In any case, the relevant fact is that these names have not been revealed. Why?
Because it is none of your business, or mine.
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We should also remember that in November 2011, SPAWAR abruptly closed all its LENR activities. In December 2011, JR revealed (3): "The people at SPAWAR are negotiating with management about this. They are hoping to arrange to have the equipment and know-how transferred to the private sector."
Only a coincidence?They were never able to transfer the equipment. They were closed down abruptly because a blogger associated their names with Rossi. Rossi bragged that someone from the Navy attended his 1-MW demonstration. A blogger claimed that person was from SPAWAR. The Admiral in charge heard this and immediately ordered the program closed. So, it was not a coincidence, but it was a fiasco. Nothing like a coordinated or deliberate effort the way you imagine.
The people at SPAWAR were very, very upset with Rossi because of this.
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One of the people visiting was Tom Darden.
Since the heat exchanger was important
he should have asked Rossi to show him
the heat exchanger.
Sam,
One cannot ask for something they know nothing about!
1. Rossi filed the lawsuit and that night disassembled the plumbing coming out of the reactor.
2. Rossi then first stated the heat went out a roof vent. But that got shot down quickly.
3. Later, he then stated the heat went into an endothermic manufacturing process. This had been mentioned on ECW and Rossi took it and ran the story. However, he did not check this out and it was soon discounted. There is no known process, so he dropped that.
4. Almost a year after the lawsuit and some people showing the hard math that the facility would have been an oven, he suddenly came up with the exchanger story. Drawn up on a napkin, materials from Home depot and unregistered workers off the street built the marvel! That WAS his story.
No receipts, no drawimgs, no permits, no photos. Nothing! Literally!
5. In the court depositions, Rossi provided a professor as an expert witness on the exchanger. Paid by Rossi, he stated an exchanger could have removed the heat. BUT HE NEVER SAW IT, ANY PLANS, DRAWINGS OR WORKSHEETS. All simply from "Rossi says", just like everything is.
6. THH showed hard math that the exchanger as described would not have worked.
Much evidence that there was no exchanger. NO evidence that there was one.
Now, pleae tell me how Darden could have asked to see a non-existing exchanger that no one had heard a single word about until almost a year after the lawsuit?
And Rossi took no photos of this marvel!?
The more you learn, the sooner you will realize..........
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And Rossi took no photos of this marvel!?
There are photos of the facility that would show the heat exchanger and the pipes going to it, if they had existed. The photos show nothing. There are photos of mezzanine taken after the exchanger was supposedly removed. They show that no such equipment was installed there, or could have been. There were no power supplies and there were no marks left, and the floor would not have supported such a heavy object. In short, there is not the slightest chance the heat exchanger story is true. Without the heat exchanger, the whole nonsensical account in the Penon report collapses. It collapses for several other reasons, as well.
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Don't be so bloody thick. I was talking about now, after Doral.
You don't think a new investor would not take great care with his due diligence with Rossi's e history?
How is he making money from his scam now, employing 22 people?
Iust wait and see what happens instead of babbling.
Why has ANYTHING changed after Doral?
You believe Rossi when he states he has 22 employees. He has lied about employee numbers before.
But here is the real point Adrian... I HAVE waited and I HAVE seen what happens!
Rossi lies, he lies often and he continues to lie. You simply wipe the board clean after his proven lies and keep wiping the board clean and then choose to believe him time after time.
I choose to believe the facts, his history and that the stuff ROSSI says is his most damning accuser!
You choose to believe Rossi and NOT hold him accountable for any lies, no matter how blatant.
You would buy that ocean front property from Rossi! This is exactly what he is looking for and he may well find it!
That is the answer to your question and most clearly see it!
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Don't forget the window team showing up on the day Wong was there to inspect the mezzanine for his report, a year after the Plant was shut down. Like the windows were missing for two years? LOL.
And, gosh, the mezzanine windows appearing and disappearing (depending on one's point of view) for the benefit of the Google Steet View camera car, while the test was on.
*sigh*
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And the miracle of Bologna, October 2011, where water flowed up hill without pressure to the reservoirs, and the heat exchangers condensed steam while 3/4 full of water remains a miracle to this day.
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How is he making money from his scam now, employing 22 people?
A couple of days I showed you that Rossi said in 2012 to have 63 people working to develop, improve, manufacture, and market the E-Cat:
QuoteDisplay MoreIggy Dalrymple, August 18th, 2012 at 9:55 PM
Dear Dr Rossi,
How many people are working to develop, improve, manufacture, and market the E-Cat and the Hot-Cat?
Sincerely,
Iggy Dalrymple
Andrea Rossi, August 19th, 2012 at 2:01 AM
Dear Iggy Dalrymple:
As of today we are 63 persons, and growing up (three years ago we were 3, two years ago we were 6, last year we were 13).
