Rossi vs. Darden developments [CASE CLOSED]

Quote from IH Fanboy

Jed,

You are seriously one of the most depressing people I have ever conversed with. I'm really left with no choice now but to go eat worms.

"The budget for this program this year is ¥3,410,000,000 [$27 million]," Iwasuji wrote. (Referring to 2015.)

http://news.newenergytimes.net…fund-lenr-research-again/

“The joint research team (Nano-METS) comprises six institutions: two companies, Technova and Nissan; and four universities, Tohoku, Kyushu, Nagoya and Kobe.”

http://news.newenergytimes.net…rship-in-lenrs-continues/

"Japanese industry, government, and academia announce the opening of a new cold fusion lenr R&D facility at the prestigious Tokohu University."

http://atom-ecology.russgeorge…-fusion-lenr-rd-facility/

Just a small sampling, by the way.

Alain summarized what is happening in India:

India: NTPC Organizes Third LENR-India Forum Meeting in Bengalore (involving NIAS/NETRA)

And as for Russia, Peter knows much more about what is going on. Here he summarizes the Russian National LENR Research Plan:

http://egooutpeters.blogspot.c…l-lenr-research-plan.html

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JedRothwell

Maybe your old friends and acquaintances have stopped notifying you because you are such a buzz kill.

Quote from JedRothwell

This makes no sense. If the old experiment is wrong, there is nothing to replicate. The effect has never been seen, and it probably does not exist.

Skilled people at I.H. spent a year looking for it, and found nothing, so I doubt there is anything to be found. If it does not exist, it isn't important. Right?

I suppose you might say "testing to see if the Rossi effect exists is important." But apart from Rossi's notoriety, I do not see why this particular claim is especially important. If I won the lottery, I would pay people to check 10 or 20 different claims. This one does not deserve a high priority. As I said, it was already checked by I.H. Assuming it does exist, what makes it more important than other claims? Lots of cold fusion effects might exist, and have been reported from time to time. Cold fusion with Ti and Au have been replicated. So I guess that makes them more promising than Rossi's unconfirmed nanoparticle Ni claim.

IH intended to steal the technology from Rossi so they would have had a lot of reason to lie about success. It's a lot easier to steal a technology that is deemed worthless.

Quote from sigmoidal

Thanks for those pictures, worth thousands of explanatory words.

I see the three PID's. You mention 3 thermocouples in Lugano, right?

I'm assuming that Rossi would say these are used to control the heating coils of the catalyzed reactor, no? (I have a simpler explanation)

I'm interested in how you interpret these, and what specifically are you calling our attention to?

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More worthless speculation. Just stop.

Quote from JedRothwell

There is no "reality of overall Rossi effect." It is all handwaving, speculation, error and fraud. There is a hint that it may be real, but there is way more evidence for, say, Au cold fusion than nanoparticle Ni. So if you are looking for a good prospect for commercialization, go for the gold.

There is hardly any solid evidence of Ni-H from anyone, despite years of effort. Thermocore was the best, I guess . . .

Rossi will never allow anyone to do a proper test. He never has, and by now it is clear that he never will. Not because a test would be difficult, or expensive. Heck, I could have done a proper test in a few days when I first heard from him. I offered to do one. He turned me down.

Okay, my test would not have been definitive, but it would have been much better than anything he has published, and wa-a-a-a-y better than the 1-year farce.

The fact that he refuses to do a test really tells you pretty much all you need to know about him. Defkalion also refused to let me or anyone else test their system. Clean Planet threatened me with a lawsuit because I looked at their MIT data. A pattern emerges! These organizations do not pass the "smell test." Okay, that is not an objective, scientific criterion, but common sense tells you they are not to be trusted, and you should not waste time on them. If you don't like palladium, go test titanium or gold instead. Why not?

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Jed, they simply do not want you stealing their technology, or trashing their results on the Internet.

Old guy,

I thought all of the copper transmutations were debunked and even recanted by Rossi

Of course that was iver 6 years ago so my memory may be incorrect

Quote from Roseland67

Old guy,

I thought all of the copper transmutations were debunked and even recanted by Rossi

Of course that was iver 6 years ago so my memory may be incorrect

I have no idea of what Rossi may have "recanted". He changes his story so often.

Doc. 168, a notice of hearing, now on the docket (nothing too exciting).

Quote from Rionrlty

IH intended to steal the technology from Rossi so they would have had a lot of reason to lie about success.

That would do no good. That strategy would not work. After I.H. steals it and begins selling it, the whole world would know it is real, and Rossi could then easily win any lawsuit, for practically any amount. The fact that I.H. initially persuaded people on the internet that the technology does not work, or even initially persuaded a jury, would make no difference once the money starts coming in.

Quote from JedRothwell

Here is the plan:

http://www.nedo.go.jp/content/100798677.pdf

This says the budget is $1 million per year for 20 years.

Here is the HTML main page for the project, 2016 edition:

http://www.nedo.go.jp/koubo/CA1_100134.html

I can't find a 2017 update. But the headline now says this is for 2017 (Heisei 29). You can Google translate this. Here is the budget in Google translate:

"III. Scale of R & D theme · NEDO burden ratio

About 100 million yen / (year · matter) (consigned: NEDO burden ratio 100%)

(Note) In the case of implementation only by universities / public research institutions, the scale is limited to 20 million yen."

100 million yen = $1 million

If only universities and public research institutions are involved, the budget will be $200,000. Bear in mind this is for 15 different topics. Which is not to say they will get RFPs on all 15. As they say in Japanese, this amount of money amounts to sparrow's tears.

