Rossi-Blog Comment Discussion

Adrian, thanks for pointing that out. I've tended to refer to you as AA and Axil as Axil, but there is indeed ambiguity.

Quote from Shane D.

My memory is fading, but I thought there were 108 of the little units in the other 1MW shipping container? Fabiani said they were fired up the first day, shut down, and never used again. Also, it's always been a little confusing as to what IH built. They did put together the Lugano HT for sure though.

You have some quotes maybe? Hate for newcomers to the Rossi story, to walk away from LF thinking something that may not be correct. Especially so now, with heightened awareness due to that Press Release.

Penon's reports outline the original configuration of the Doral plant. For instance page 39 of document 207-55* on the court docket contains part of Penon's "Final Report". Right at the beginning he says ... "The MW1-USA plant under test ... consists of 115 power generation units grouped in modules." He then specifies that module BF1 (i.e., Big Frankie 1) contains 16 generators and that modules BF2 -BF4 contain 15 generators each. So there are 61 generators within the 4 Big Frankies. Thee are 54 more generators sitting in individual small containers in the rest of the plant.

The information about who put the fuel in the generators comes from somewhere else in the trial documents. I'll try and locate it. My understanding is that for the small units it was Tom Darden himself who mixed and loaded the fuel using Rossi's secret recipe and procedures. During at least part of the time when these generators were being loaded Rossi was not on scene. In contrast, Rossi made the fuel and loaded the generators in the Big Frankies. This difference has attracted my attention because it was the small IH-loaded generators that were shut down prior to the beginning of the 1-year test. I speculate that Rossi engineered this shutdown because he was worried that IH had inserted some "control" generators into the mix to see if they would work the same as the rest.

The information about the shutdown of the small units comes from a log that Fabiani kept. This is found at the beginning of the the court document mentioned above (207-55). In his report Penon says that his first official visit to the Doral facility lasted until 18 Feb 2015. Fabiani's log shows that as of 22:30 on 19 Feb 2015 all of the small, IH-charged, generators were turned off. The official first day of the 1-year test, according to Penon, was 23 Feb 2015. The small generators were never turned on again.

* Court documents in the Rossi -IH suit can be accessed at Abd Ul-Raman Lomax's site http://coldfusioncommunity.net…en-docket-and-case-files/

To a great extent, most statements made by people here should be considered to have a tacit "In my opinion" preceding them. The exceptions are citations and quotations of other people's statements and pretty much anything stated about the e-cat, which carries a "Rossi says" grain of salt. Some people have a habit of stating things as though they were absolute facts (see all comments by Axil, for example), but I think we should not get too hung up on alleged certainties that are more rhetorical than heartfelt (again, with the possible exception of Axil's remarks.)

Dear Adrian,

In my post Rossi-Blog Comment Discussion which you quote, I give (in bold) 3 statements given in context as part of your quoted post.

You said:

Well, it would mean something if you gave my actual quotes saying I was certain.

It seems you weren't attending to my repeated comments that there was doubt and there wasn't sufficient evidence to prove it one way of the other.

My 3 bolded quotes show your stated certainty (IMHO incorrectly so). The fact that you also, about other matters, profess uncertainty is not to the point. For example, I might be certain the earth was flat, but uncertain what you had eaten for breakfast yesterday.

Adrian, you choose to view the list as ad hominem attacks on Axil, but they are, as far as I can figure, simply a complete list of the possible explanations for his statements about Rossi. I didn't imply anything about which one was accurate. If you believe #1 is an accurate reflection, then there is nothing insulting about it at all. Presumably, if you are understandably skeptical about #2 and are convinced that #3 is false, then there is no problem. Unless, of course, you think there is a 4th possibility, which what what I was asking you about in my post that you described as "wishful thinking".

So, if you can back away from the "anything the 'enemies of LENR' say has evil intent" mindset for a moment and just reflect on this issue, what is your view about the definitive statements Axil has made about Rossi's activities? Are they facts from the horse's mouth or other insiders, does Axil have some sort of mystical insights that the rest of us don't, or is he making it all up? Seriously. It has to be one of those things.

Quote from Adrian Ashfield

Blessed if I can see those bolded bits projected certainty. Just normal conversation. They didn't say things like "I and sure" or "I am certain."

You don't have to look far to see the skeptics are ceratin about all sorts of things.

Well, as IO has said we all do that: make statements that are opinions.

So, for example, if I were to say "Rossi is a fraudster and has deliberately defrauded at least one of his customers" that would just be normal conversation? An opinion? Not something I was sure of? That seems to align my position with your where your uncertainty surely includes the possibility that Rossi is a fraudster?

Variants of Rossi being a fraudster (in some sense of the word) are IMHO (I'm no legal expert) well supported the Court documents, because he has lied (misrepresented in material ways) repeatedly about the identity of the customer and this is relevant to whether IH pay him $10,000,000.

So please give me the quotes where skeptics (other than MY and - over Rossi - Jed) have added "I am sure" to the all sorts of things about which you say they are certain? I think you have a severe case of double standards.

