IH considering counterclaims

Not a joke at all Jed. A best guess. Or perhaps an out of work bit part actor Rossi hired. Talking about evidence, have any that the guy was a "NATO colonel" whatever that is? There is no such thing as military rank in NATO. You of course have rank in your own military but it is not a NATO rank. Last I looked anyway.

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Asking this about an insect is like asking is cold fusion energy 'mechanical' 'chemical' or 'biological'?I'm not surprised you are confused.

No Frank. Insects are a CLASS of invertebrate ANIMALS. Your ignorance of second grade, elementary school biology and naming is appalling. A six year old should know that.

Frank earlier wrote:

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A cockroach is an insect Mary not an animal. But then why should we be concerned with facts?

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A few other things Rossi may have going for him, is the so far uncontested validation test (VT), Rossi's comment on his JONP dated 8 July 2013, that his "partner" had built an Ecat from scratch, bought and mixed the fuel, fired that beast up, and it ran as advertised.

As I am certain IH can prove if called on to do so, that is pure Rossifiction. It never happened, at least the part about running as advertised, and nobody from IH or Woodford has ever said the slightest thing to the contrary. If they did and I missed it, please provide the link or quote where anyone from those companies or Darden or Vaughn says the ecat was tested by them and worked as advertised.

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You disempower yourself if you believe that. LENR languished because of lack of attention, not hostile attention. Big business would want to control LENR, that would be normal. Suppressing it will move it out of control blahblahblah iraqiinformationminister.gif

Yes yes we know all about that

Eugene Mallove?

My point is, Frank, that IH will crush Rossi like a bug. And the thread had turned to mention of animals for some reason. Abd told a raccoon story. And if you write with confidence something like "insects are not animals", how do we know you are not as ignorant of physics as you are of biology?

By the way, remember this blast from the past?

http://www.e-catworld.com/2011…-of-sales/comment-page-1/

How's all those sold megawatt plant in 2011 and the exponential growth of sales working for ya now? Maybe there was a BUG in the process? An insect maybe?

@Walker

I am not sure why the ERV report matters unless it has enough info to uncover glaring flaws. If it seems to show the plant worked, how would anyone know the data were properly collected and were real? The only reason Rossi was able to continue his farce so long was that people believed him at face value. Are you suggesting that they do the same now? And Rossi and IH say opposing things. Why believe one over the other?

Thanks for the subject header, Wyttenbach. I did not know that you held me in such high regard. I must deny the honor. Because I stated something indicates I think it is true or as I state, but is not any proof of absolute truth. I don't even believe in absolute truth on the level of statements.

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Abd Ul-Rahman Lomax wrote:

Putting this in red, Wytt seems to think that this is some big admission. IH made some reactors. That means boxes with some stuff in them. Rossi used them. The looked much nicer than his old foil-wrapped thingies.

How Rossi used them is unclear. This is not an acknowledgement that IH made "working reactors," only that they might be made to "work" under careful and thorough Rossi supervision and control. The hat factory does not make rabbits be pulled out of hats. The magician does that with the hat someone made. The hat might or might not contain special features for the trick. Some magicians will use an ordinary hat and the deception or misdirection is somewhere else. There are millions of possible methods.

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The great ABD states it and now it must be true... IH did build the reactor something abd denied for a very, very long time...Claiming Rossi...

Wyttenbach does not point to an alleged claim. However, it's certainly possible that I said things about the 1 MW reactor before that were incorrect. However, one of the issues that comes up in the lawsuit is exactly what is this 1 MW reactor. Originally, it was a collection of devices built by Rossi, and the 1 MW test contemplated testing his devices. Then that changed, and this is all rather obscure, it's an issue in the lawsuit.

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I believe, here, it would have been the right point for ABD to stop any FUD-eration of this forum...

Planet Rossi seems desperate to shut me up. I'm honored.

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To sum it up: Three out of four points missed - not dissmissed (as predicted by abd) by the court...

Lovely. Nobody else made any predictions except that Planet Rossi, in general, predicted that the judge would, of course, reject the Motion entirely, and was Wytte one of those who claimed that the judge had already rejected all elements of the motion? Before she did?

Let's see. There were eight counts, I predicted an outcome for all eight. I was correct on five. that is, I predicted seven dismissals and one count remaining. That count remained (and I understood why and had explained it: estoppel, while Sifferkoll was screaming that this was all FUD).

You can make my results look worse than an objective consideration, by only looking at where I was "wrong." I was incorrect in three predictions. Of the predictions where I was wrong, I missed 100%! Wytte looks at the four dismissals. Wait, I predicted 100% of those. No, he is looking at what was not dismissed. Of what was not dismissed, I was correct on one and incorrect on three. When I was young, I read a book, How to lie with statistics. Great book. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_to_Lie_with_Statistics

However, nobody would look at a test score like that. I predicted eight and was correct on five. My point is? Why am I belaboring the obvious?

Because part of my point and interest is how communities function and don't function, and argument for the sake of argument, attempting to make others look bad, with no informational value, is community dysfunction. Wytte and others have repeated this mishegas about my alleged poor record several times. I did miss three out of eight, not four. And I know exactly why, and it is not good news for Rossi. And I've explained that many times.

At this point I predict later Motions for Summary Judgement. How far that will go, I want to see the IH Answer first. I know of one point where it is practically a slam dunk, my opinion, though my attorney friend says there is no such thing in court, outcomes can be quirky.

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Was it up to Rossi to prove that the IH built reators did work as the investors hoped? -- There was no such condition in the contract...

If Wytte were to read carefully, he'd see that I know that. This involves equitable interpretation of the contract, just as does estoppel, which allowed Count 1 to stand. Estoppel may or may not survive the light of additional evidence.