Warmest Regards,
A.R.
Here is the tax return filing from Leonardo Corporation from 2012:
http://coldfusioncommunity.net…/01/247-03-Exhibit-31.pdf
Check how much Leonard Corp spend in 2012 for salaries and wages (zero $), and claculate how many employees Leonardo Corp may have had at that time (when Rossi said 63 people are “working” for the e-cat).
In Rossi’s language, probably anybody who makes a suggestion on his blog “works on the development, improvement and marketing of the e-cat”.
Since Dewey Weaver seems to be around here this days:
I remember during the years 2012 - 2016, quite a number of people believed in Rossi and what Rossi wrote on JONP, because they thought IH people are also reading his blog, and IH would break up with him when they find some lies.
Did IH follow what Rossi wrote on JONP?
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Because it is none of your business, or mine.
Not at all, it's everybody business.
TD disclosed the 3 phone calls - that induced him to enter the LENR field - during his opening speech at a conference which were sponsored by several Italian political and scientific Institutions, including the high patronage of the Italian Prime Minister.
That conference was not devoted to discuss new fashion trends for the next season, but to promote a technology which, in the opinion of the participants, could solve the most critical and urgent problems of our planet. For this reason, LENR promoters are soliciting public and private investors to provide financial support up to many billions of dollars.
Since the speaker spoke about everyone's future, and chose to publicly reveal that his interest in the field - despite his initial skepticism - was triggered by 3 phone calls, I think it is legitimate for everyone to wonder what caused such a radical change of view, which finally led to the largest financial operation in LENR history, an operation that also involved renowned public investment funds.
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40-2: Everybody here knows that Adrian is reluctant to read or ignore publicly available information about Rossi's past, doesn't matter if it is well documented in the Doral court case or even written by the master himself on his own JONP blog. Rissi simply seems to lose track on what he wrote there, or he doesn't care at all what he said yesterday... It's just another lie...
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40-2: Everybody here knows that Adrian is reluctant to read or ignore publicly available information about Rossi's past, doesn't matter if it is well documented in the Doral court case or even written by the master himself on his own JONP blog. Rissi simply seems to lose track on what he wrote there, or he doesn't care at all what he said yesterday... It's just another lie...
Rossi has a creative attitude towards the truth. He, like Humpty Dumpty, believes words should mean what he wants them to mean. It is documented that he, in the past, has twisted things to the limit of misdirection by creative redefinition (often) and into outright lies (occasionally). I so wish we had had a chance to hear his cross-examination on this in Court.
Has he been tarnished by this history of keeping truth at arm's length length? Absolutely no in the eyes of believers: look at our very own Adrian here who continues to attach evidential weight to twistable RossiSays!
Adrian: I know your stance is that of uncommitted but positive "wait and see". But, given the plentiful negative evidence, that can only be held with a strong dose of underlying belief.
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They were never able to transfer the equipment. They were closed down abruptly because a blogger associated their names with Rossi. Rossi bragged that someone from the Navy attended his 1-MW demonstration. A blogger claimed that person was from SPAWAR. The Admiral in charge heard this and immediately ordered the program closed. So, it was not a coincidence, but it was a fiasco. Nothing like a coordinated or deliberate effort the way you imagine.
Which specific coordinated effort are you meaning? I only said that IMO the LENR research groups which operated since 1898 within the US administration, and that were suddenly closed down at the end of 2011, are among the more suitable candidates to be one or more of the callers of the 3 phone calls which triggered the interest of Darden for the LENR field.
In absence of more detailed information, I think it's a reasonable hypothesis.
QuoteThe people at SPAWAR were very, very upset with Rossi because of this.
Why were they so upset with Rossi? They should have been upset with themselves. Rossi had been mainly supported up to then by people of the Navy. Did they ever care to launch any public warning with respect to what was happening in their field, and that was of public knowledge since the beginning of 2011?
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Askie (
) didn't you previously claim that you are just trying to fit pieces of ‘evidence’ into a puzzle, rather than promoting your own overarching conspiratorial narrative? -
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Now, pleae tell me how Darden could have asked to see a non-existing exchanger that no one had heard a single word about until almost a year after the lawsuit?
And Rossi took no photos of this marvel!?
The more you learn, the sooner you will realize..........
I think Tom Darden should have learned more about the Doral test from the begining.
He could have learned from an Engineer what to ask and have shown him by A.R. about the test that where important.
A competent engineer would have told him to ask AR about the heat exchanger and have it shown to him.
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I think Tom Darden should have learned more about the Doral test from the begining.
The problem is that IH was not even notified that Doral was claimed by Rossi until Aug. Before that it was just Rossi using technology that he had sold to IH for the production and sale of heat. The so called "test" was not on TD's "radar" till very late.
And the heat exchanger was not even claimed till very very late after Rossi's claims of venting and then later massive unrealistic endothermic chemistry at the 1MW levels.
