You claimed you need a theory to believe in your discussion with Jed.
It is a bit annoying that you do not read my posts. I said there were two possibles, one of which was a theory, the other strong experimental evidence.
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Leaving aside the question of exactly who should see a psychologist, Rossi's activities are best explained by his desire to snare another investor who doesn't know how to do proper diligence. One even less capable and diligent than those he screwed in the past, if that's possible, and it might be.
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Well it doesn't look like you are going to get an independent test nor will the customer see the input power. That would be a commercial secret.
Here on planet earth, that arrangement would violate a dozen safety regulations. No sane equipment manager or engineer would even think of allowing it. They would lose their licenses if they did. They might end up in jail. They might even kill someone by accident. Equipment on this scale is extremely dangerous. As you see in this video:
External Content www.youtube.comContent embedded from external sources will not be displayed without your consent.Through the activation of external content, you agree that personal data may be transferred to third party platforms. We have provided more information on this in our privacy policy.I have been in many equipment rooms for HVAC and telephone equipment. I have read the regulations. Any piece of HVAC equipment larger than you use at home MUST be equipped with a full range of meters and thermometers showing how much energy it is consuming, and how much heat (or cold air) it is producing. The exact type of monitoring equipment and the placement of it is shown in the regulations in detail. For example, a dial thermometer must be installed on a level pipe 6 feet from a boiler.
People such as AA who believe these absurd fantasies peddled by Rossi have no knowledge of actual heavy HVAC equipment, boilers, regulations, or common sense safety precautions. AA claims he does, but the fact that believes this nonsense belies his claim.
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Here on planet earth, that arrangement would violate a dozen safety regulations. No sane equipment manager or engineer would even think of allowing it. They would lose their licenses if they did. They might end up in jail. They might even kill someone by accident. Equipment on this scale is extremely dangerous. As you see in this video:
External Content www.youtube.comContent embedded from external sources will not be displayed without your consent.Through the activation of external content, you agree that personal data may be transferred to third party platforms. We have provided more information on this in our privacy policy.
I have been in many equipment rooms for HVAC and telephone equipment. I have read the regulations. Any piece of HVAC equipment larger than you use at home MUST be equipped with a full range of meters and thermometers showing how much energy it is consuming, and how much heat (or cold air) it is producing. The exact type of monitoring equipment and the placement of it is shown in the regulations in detail. For example, a dial thermometer must be installed on a level pipe 6 feet from a boiler.
People such as AA who believe these absurd fantasies peddled by Rossi have no knowledge of actual heavy HVAC equipment, boilers, regulations, or common sense safety precautions. AA claims he does, but the fact that believes this nonsense belies his claim.
But, you have to realize that all of Rossi's marvelous inventions also include the soon to be famous, patent pending, trademark and copyright pending "RossiSafetyAssurance," which guarantees that nothing bad will happen, and that RossiSafetyAssurance, through the miracle of Rossi's brilliant mind, prevents anything bad from happening, all by itself. I am 1000% confident that all safety inspectors, insurance companies, etc. will accept that instead of boring old safety certifications, licenses and permits provided by mere mortals.
Alan: we need a sarcasm emoji.
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People such as AA who believe these absurd fantasies peddled by Rossi have no knowledge
Probably the main reason I visit this site from time to time is to watch with fascination , those Rossi acolytes and faithful. I try to understand what process is going in their brains, how they continue to believe the opposite of what is absolutely obvious.
I have come to the conclusion it is two fold. One I kind of understand, the other I do not.
Some are absolutely consumed with the eCat and Rossi. "Rossi says" supercedes any law, regulation, logic or common sense that may exist. As AA so often puts it... "no one knows more than Rossi about the eCat". So when their idolized leader states that the eCat is a master piece, it is. There is no other measure. What Rossi says, is reality to them. If anything goes against Ross says, then either they are babblers or the criticism is ignored and not acknowledged at all. Some may use the "wait and see" excuse, but then they completely and consciously ignore the past 7 years! 7 years ago we WERE "waiting to see" and what we saw was lies, deceptions, rigged tests, bad tests and NO production, NO customer, NO verification, NO certification. Nothing. AA states "wait and see" but then he also states "I do not want to rehash history"! Such logic! A year from now, when Rossi's next deception is revealed, AA will continue to again say "wait and see and I do not want to rehash history". Although he has now stated he believes production will start sometime in 2019. He will soon "forget that " statement or simply accept Rossi's excuse of the next "new and improved" model. Trying to debate with AA is pointless. He has become incapable of acknowledging reality in this particular case. He has a cult mindset with the eCat.
