post moved to BLP tread
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[anti-cold fusion crackpots] I believe that by that, Jed means most currently working scientists.
Most working scientists have no knowledge of cold fusion, so their views don't count. Many younger ones have never heard of it.
Counting those who have knowledge of it, meaning scientist who have read papers, I think most have a positive view. I base that on the audience at LENR-CANR.org. What do you base your statements on? Have you taken a public opinion poll? How many scientists have you heard from, and how much do they know about cold fusion?
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While we're discussing history, was it ever determined whether the invariant pressure readings of 0 bar reported during the "1 year test" were
a) Zero bar gauge pressure
b) Zero bar absolute pressure
c) Readings given by a faulty or non-connected sensor
d) Something else.
Not that it matters; it's just something niggling at me.
TIA for any answers
I thought it was a faulty sensor - open. If you check the barometric pressure for Miami you will see the sensor just sits at 0 day after day even when fronts move through. If it was an absolute gauge as required by the original protocol submitted to IH it would have show the weather changed. If it was gauge you would have seen some positive and negative numbers.
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I have heard there were puddles and filth everywhere. The pipes and reservoir were also filthy.
This was not a housekeeping excercise, surely. I think Rossi was way to careful with his cash to employ a cleaner.
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Most working scientists have no knowledge of cold fusion, so their views don't count. Many younger ones have never heard of it.
Counting those who have knowledge of it, meaning scientist who have read papers, I think most have a positive view. I base that on the audience at LENR-CANR.org. What do you base your statements on? Have you taken a public opinion poll? How many scientists have you heard from, and how much do they know about cold fusion?
Here is a blurb from Wiki concerning how scientists feel about CF/LENR
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Many scientists tried to replicate the experiment with the few details available. Hopes faded due to the large number of negative replications, the withdrawal of many reported positive replications, the discovery of flaws and sources of experimental error in the original experiment, and finally the discovery that Fleischmann and Pons had not actually detected nuclear reaction byproducts.[5] By late 1989, most scientists considered cold fusion claims dead,[6][7] and cold fusion subsequently gained a reputation as pathological science.[8][9] In 1989 the United States Department of Energy (DOE) concluded that the reported results of excess heat did not present convincing evidence of a useful source of energy and decided against allocating funding specifically for cold fusion. A second DOE review in 2004, which looked at new research, reached similar conclusions and did not result in DOE funding of cold fusion.[10]
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You might want to say that most scientists who attended lenr-canf have a positive view of LENR NOT most scientists in general necessarily. Your statement would be similar to surveying participants at a meeting of the ~1 to 2% of scientists who do not believe in global warming about their views on climate change. Until the LENR researchers can produce an experiment where the quantity and type of reaction byproducts match what is expected for the quantity of excess heat claimed, I'm afraid I won't believe any of those claims. The experiment also has to be replicated by a team of individuals completely independent of the original claimants. This is to break the cycle of CF/LENR experiments only working when the original claimant runs them, usually.
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As far as I can tell, according to Jed there are 3 groups of people in the world:
People who have accepted cold fusion into their lives (it doesn’t matter how or why). Good people except in the modern era (2016-present) this excludes Rossi believers.
People who haven’t read a requisite (but not defined) number of papers in his holy of holies. Such people are beneath contempt and should be summarily ignored unless they say something, in which case they should be attacked immediately.
People who have read many papers but haven’t accepted cold fusion into their hearts. They are crackpots.
At least one always knows where one stands.
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Here is a blurb from Wiki concerning how scientists feel about CF/LENR
Getting information on cold fusion from Wikipedia is like drinking water from a sewer. The authors there know nothing about the subject, and you know nothing about those authors, except that they name themselves after comic-book characters and the like.
To learn about cold fusion, I suggest you look at legitimate scientific sources such as mainstream, peer-reviewed papers, published by actual scientists with real names.
Here is a little more info. on the Wikipedia article:
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I thought it was a faulty sensor - open. If you check the barometric pressure for Miami you will see the sensor just sits at 0 day after day even when fronts move through. If it was an absolute gauge as required by the original protocol submitted to IH it would have show the weather changed. If it was gauge you would have seen some positive and negative numbers.
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I wonder if there is a complete Stokes deposition available. I bet he checked out the mezzanine.