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Askie () didn't you previously claim that you are just trying to fit pieces of ‘evidence’ into a puzzle, rather than promoting your own overarching conspiratorial narrative?
Fitting pieces of evidence into the puzzle is exactly what I'm trying to do.
Did you ever rebuilt a puzzle? Sometimes you have to imagine a possible scene in order to pick up the right piece and lay it down in the exact orientation. The Ecat puzzle is much more difficult because many pieces are still missing, or even lost forever, so you often have to imagine which possible scene could reasonably bridge two parts which cannot be physically connected.
IMO the important thing is that these imaginary bridges be declared in advance, and be considered provisional until a real piece of evidence is found that confirms or denies that hypothesis. If you go back through my comments, you will see that I declare in advance the parts that are my speculations or hypotheses, from those that are solid evidences based on reliable documents which are available on the web.
Sometimes this way of doing is useful to obtain other good pieces from authoritative sources. For instance, yesterday D. Weaver revealed to us that the two investment in the LENR sector that preceded the Ecat licensing were made by TD personally, and that one of them was Brillouin. I think these are reliable information and two important new pieces of evidence in the Ecat puzzle.
Maybe in the future we might even know when it happened, if Brillouin was one of the 3 groups (the 1st, the 2nd, or the 3rd one) that phone called, who was the Brillouin executive who did the call, who suggested him to call TD. And also, why after having invested in a group whose devices were been successfully tested by to important labs such as LANL and SRI, it was decided to make the big bet with Rossi and the Ecat.
You know, looking closely at the picture you realize that there are a lot of pieces which are still missing.
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The problem is that IH was not even notified that Doral was claimed by Rossi until Aug. Before that it was just Rossi using technology that he had sold to IH for the production and sale of heat. The so called "test" was not on TD's "radar" till very late.
And the heat exchanger was not even claimed till very very late after Rossi's claims of venting and then later massive unrealistic endothermic chemistry at the 1MW levels.
I think the problem was that Tom Darden and Andrea Rossi did not work well together and did not even get to understand
each other.To bad because i think they are both fine men.
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Why has ANYTHING changed after Doral?
You believe Rossi when he states he has 22 employees. He has lied about employee numbers before.But here is the real point Adrian... I HAVE waited and I HAVE seen what happens!
Rossi lies, he lies often and he continues to lie. You simply wipe the board clean after his proven lies and keep wiping the board clean and then choose to believe him time after time.
I choose to believe the facts, his history and that the stuff ROSSI says is his most damning accuser!
You choose to believe Rossi and NOT hold him accountable for any lies, no matter how blatant.
You would buy that ocean front property from Rossi! This is exactly what he is looking for and he may well find it!
That is the answer to your question and most clearly see it!I don't know if it is because you are stupid or are technically illiterate.
It would be dead easy for a potential investor to measure the real performance of the QX set up in a similar fashion as in Stockholm. One would just have to measure the things that weren't measured at the demo. The power into the power pack and the volts & amps across the QX itself. Also look at the waveform with a 'scope to see if anything else would be required.
Just because IH failed to do proper due diligence, or blew it afterwards, has no bearing on the matter.
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Just because IH failed to do proper due diligence, or blew it afterwards, has no bearing on the matter.
It does bear on the matter. They failed to do due diligence at first, and Rossi lied and took advantage of that. Later, at Doral, they tried to do due diligence but he threw them out, and then published the Penon report. That report is so full of outrageous lies and nonsense, it destroyed his credibility. You are ignoring these facts. Have you even read the Penon report? In all these years, it is the only technical report that Rossi has ever published, and it proves he is a fraud. How can that have "no bearing on the matter"?
That report is the only evidence Rossi supplied in the lawsuit documents. You cite his blog, but he never quoted the blog or tried to use it as legal evidence for his claim. The Penon report is the one and only formal document you have to go on to justify your faith in Rossi. Anyone with common sense can see that it a grotesque lie. As I recall, you and Axil are so blinded by wishful thinking and delusions, you refuse to even look at it.
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IMO the important thing is that these imaginary bridges be declared in advance, and be considered provisional until a real piece of evidence is found that confirms or denies that hypothesis.
In my opinion, you should never introduce "imaginary bridges" or imaginary anythings when discussing matters of fact. You should stick to documented events and statements that you know are real, or at least that you have good reason to think are real. Never mix your own speculation with facts. Or if you do, you should say, "this is mere speculation but . . ." Speculation is all but worthless. What most people imagine happened in cases like this is usually wrong. Everything you have said about me regarding these events (and other events, such as what happened at ICCF-21) has been completely wrong. Not just wrong, but a preposterous fantasy, without a shred of evidence. You have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to me, so I suppose you have no idea what you are talking about with regard to I.H. and others.