Planet Rossi has been assuming that everything Rossi has said in his Complaint and elsewhere is true, and the judge for the Motion was constrained to assume that, as to whatever was in the Complaint.

So what happens when IH has had their say, and gives their Answer? What is normal is that there will then be facts to be determined. However, just as uncontroverted allegations in the Complaint had to be assumed as true, uncontroverted allegations in the Answer, at a certain point, will be treated the same way. Discovery will reveal what is actually in controversy. Whether or not IH is a 'wholly-owned subsidiary" of Cherokee is a fairly simple fact to establish, and once that this established, will Annesser try to challenge it? What evidence will be asserted? In the Complaint, it was entirely Rossi's word. Summary Judgement, however, will look at a fuller factual record and not at the Complaint and Answer alone.

Rossi is going to have a devil of a time alleging plausible evidence that Cherokee was the "sole owner" of IH at any point. So I predict that Cherokee will vanish as a codefendant before this goes to trial.

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Investors like a golden fleshiy pig, which allows to multiply the investment ASAP.

Those are normal investors. All signs are that IH is not that. Normal investors would not have touched Rossi with a ten-foot pole.

Woodford is not expecting any return, my guess. It is almost as if this were a charitable donation, but not quite. It is possible that the IH process will pick up IP that could lead to profit. Or not. This is extremely risky, long-term investment, now that it's fairly clear that Rossi's reactors are dead, or, at least, must be assumed to be that until there is independent confirmation. Rossi had his chance, for three years, to create or allow independent confirmation. It apparently did not happen. And that is what court process will show, and will show it, I predict, clearly.

That is not a "fact." It is an opinion, an assessment, based on my overall impression of the evidence I have seen. As this case develops, there will be more evidence.

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In the mean time, I guess, IH (international, pirate island Trust etc..) catched a other golden fleshy fish...

Now they pay a lot of money to get rid of a less promizing investment. Not less and not more. Anyway it was a stupid/risky idea to pay 100Million for a COP of 6.

Conclusion: IH paid Rossi as FORD did it for half a century: Paying for suppressing an idea and hinder the market. This is the US way of self-castration...in favour of the one big, fat Elefant!

Smart people make inventions, make products, make friends, and make money, and laugh a lot. Stupid people roll around in dead fish and complain about how stupid the world is.

Shane, I don't care what you believe. You can be as gullible as you wish. But giving Rossi even a 1% chance at this point is extremely funny. Sure, he may have proof for all we know. For all we know, he may even have flying pigs. Animals they are.

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Anyway it was a stupid/risky idea to pay 100Million for a COP of 6.

No it would not be. It would be brilliant. Such a find would be worth billions if Rossi really made any significant amount of power from LENR with any appreciable COP at all . A COP of 6 would be perfect for space heaters and the world market would be almost immediate and in the hundreds of millions of units.

The stupid/risky part was signing ANY contract and giving Rossi ANY money based on the flimsy evidence Darden and Vaughn had from the Swedish professors and Levi and Lewan. Of course, I can't be sure they didn't have more. But what is very clear is that they never commissioned any well performed, well calibrated, truly independent tests of any ecat technology. If they had, they would have dumped Rossi without paying him one centime. Paying and contracting without absolutely sound and correct tests and several completely separate and reliable experts was how IH managed to waste more than $10M of other people's money and much more to come which is going to the Jones Day firm.

I don't think it will be a stalemate. There is also such a thing as a court appointed expert. Either way, the experts could agree on a fast and independent test and if they did and it were a valid test, Rossi would fail it. As Jed points out, instrument readings are not subject to much interpretation once the measuring method and the instruments are decided. The difference between this test and Penon's would be that the court approved test would be truly independent.

ALso: they will go for fraud. There is no way after all this time and discussion, it could be an honest mistake. Rossi would have to be a drooling idiot or a raving lunatic to make that sort of mistake and he's a lot of things but not those. Fraud on the part of Rossi and possibly Levi but not the Swedish professors, Lewan, or Essen.

Quote from Shane D.

I mean't that if Rossi can prove IH successfully built and operated an Ecat as he claimed in 2013, it will have a big impact. Actually it would be huge. He may have that proof for all we know.

Details matter. 2013? Link showing this claim?

If Rossi can show that IH actually made reactors that were independently tested with the kind of COP and power generation necessary, at any time up to the issuance of the ERV Report, his stock does way up. I notice there is no claim of anything like this in the Complaint. He does not seem to think it important that IH be able to demonstrate they had received and understood and could use the IP.

In 2013, the validation test was done. It was on a Rossi-made reactor, done in Italy. At the conclulsion of that test, Penon certified operation and the 1 MW Ecat was delivered to IH in Raleigh, North Carolina, and IP was turned over, we assume, per the Agreement. I do not know when IH began making reactors. They made the Lugano reactor, tested in 2014. That test was "certified" by the Lugano team, and IH made later comments relying on their judgment. The Lugano report later came under heavy criticism.

Rossi could truthfully say that IH was making reactors. "Successfully" is another story. According to whom? Rossi?

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He could also show up in court with a report from the Swedes (what is it about those Swedes? ), ...

Lutfisk, perhaps?

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... showing their present replication attempts -started when Rossi paid them a visit recently, were successful.

It would be irrelevant, not admissible evidence.

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Do I still believe Rossi will be exposed as a fraud...yes. But Rossi always seems to have a surprise or two up his sleeve. Until I hear both sides of the story, I will reserve about a 10% chance Rossi will exonerate himself. You should be happy, as at one time I thought it 90% likely he had something. Heading in the right direction at least!

If you know the right direction, why not just go there and wait for the rest of us to catch up?