you a "for instance" that "might" apply to the IH/Rossi/customer situation. "If" the customer's reactor (an R&D device, even though based on a commercial process) took in energy only as steam, their site would have needed a commercial boiler to provide the steam during times of "E-cat down" operation. That boiler would have been subject to all the inspections and certifications you suggest. "If" the reactor was designed to accept heat from electrical heat in addition to steam, such heaters would have been built into the R&D device, and NOT subject to those things. And of course, the E-cat itself is (or are), at this stage, R&D devices NOT so certified (as Rossi properly points out over and over).

Don't get me wrong....I am all in favor of safety (in those R&D situations, it was still my ass on the line, so you can bet I took all the extra precautions, and participated in all the safety design reviews that went on before any of those gizmos cranked up. And despite all of that, one incident came close to "getting me".)

Things are not quite as "cut and dried" as you think....there "are" legal exceptions.

Hi all

I refer to your position that Rossi could be accused of breaking a Florida regulation of boilers.

Why did you raise the issue as if it some importance when clearly as you now admit it was not a matter of any significance?

Is it that you do not understand Florida laws and regulations on boilers?

Kind Regards walker

What I am talking about is INDUSTRIAL R&D, not university labs. Those are two totally different situations/systems, and different rule sets apply. University R&D labs are inhabited by ignorant and inexperienced grad students (I know, 'cause I was one of them for a few years). Industrial R&D labs are run and manned by professionals with many years experience per man/topic. The area of classification that applies to the Rossi/IH system is "industrial R&D". I can only tell you what I directly observed by working for 20+ years in an Industrial R&D environment. Things there don't work like you apparently think they do.

Note that Rossi's entire career has been largely spent in the industrial R&D milieu, first in his own process, and then R&D projects done for others.

Quote from Mary Yugo

I suppose that excludes the considerable time that Rossi spent in prison? And the time he spent not testing his thermoelectric devices at the University of New Hampshire?

Actually Krivit characterized Rossi's "factory" as a large mostly vacant building bereft of any significant machine shop tools, electronics or anything remotely precise. The original ecat was housed in a small room of this building. The original precision toolkit used by a 90+ year old plumber friend of Rossi's to construct the original ecats is this (thanks to Krivit for the photo):

http://newenergytimes.com/v2/s…-E-Cat-Plumbers-Tools.JPG

Rossi's lab has never looked like much more than a hobbyist's home lab from a technical point of view, a million miles from that which you would expect from a multi-million dollar funded research setup. From an electronics standpoint, I am quite sure my own personal home lab is more advanced than what we have seen. I have also always found amusement in his using old shelving rails to test the invention of the century...too funny! I really love the plumbers bag...one would guess Rossi is doing working on an awesome grade-school science fair project or possibly some low-level home repair from his impressive setup of magnificence...lol.

"Yes, I know. Florida has different regs for them, as I noted. But there are regs for everyone. No one gets to operate heavy equipment without inspections and oversight. Not in the first world, in the 21st century. "

Please point out specifics as to exactly what covers industrial R&D in your postings, because I apparently missed seeing them. The point about industrial R&D is that there is no one better qualified to certify the plant than the ones that designed it in the first place. There ARE no other qualified experts to do the certification. Commercial equipment used in the system may indeed be inspected and certified, but the overall plant......no. Who certifies the tokamak prototype?? Who certifies the CERN accelerator?? So yes, some VERY "heavy equipment gets built and operated "without inspections and oversight".

"Mary"......I would appreciate it if you would cease to post to me. I have no interest in interaction of any sort with you.

"Tons of agencies do, I am sure. "

Translation...."I don't know". You are making assumptions. My twenty years experience says you are wrong. Yes....individual devices sold commercially and installed will have been inspected and certified, but that typically happens before it leaves the manufacturers site. There probably was an electrical inspection, and a visit from the fire marshal or his rep, but these would be done before plant startup. And the electrical inspection will only look at the wiring/boxes, etc. and whether or not they are "up to code".

Industrial R&D is done differently. And until you can come up with a concrete regulation, I have to go with what I SAW to be the case while actually DOING industrial R&D.

Whether you like it or not, there is a large degree of "self-certification" in R&D. I have participated in MANY safety reviews for pilot operations, and they are far more thorough than anything a bureaucrat is likely to do.

Hi all

So you cannot find a cause to report Rossi Jed. Rossi should patent you with all the hot air you blow.

I realy thought you and IH had found a way to leak the ERV. Have a real good try, in fact why not just do it spec anyway, unless of course you do not want any one to see the ERV?

Now why would you do that Jed?

Kind Regards walker

Hi all

So Jed if you know so much about the ERV report and the plant why dont you post it up... Unless of course you are just making this all up in your own head..?

Kind Regards walker