The one I do not understand is the very few, otherwise rational people that continue to support Rossi, such as A. Smith. I can conclude only one of two possible reasons. 1) They are just playing the role, why I would not know. For fun? These people remain factually quiet, do not provide any factual evidence as to why they believe and yet often post the subtle thumbs up for Rossi.
2) I am beginning to suspect it is simply a case of underdog support. Rossi is the individual and corporations are evil, capitalistic vampires. So much like politics, "Democrats" are for the poor and "Republicans" are for the rich. Facts have very little to play in these stereotypes. It is the stereotype itself that is important. It may not matter that Rossi is a scam artist, he can be a poster boy for the individual, lone inventor, which group these people belong. How many supporters does Rossi have that are from larger institutions? Larger corporations? Research labs? Etc. None publicly. Interesting I guess.
IH is the big, corporate investment firm, therefore evil by default and worthy of scorn. So Rossi support is not so much support of Rossi, but a diss on IH. ? Who knows. I still do not fathom this. We see the "thumbs up" for Rossi and the diss for IH. NEVER the other way around. Quite telling is it not.
More so, if someone really believes Rossi has the goods, they should state why. Otherwise supporting a proven and known liar, fraudster and scammer is inexcusable. It is like stating Bernie Madoff s a misunderstood and overall good guy. That his stealing hundreds of millions of dollars is justified because he has a nice smile. Really?
For those that are somewhat "closet" Rossi supporters, I will certainly continue to prod them to come out and state why. And not with vague suggestions. "I believe because some anonymous friend I trust believes" is not reasonable, scientific conduct. Especially with the plethora of damning evidence against Rossi.
Truly incredible. Get off the fence people. Either man up and support your belief or face the facts! This causes more harm than good by far!
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I don't agree. Rossi stated he believes that having a financial incentive will lead to the fastest development and exploitation of LENR. He has a widely recognized point.
Rossi states h has his IP written down in case of his death, so it won't disappear. There is no reason to think he is doing it for the money. He could have retired when he sold his bio-fuel engine business for $1 million.
It's not easy to start a new business with a novel technology. Some have managed it, like Intel, who seem to have done well, despite what you say.
The fact remains Rossi will have done something extraordinary, that all other scientists have failed to do, if it proves out next year. Sure, the babblers will keep repeating he has nothing but there is no way they know that. It looks like you have joined the hate Rossi club.
I don't hate Rossi. Instead, I'm disgusted with the disease he and others have contracted. After all this time of Andrea Rossi showing off his technology, LENR has yet to reach mainstream acceptance as a real phenomena that can be technologically harnessed for the benefit of mankind. I understand from his point of view why he doesn't teach anyone (except possibly IH which is a huge debate I don't want to go into) how to reproduce even the simplest of his systems: he knows that there's a direct path to a pure plasma or plasma-nano-metal-particle system he doesn't want other groups to follow. But at the same time, I cannot imagine how he justifies keeping the entire world in the dark, for so many years now, without absolute hard proof undeniable to anyone that LENR is real. While he waits to find the perfect investor for him to build a massive factory that would allow him to keep all his secrets and obtain total marketshare, humanity is still looking at solar panels as a potential savior. Pathetic.
You stated, "Rossi stated he believes that having a financial incentive will lead to the fastest development and exploitation of LENR."
A financial incentive does lead to the fastest development. However, he doesn't simply have a reasonable financial incentive that would lead him to release a basic product of some kind, make millions, and become recognized around the world as a true hero industrialist. Instead, his incentive is to keep all of his IP, release the ultimate product that no one can improve on (at least not much), and keep total 100% market share for as long as possible. I don't hate him for this, but it frustrates me severely. There is room for everyone in this market, and while we wait for years longer the human civilization suffers.
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Bob,
or, 3) Getting results similar to what Rossi claims, in their own lab.
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https://e-catworld.com/2018/09…ion-with-10-kw-sk-e-cats/
So the SKat it is. Surprises me actually. I thought it (SK) was the typical Rossi diversionary, misdirection tactic, to protect the real product...his QX. Apparently I was wrong.
Thank you as always Frank Acland, for the good reporting.
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It is a bit annoying that you do not read my posts. I said there were two possibles, one of which was a theory, the other strong experimental evidence.
So answer the question. Yes or no?
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Well it doesn't look like you are going to get an independent test nor will the customer see the input power. That would be a commercial secret.
Obviously the customer would either know how much heat he uses or measure it coming in, or both. I did a back of the envelope calculation that if Rossi is to compete against gas he needs a COP >25.
The rest if your convoluted, extremely long winded post did little to clarify your position (you won't believe it without a theory) and seemed an attempt to avoid answering the question. " If many customers are happy buying heat from Rossi, will you believe his reactors work?" Yes or no?