The "opening period" for RFPs was last year, Heisei 28 (2016)

There is an inexplicable error in the Google translate. It got the year wrong:

公募開始予定日: 平成29年1月上旬

Scheduled start date of public offering: early January Heisei 30 [SHOULD BE 29!]

(Heisei 29 = 2017. Heisei 30 = 2018, next year)

Somewhere in all this verbiage I think I saw that the program is slated to last 20 years.

@Jed,

Thanks. More support (among a significant amount of other evidence) that Rossi has not killed the field. In fact, the field is burgeoning.

Quote from IH Fanboy

Thanks. More support (among a significant amount of other evidence) that Rossi has not killed the field. In fact, the field is burgeoning.

IHFB, I think this proves that your real name is Bagdad Bob.

Allan, sorry for doxing, I JUST CAN'T HELP IT!

Quote from sigmoidal

IFHB, I think this proves that your real name is Bagdad Bob.

Despite our differences, you and I share a strange wavelength. With the release of the recent Dewey/Darden scheming documents, Dewey stepped up his "IH is going to expose you rotten cockroaches" attacks to a whole new level. And I couldn't get images of Baghdad Bob out of my mind.

Quote from Wyttenbach

An important notice for everybody. ABD is a member of a large think-tank with focus on opinion making. His vita is well constructed: Building up ties to important people in the field, acting like a LENR supporter, but working for...

I looks like you and IH have something in common: Absolute no knowledge how real business (by using hands and logic thinking) is made...

IH made the Lugano reactor: If they now make everybody claim .. we don't know what we used... But do you really know who is IH ??, - a company consisting of one drawer, containing legal documents only, and no employees?

JED: IH has no employees!! What do mean? Skilled contractors under NDA??

Ni-Li-H LENR is an at least 6 dimensional optimization problem and if you have no dust of the physics behind the successfull process, then even if you get a COP of 6 or more you will not be able to reproduce it one day later!!! I can understand that this drives people into madness!

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Wyttenbach: I realise that you like arguing your case. But, what I can only call dishonest representation, does not advance your case.

IH made the Lugano reactor: If they now make everybody claim ..

The whole point of my post was that TD's e-mail was contemporaneous, and to an investor, not public. You leave this crucial, and logically important, information from your quote of my post. It would only have been another 10 words, deleted from the middle of what you quote. Nor do you provide any explanation that coheres with this inconvenient documentation.

In the case of Abd's comprehensive analysis I have yet to hear your detailed critique. Criticising Abd as being dishonest, rather than pointing out the errors in his argument, is typical of you but a poor show.

Quote from JedRothwell

That would do no good. That strategy would not work. After I.H. steals it and begins selling it, the whole world would know it is real, and Rossi could then easily win any lawsuit, for practically any amount. The fact that I.H. initially persuaded people on the internet that the technology does not work, or even initially persuaded a jury, would make no difference once the money starts coming in.

He could have given it to one of the other researchers they claim to be supporting, had them present it as their own and completely circumvented Rossi. If you think there wouldn't be takers for that amount of money then you are much more naive than I thought. This is where the grown-ups spin their webs and nobody invests that much money and doesn't play the game for keeps.

So - I wanted to understand in more detail the [PROPOSED] Order 160.1 on the docket. It is, apparently, a necessary part of the legal process that anyone asking for Sanctions enclose a proposed order, sort of like telling your parents what you want for Christmas:

http://coldfusioncommunity.net…-can-it-get/#comment-1632

That was what I expected - just slightly weird that Plaintiff's get to write such a thing in this form.

Abd, while viewed as corrupt and in league with the Evil Empire by a few here, has proved to be a reliable and well-informed resource for decoding this legal stuff.

"Last time i checked in on the situation the government had initiated half a dozen projects.

If that were true, Srinivasan or someone else in India would have reported it at the ICCF conference, or some other conference. We would have heard about it. Things like public funding of experiments in cold fusion are not kept secret.

Nothing like that was described in the 2015 issue of Current Science:"


In March 2016 a follow up meeting of LENR India was held at the National Institute of Advanced studies in Bangalore. At that meeting almost a dozen institutes and universities agreed to initiate CF research. This was catalysed due to much attention in the Rossi reactor, the Lugano experiments and the Parkhomov replications. Also claims of replications from other Russian and Chinese research groups.

Then in April as IH contested the test claims and the subsequent court battle followed - still ongoing - the interest and enthusiasm diminished. At the moment there are only three groups involved in LENR+ (Ni - H) technology tests. The situation is such - the groups are waiting for more information to come out. At the moment, other options for moving forward with CF research is being considered.

I was surprised to get this update because I had not anticipated the interest was so big for LENR+, I had assumed the new initiatives for funding was more general and more focused on Pd type of core research. Apparently, they where mostly interested in Nickel Hydrogen technology.

Quote from Rionrlty

He could have given it to one of the other researchers they claim to be supporting, had them present it as their own and completely circumvented Rossi.

That would not work. There is a paper trail of patent filings and experiments proving that Rossi invented the device. Rossi could easily prove this claim is false.

You scenarios fail for common sense reasons.

Quote from JedRothwell

That would not work. There is a paper trail of patent filings and experiments proving that Rossi invented the device. Rossi could easily prove this claim is false.

You scenarios fail for common sense reasons.

IH will claim that Rossi's patents are invalid (oh wait, they already have). Then, when me356 provides his information more openly and/or when BLP introduces their first complete prototype to the public, IH will once again claim to be working with NiH systems, while proceeding with their own patent filings, partnering with a manufacturer, and eventually introducing their own IH-cat.