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People who haven’t read a requisite (but not defined) number of papers in his holy of holies. Such people are beneath contempt and should be summarily ignored unless they say something, in which case they should be attacked immediately.
Okay, let us consider any other scientific, technical or academic subject. Say, programming, or Japanese literature. Suppose this discussion group was about programming, and someone started making assertions about the structure of Pascal. Suppose, after a while, it became apparent that this person knew nothing about Pascal and had never programmed a line of code in it, or in any other language. Would you take that person's assertions seriously? Or would you dismiss them?
Suppose someone came in to a forum about Japanese literature and started making claim after claim about the famous author Sozeku and the Maruzen Trilogy. There are problems with that: Sozeku isn't a name; there is no such person or book, and Maruzen is a department store. So, would you take this person seriously?
Do you think that people who have read nothing and know nothing can make useful contributions to a technical discussion? I don't.
People who have read many papers but haven’t accepted cold fusion into their hearts. They are crackpots.
I know only four people who have read many papers but have not accepted it. No doubt there are others, but I am not acquainted with them. Two are not crackpots. They do not make outlandish statements that are contrary to basic scientific laws and facts. The other two are Morrison and Shanahan. You can read their papers and judge for yourself whether they are crackpots or not. I think that a person who claims a metal object that remains hot is "not a heater" is a crackpot, but I invite you to make up your own mind about that.
Morrison's paper is here:
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I think Rossi was way to careful with his cash to employ a cleaner.
Indeed. He wanted the most money to go to children. With cancer.
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OK, so we have no idea what the actual pressure was in the system (I use the word loosely) at that point in the pipework. All speculation based on the figure of zero bar is fruitless.
Also what species of scientist or engineer would not have queried that set of readings and at least swapped out the sensor for an alternative? It may seem trivial, but it gives an idea of the general sloppiness (or worse) of the test protocol and the people running it.
Looking forward to the 24th. I shall just have returned from Dublin and will be full of the Good-natured Glow of Gallons of Guiness
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I shall just have returned from Dublin and will be full of the Good-natured Glow of Gallons of Guiness
Good for you!
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The last time I went to Dublin I was forced to start drinking Guinness at 4 a.m. There was more Guinness at breakfast in Dublin. The memories of the next couple of days are somewhat hazy, but I do know at times I eschewed the Guinness for Bushmills. The Irish are generous hosts, but have a peculiar idea of what constitutes a nutritious diet.
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People who have read many papers but haven’t accepted cold fusion into their hearts. They are crackpots.
LENR is not nuclear fusion.
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The smith reports looks like something put together by a high school student. And he obviously didn't care to google the translation of "dosierleistung" even though it was somewhat important for the calculations. Instead he invented his own translation that suited his agenda and paycheck. Smith is just a paid shill and incompetent moron. Not much more to it.
You only get what you pay for.
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perhaps, perhaps not. We don't know (that is the problem with all this, too sloppy to know much of anything). It could be just a small drip with most of it going into the insulation and then evaporating next to the approximate 100C pipe. Since Rossi threw out the IH people and prevented examination, destroyed evidence,.... we will never know. Better to focus on the next demo.
But my guess is that it will also be full of "holes". Those gray boxes look big enough to hold 4kW hr of stored energy so at the claimed 25W output, they will need to run about a week to be sure there is not any stored chemical energy.... unless they are opened and the chemical nature of the oil is checked before and after.
I also doubt he will allow examination of the pumps and measure their input power. You can hid a lot of wires in a dark oil tube.
It is good to go over old ground to prepare for the new battle over the demo.
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Indeed. He wanted the most money to go to children. With cancer.
As a top priority, Rossi should reserve some of his money in order to sue you into destitution.
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Axil, I used the term cold fusion because a number of people here do. So feel free to substitute LENR or AHE or invisible pink flying unicorns in my comment. I really don’t care. I have no doubt that nobody else here has the exact same thing in mind that you do anyway, so call it whatever floats your boat.
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Axil, I used the term cold fusion because a number of people here do. So feel free to substitute LENR or AHE or invisible pink flying unicorns in my comment. I really don’t care. I have no doubt that nobody else here has the exact same thing in mind that you do anyway, so call it whatever floats your boat.
Do you understand that low temperature transmutation of elements exits?