Rossi has gone to extreme lengths to protect his IP and is unlikely to risk it with an independent test. Why should he? It doesn't look like he has a strong patent for the SK. Possibly he can't get one. Operating in the field runs the risk he will not be able to get a patent in the future.
Adrian,
A theory means less than 2 dead flies if
Your experimental data is replicable.
However, in your next 1000 lifetimes you will not see the Ecat or any of its variants produce Energ Out > Energy In, because
It doesn’t work and never has, it is mind knumbingly (how is that for an adverb), obvious to anyone who chooses to see,
Andrea Rossi is a fraud.
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Battle lines are drawn. Rossi says he will begin SK production this January 2019. I think that is what Adrian predicted? If so, good on him. Good to see we have a defined timeline, after which the winning side will have bragging rights. While it remains to be determined how, exactly, we will know he has started production, I say let the best man win.
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Battle lines are drawn. Rossi says he will begin SK production this January 2019. I think that is what Adrian predicted? If so, good on him. Good to see we have a defined timeline, after which the winning side will have bragging rights. While it remains to be determined how, exactly, we will know he has started production, I say let the best man win.
Come on Shane, you are too optimistic.
We have seen this all before. The 1MW plant was "in production". The 1MW plant had a "customer". The 1MW plant had a chief scientist. Rossi continually espoused that the 1MW plant was performing to the "customers" satisfaction. That the 1MW plant ran for more than 340 days out of 360.
Reality was proved to be :
Rossi lied as usual.
There was no customer. The customer was Rossi himself.
There was no chief scientist for the customer. It was James Bass, an IT guy who relayed scripted messages from Rossi himself.
The plant data showed the customer put out full power when it was not even running! No wonder the customer (Rossi himself) was pleased!
This is all proven in court documents by Rossi's own admissions. (Except AA refuses to believe them because they did not have a jury
)We will go through another year of NDA's, "Can't tell because the customer wants it secret", data will expose the IP, yada, yada, yada.
Yet the Rossi faithful will sing Rossi's praises and revel in the eCAt being real.... with the only evidence being that Rossi said so.
Nothing will change.
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Battle lines are drawn. Rossi says he will begin SK production this January 2019. I think that is what Adrian predicted? If so, good on him. Good to see we have a defined timeline, after which the winning side will have bragging rights. While it remains to be determined how, exactly, we will know he has started production, I say let the best man win.
Isn’t this exactly what the babblers have predicted? Because this is Rossi’s scheme and pattern..? Dropping the current “product” that is “Sigma-5-ready” for the next generation that is superior and more efficient? Rossi keeps us curious what might be his next toy in a year from now, he will drop his SK for? Luckily there is enough room with letters from the alphabet... Adrian come on with a suggestion 😄😄
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About SK I would like to suggest a more suitable name for the next step of Rossi’s farce:
Scam-Kat
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Since Rossi left nothing than scorched earth in the LENR arena so far - maybe he could use next something like Ecat AF ("ash field")
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Since Rossi left nothing than scorched earth in the LENR arena so far - maybe he could use next something like Ecat AF ("ash field")
About SK I would like to suggest a more suitable name for the next step of Rossi’s farce:
Scam-Kat
...
..
.
both are good.
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Isn’t this exactly what the babblers have predicted? Because this is Rossi’s scheme and pattern..? Dropping the current “product” that is “Sigma-5-ready” for the next generation that is superior and more efficient? Rossi keeps us curious what might be his next toy in a year from now, he will drop his SK for? Luckily there is enough room with letters from the alphabet... Adrian come on with a suggestion 😄😄
...
..
.
No, he does not keep us curios, at least not me. But he tries to do so. Failing...
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Battle lines are drawn. Rossi says he will begin SK production this January 2019. I think that is what Adrian predicted? If so, good on him. Good to see we have a defined timeline, after which the winning side will have bragging rights. While it remains to be determined how, exactly, we will know he has started production, I say let the best man win.
Shane,
And more importantly, what exactly will he be manufacturing, if anything at all.
What is certain is that
It will NOT be a device that produces
Energy Out > Energy In.
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About SK I would like to suggest a more suitable name for the next step of Rossi’s farce:
Scam-Kat
I suggested SK to A.R. In honour of Sven Kullander who Rossi collaborated with to
invent the Ecat.
But for all the Rossi skeptics they can pretend the S.K. Initials are in honour of
Steve Kirvit who believes Rossi is a farce.
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He uses the name of a retired old academic, deceived like Sergio Focardi.
For the next imaginary "product" (and for jonp chattering throughout the 2019) it can suggest SF.
Another masterpiece obviously.
