Rossi vs. Darden developments [CASE CLOSED]

  • However, it still remains that he claimed to have a great system that would produce oil from waste but he did not deliver on the promise.

    That is not true, as I remember. At one point I did a deep dive into all of this. One of the judges in one of his cases stated on the record that he was producing oil from waste. Rossi was at the forefront of this technology and received an early patent for it. He had a thriving business at one time, until the regulators came down on him (and hard). One person in particular who doggedly pursued Rossi in those days was recently convicted of fraud in a large EU scandal. Goes to show the type of enemies Rossi had. He still has many it seems.

    The oil from waste industry is now relatively large.

  • IHFB - perhaps you dove into one of Petroldragons waste lagoons and emerged with oily eyes. You definitely did not dive deeply enough into the story. There are many places to start - here are a couple of hints:
    Go spend a little time figuring out who owned the book publisher for the waste to oil story. Then spend a little more time tracking down the fake invoices and money laundering that took place - will you be surprised if the "book publisher" is involved there as well? Then spend a little more time tracking down the plea bargains / prison sentences for Petroldragon associates. The story is truly toxic on multiple fronts and we're going to get to hear all about it at trial if the case makes it that far. Once you have made it that far into the story, then you can work your way over to the rejected Petroldragon oil facts. Makes me want to go take a shower.

  • @Dewey

    I think you might have a motive here to smear Rossi. So I do take what you say with a grain of salt.

    I've done my own research. In addition, I've read An Impossible Invention by Mats, which arguably is the best reference for what happened, as he actually has done more digging than probably anybody. Facts can be twisted like a plastic nose, and I'm sure they will be in a case with the stakes being what they are.

    At the end of the day, I want the world to have LENR+. Why does it seem that IH has done all that they can to impede the rollout of LENR+, going so far as to make it sound like they never achieved any level of replication of the Rossi effect?

  • but I want facts while I see only a fragmented puzzle with a lot of missing pieces.

    It does take some looking for facts but one easy place to start is

    be sure to check the references given at the bottom of the article
    for example: The government of Lombardy spent over forty million euros to dispose of the 70,000 tonnes of toxic waste that Petroldragon had improperly dumped.[4]
    Guastella Giuseppe. "Riciclaggio rifiuti tossici, assolto Andrea Rossi (English translation: Toxic waste recycling, Andrea Rossi acquitted)". Corriere della Sera. Retrieved 2011-11-12.

    Rossi sent 27 thermoelectric devices for evaluation to the Engineer Research and Development Center; 19 of these did not produce any electricity at all. The remaining units produced less than 1 watt each, instead of the expected 800–1000 watts.[5]
    John Huston; Chris Wyatt; Chris Nichols; Michael J. Binder; Franklin H. Holcomb (September 2004). Application of Thermoelectric Devices to Fuel Cell Power Generation: Demonstration and Evaluation. Construction Engineering Research Laboratory in Champaign, Illinois, part of Engineer Research and Development Center (ERDC). (online pdf)

    According to the mayor of Lacchiarella, Luigi Acerbi, "In the years when [Rossi] was working here, he didn't produce a single drop of oil, as far as we know"

    yes he went bankrupt.
    yes he was acquitted of 51 of the 57 counts against him concerning Petrodragon but 5 of them ended in convictions and imprisonment (do to taxes) : headlines from Corriere della Sera, a Milan-based newspaper June 1 2000-translated- Fugitive in the United States After Abandoning Hazardous Waste in Lacchiarella
    “Oil Wizard” jailed: Andrea Rossi Arrested in Rome for Financial Collapse of Omar Refinery

    But the point is that Rossi does not have a track record of fulfilling on his promises of new technology and moves from one claim to another.

  • At the end of the day, I want the world to have LENR+.

    The problem is, LENR+ does not exist. It is a figment of Gluck's imagination.

    Why does it seem that IH has done all that they can to impede the rollout of LENR+,

    It only seems that way to you. You are deluded.

    going so far as to make it sound like they never achieved any level of replication of the Rossi effect?

    They "make it sound like that" because that is the truth. They have never achieved any level of replication of the Rossi effect. Neither has Rossi himself in the last several years. If he had achieved this, they would have paid him $80 million.

  • @oldguy

    Wikipedia is a farce when it comes to all things cold fusion, including all things Rossi. You apparently are well-versed in the cold fusion and its history, and should appreciate that. So I do think referencing that source for information about Rossi is somewhat disingenuous.

    BTW, I think in all other respects, Wikipedia is a wonderful resource.

  • I think in all other respects, Wikipedia is a wonderful resource.

    That is why I said check the references at the bottom of the article. Not a great article but it is a place for you to start.

    Example, the local Italian newspapers it refes is not likely as biased.

    An open minded person normally checks things from more than one side.

  • why would IH agree to do a 2 year plant rental when the licence agreement hasn't been completely fulfilled? They're already months (years?) behind on doing the GPT and should have been diligently working on trying to find a place to run the GPT. GPT would have been on everyone's mind ever since it got delayed.