Quote from Adrian Ashfield

Ah, so if I suggest you wrote rubbish because you had a low IQ, or were losing your mind, those would be just some "possible explanations" and not ad hominem insults?

Adrian, that is correct, as long as you allowed less extravagant solutions as well. Anyone reading your list would just think you were being perhaps unnecessarily complete in your enumeration of possibilities. That is no insult. In the case with Axil's post however none of the logical possibilities are entirely complimentary to Axil. Let us see you try that with IO, or alternatively point out where IO's enumeration for Axil was incomplete. You have been avoiding this.

THH, one would have to conclude that Adrian sees all three alternatives as insulting, including the possibility that Axil has inside information that the rest of us lack. Go figure.

Quote from axil

The 108 units did not work and the tiger replacements were not ready for the market because of material breakdown issues. The QX was engineered to overcome the material breakdown and control issues.

Rossi used the Doral test to run a quality test on his reactor designs and that test failed. Rossi had to repair those low temperature reactors far too much for them to be used as a sucessful basis for a commercial product.

54 reactor units from the Doral plant gave problems right away because of the way they were grounded. These were fired up over the first 2.5 weeks of February but then closed down permanently before the 1 year test officially began.

The way to solve the reactor design problems Rossi had was to work on a series of single-reactor prototypes. This is what IH wanted. Rossi wanted the Doral facility with its 115 reactors running simultaneously. If nothing else he is dreadful at product development.

Quote from Adrian Ashfield

Then Bruce__H wrote there were a lot more units than THN said and gave other details I had not seen that require references to check.

References now up. See Rossi-Blog Comment Discussion

1. Steven N. Karels November 18, 2017 at 5:16 AM

   Dear Andrea Rossi,

   To clarify your response to Dr. Joseph Fine — N number of eCat reactors will be all running at 30% of their maximum output value? So if N = 1, the overall thermal output would be 6W, while if N = 100, the overall thermal output would be 600W, assuming the rated maximum output power of a single reactor is 20W. Is my understanding correct?

2. Andrea Rossi November 18, 2017 at 8:02 AM

   Steven N.Karels:

   
   All I said is that the E-Cat QX will run at 30% of its power. Like when you drive your car, supposedly with a rating of 100 HP, at 30 HP.

   
   Warm Regards,

   
   A.R.

Quote from maryyugo

I think I understand that but I am not sure. Last anyone looked, Rossi owned a number (6? 8?) Florida condos around the Miami area. Are you suggesting those had to be sold or heavily mortgaged to pay legal fees? Or are you thinking Rossi anticipated a countersuit and placed his property in the name of trusts and family members? Would that really work? What did I miss here?

One thought I had was the question of why Rossi is continuing his scam with the current scheduled demo. Why not hold on to what he has left and quit while he is somewhat ahead, if he is? Maybe he did spend himself silly with the lawsuit and he thinks he can make one more big score like IH before he goes riding into the sunset. Your thoughts on that, WW?

IIRC, the interplay between federal bankruptcy and Florida law essentially allows you to have your principal residence off-limits to creditors. Any competent attorney could have structured Rossi's Florida real estate holdings such that one residence was declared his primary residence, upon which he would have little or no debt, and all the other properties would be heavily encumbered, thereby providing little value to creditors. Additionally, Rossi could easily have moved a significant portion of his assets off-shore, essentially making them untraceable. Just consider what rich spouses do to hide assets before they get divorced.

Quote from Shane D.

Amazing thing about those 2 small window panes supposedly venting 1MW thermal, is that IHFB believes the fans were nestled up next to them like an integrated, airtight system. That the 1MW then was *all* exhausted out that way. But the way Rossisays it was engineered in his deposition, was that the serpentine radiator was well away from the windows, and that there was one fan blowing over it, and the other blowing towards the window.

Tisk tisk Shane. I've never made such hard conclusions. Please provide a link to any of what you just alleged were my positions. I've noted that the photo Smith included in his report shows a window with two missing panes. Some here (particularly Eric) take great umbrage with that (inexplicably to me). Whether the plant produced a full 1 MW is doubtful, and seems unlikely to me. But as has been shown, it is nearly impossible under any conceived hypothetical to show that the plant produced anything less than 6 COP. I mean, even without a phase change, the COP is greater than 6.

Quote

No way in that case, that all the 1MW would then find it's way out those little open panes about 10 feet away. The rest would recirculate around that already stifling mezzazine, and eventually cook everyone below in the office. Laughable really. And academic as we all know, as there never was an upstairs heat exchanger, and even had there been one, and there was not, THH proved the physics did not work.

All it would take is some finned radiators in the alleged wooden container to disprove THH's suppositions. And Rossi was known to use finned radiators. He was never specifically asked in the depositions whether those were used.

Quote

Eric, I feel your frustration, but I stand by my comment that IHFB is an honest person. THH probably explained how, and why IHFB is so, better than me. Point is, we have to accept there are just some things about the human psyche we have to accept on faith.

I appreciate that underhanded compliment. It is better than no compliment I suppose.