    It must be so....... In the License Agreement between Rossi and IH you can read that the GPT should last 350 days within a 400 day period and that "the ERV will be engaged to confirm in writing the Guaranteed Performance".
    Before the start of the Doral test, Rossi writes these things to IH: (Taken from Exhibit 16)"In the incoming meeting we will have next week, please allow me to encourage you to take a decision regarding where to put at work our 1 MW plant. [...]
    This solution will: ..... allow the plant work for 24 hours per day for 360 days per year".And on February 05 (2015) talks about the ERV in another email to IH :"On the 16 the ERV (Ing. Penon) will be here to install his measurement instrumentation".
    Darden and Vaugh are making fun of us when they say that they didn't know the Doral test was the GPT, it is simply an impossible thing. Even their man inside the Plant, Mr. West, was aware about that, and he used to call IH every day to report how things were going on...that was his job. You don't need to call an ERV if you are just making a proof test: you can control the results by your own.
    IH and Rossi accepted to call Penon, let him install his instruments, they accepted to pay him, and he was an external person, not affiliated to Leonardo Corporation or IH. This sound quite "official". Why someone should make such a thing for a commercial test prepared just to evaluate if he is able to make the real GPT (as IH and someone else is trying to make us believe)?

  • Producing a possible short term COP of 1.3 is no where near the requirements of the GPT. 1.3 is typical of most active electrochemical LENR systems. Short time heat storage can do that. At COP 4 it should be able to turn some electric generating systems for net electrical output power. That is likely why IH required that of the GPT.

    As Shane told me days ago, this is why IH hired Murray:"In mid-2015, Industrial Heat hired Joseph Murray (“Murray”) to serve as Vice President of Engineering, and empowered him to assemble a team of engineers and scientists to elevate the level of Industrial Heat’s testing and evaluation of LENR technology.
    Among other things, one of the projects undertaken by that team was rigorous testing of the E-Cat IP."Maybe Dameron wasn't such an expert....... Remember that HE got that cop, and it doesn't mean that this WAS the maximum cop achievable by the Ecat.

  • IHFB - Does truth leave a smear? Go back 30 years and you'll learn that it was named "the Rossi process". Three decades of failure will be helpful in determining the final definition of the "Rossi Effect". No amount of spin, sockpuppet deployment and / or fake narrative can help him now. Mats was hoodwinked along with many other people including moi. I do find your ongoing attempts to bail on behalf of his sinking ship impressive - you are a loyal sailor but you must know that your captain and his ship (warship I think he called it at one time) are doomed by failure, deception and the recently uncovered truth.

  • I notice some are signed by Chris Lomax. any relation to "our" Abd Lomax?
    I wouldn't think so since I think he has all daughters.

    This was asked previously (when Abd was around) and he stated that there was no relation. Ironic coincidence though.


    I find it interesting that IH requested discovery to Aug 5 2016. Why then?????

    Not sure exactly, but presumably this covers the time up until most of the communication would be attorney-client priveleged. Rossi and crew seemed to really NOT want to give information past February. But of course there might be all sorts of juicy and incriminating information related to their discussions/decisions when wrapping things up - especially with JMP.

    In any case, there's not a lot if info in these documents:

    114 - Fabiani is granted permission to appear by Skype
    115 - Just a formal notice of filing (which is in 115-1, I believe)
    115.1 IH proposes the order for the judge regarding Third Parties' objections to discovery. IH's proposal essentially denies all of Johnson, Bass and Fabiani's objections.
    116 The judge accepts IH's proposed order to deny Third Parties' objections to discovery.

    So, in summary, the judge over-ruled all of Johnson, Bass and Fabiani's objections to IH's requests for discovery.

  • About rossi's pas, first I have data that are public and that I have found.
    All sources are very biased, for or agains Rossi.

    I remember that Rossi was cleared of fraud charges only ar 3rd trial, and some says because some evidences were removed/expired...
    His chemical process seems even if you defend the reality of the business to be unfinished, unindustrial.
    In a way the amateurism of rossi with E-cat test looked coherent with his amateurism about E-cat tests.
    He was condemned for tax evasion, environmental crimes, which mean he was both amateur with regulation, and morally loose about money... all coherent with his strange behavior (paranoid, greedy).
    Il Coriere Della Serra contain very negative articles, but I also found evidence of negative bias, few definitive facts, and evidences that mafia was involved in the high cost of cleaning and in the sabotage of the resort.
    the failure of TEG was strange, but there was plausible excuses. the test was about industrialization of a very expensive manual technology, based on well known anisotropic BiTe TEG material. The burning of his flat destroying his notes, looks "strange, and not pursuing look like a bad excuse for at least what looked a dead end (if you have achieved a result and lose all notes, your memory allow you to redo all the research quickly, at least remember the method and tricks)...
    There was enough ignored points and claimed excuse to let people like me with plausible scenario including moderate sincerity.
    I even heard that his boss paid the test, not the Army, with the hope to sell the results if test was positive...
    Skeptics were enough unconvincing or uninformed to let plausible excuses alive.

    Now, Dewey seems to have done a professional "boots on the ground" research, and removing his bitter style (Is he the same guy with a suit I have seen at RNBE2016, who intimidated me :huh: ), it seems there is a painful coherent story to be told.