Rossi vs. Darden developments [CASE CLOSED]

Quote from Roseland67

Was the energy used to prep the experiment and heat the vacuum chamber subtracted from the excess heat gained?

Was there any noticed transmutation?

If so, what was it?

Mizuno isn't Rossi.

I never discuss work in progress by any researcher. You have to wait for the researcher to publish. Or contact him or her directly. Some are happy to share information before it is published. Others prefer not to.

As a copy editor I never discuss unpublished information. That's a violation of academic standards. I also never upload papers without permission.

Quote from LFH Sam

His [Murray's] simulation might not either have taken in consideration the possibility to dissipate heat by opening a door, and air conditioned working areas

It did take into consideration an open door. The simulation showed that would have little effect. He said so in the deposition. However, the simulation was mainly designed to simulate the situation in the warehouse when Murray himself was there, and when he made observations. The opposing lawyer kept saying, "but what if the door was usually open" or what if this, or what if that other condition was in place. Murray kept responding, "that wasn't the condition when I was there." When he was there, he survived. He was not cooked. He wasn't even uncomfortable. His simulation showed that with even a fraction of 1 MW he would have been cooked.

I'm not on any side, just want to KNOW

Jed,

A. You have, again elegantly not answered re Murray about 40mm

diam steam pipe. Is this statement of Joe- truth, error, lie, imagination?

B. On your deathbed you will surely whisper "half full pipe at Doral!" so both Penon and Rossi have lied that it was full, you and your invisible photographies are granitic proofs of the contrary.

Do not forget that the flowmeter works starting from 0.3 bars, that is a 3 meters high watr column...OK.

C. You see here how many raw data were collected and recorded, how the manometer was measuring a few millibars adove and under atm. pressure and this means the JMP heat consuming system- unknown for you but known for the Judge has worked and condensation of steam created'vacuum' (relative) driving force in the system.

I predict soon with your ideas re the Plant you will be unhappy as a jobless meteorologist.

peter

I think the pipe diameter was an error or a miscommunication. The problem lies when you think you have this big list of gotchas but don't bother trying to figure out whether they are likely or not.

Rossi using a single DN40 pipe was unlikely whether he is a fraud or not.

For me, the almost perfect atmospheric pressure for at least much of three days is proof that nothing was happening, or that the sensor was in fact measuring atmospheric pressure instead of the inside of a stream delivery pipe.

Was the sensor screwed into a blind hole? How does the stream pressure otherwise match atmospherics? How does the Plant detect a load variation and compensate without tipping a delicate balance between vacuum and pressure?

Quote from Paradigmnoia

For me, the almost perfect atmospheric pressure for at least much of three days is proof that nothing was happening, or that the sensor was in fact measuring atmospheric pressure instead of the inside of a stream delivery pipe.

Perhaps it was broken. As noted here several times, it was not designed to be used at temperatures this high.

JedRothwell ,

The pressure sensor seems to have been working. It reports in an barA, and it was reporting a constant 1 bar, or at least the digital equivalent of almost exactly 1 bar.

This is at least for the few days in April from Fabiani's spreadsheet that Rossi had a piece of.

More strange is the blank part of the spreadsheet, where the 1/2 hour sample intervals are there, but the data is not.

Quote from Alan Smith

If the steam-pipes were all shipped to Miami along with the other (at some later point despoiled) piping they should have been the correct size for the job. Some-one in NC (Murray?) would have done the sums and ordered them.

Yes but remember that Rossi did not use the plumbing set up by Murray and even threw out the tank. There is no reason to believe what size pipe was used in Florida. That is why the spoliation issue is important. If Rossi threw away the pipes than there is no way to prove what size was actually used and the burden of proof is on Rossi to come up with something that shows the pipe size or the court will have to accept the adverse view.

DT April 1, 2017 at 3:21 AM

Dear Andrea

The presentation of the QuarkX will be made - measuring the efficiency
with the Boltzmann and Wien equations or with standard calorimetry
heating a fluid?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Warm Regards, D.T.
------------
Andrea Rossi April 1, 2017 at 10:16 AM

DT: With standard calorimetry heating a fluid.

Warm Regards, A.R.

Remember exhibit 5 (email from Murray) and how some people here thought it was bad that Penon hadn't answered? Here's what Penon has to say about it:

Quote

Q Did you answer all of Mr. Murray's
12 questions when you spoke to him at the conclusion of
13 the test?
14 A Yes.
15 Q Has Mr. Murray since posed additional
16 questions?
17 A Can you repeat again?
18 Q Has Mr. Murray, since that time, requested
19 you answer any additional questions?
20 A Yes, he did.
21 Q Did you answer those questions?
22 A No.
23 Q Why not?
24 A Because it was a repetition of the same
25 question raised at Doral.

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So Penon claims he didn't answer the e-mail because Murray had already asked those questions.

There is something I do not understand from the Penon collected data though a VPN. If he only came 4 times (and he was the ERV) why was the data transcribed to paper? That bothers me. One simple power "extended" power failure on his UPS could cause issues with this setup. Regardless of the devices involved.

That would lead possibly to an extended loss of data, this would I would think be kinda bad for Mr. Rossi as his test data would not be valid for that block in time when it was not recorded thus invalidating the data putting 'his possible GPT' at risk. From earlier in this thread another user said they would not use a laptop here to collect data. This bothers me as I have used them at least several hundred times as heads to download or in some cases upload data mostly with rs-232 but now with VPN's. It is SOP as putting a head on a device, and it is often called for at least once in its life regardless.

Regardless the laptop could safely and securely store and move the data. Even if rs-232 they all have enough built in tools to capture "blobs" of data that could be parsed off into a CSV file for a spreadsheet.

I do not understand the need, it leads me to speculate that it (paper transcription) was done on purpose. Can someone provide a reason?

Quote from LENR Calender

I think the pipe diameter was an error or a miscommunication. The problem lies when you think you have this big list of gotchas but don't bother trying to figure out whether they are likely or not.

Rossi using a single DN40 pipe was unlikely whether he is a fraud or not.

If I recall correctly, Murray testified in a deposition that the piping inside the amongst the reactors was DN40. He testified that he couldn't tell what the main steam pipe to the customer was because it was covered with insulation but he imagined it was DN80.

In Exhibit 5, the letter to Penon, Murray said piping was DN40 which as many people figured out couldn't be correct for the main steam pipe. So his statement was only partially correct (or partially wrong depending on what kind of person you are).

Of course we don't know what the main piping ever was because it was removed and re-purposed by Rossi but I don't think Murray ever explicitly and intentionally called out that pipe as DN40.

Sorry no references for this but I don't have the time to dig them up. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

Quote from JedRothwell

Come to think of it, this makes no sense. This is also fake data. Because --

To reduce the total daily volume from 36,000 to 18,000, you would have to turn off half the reactors and half of the flow (down to 750 L/h) at exactly the time you write down the daily total. Then you would have to turn it on again 24 hours later. Penon says Rossi wrote down the data in the evening. Say it was at 7:30 p.m. He would have to write down "36,000" turn off half the reactors, tweak the flow rate to make it exactly half of what it was (18,000), and then turn on the next day at 7:30 p.m.

Note that the next day it is back to 36,000. You would have turn the reactors and pumps back on at 7:30 p.m. and get the flow right back up to 1,500 L/h.

In real life, suppose they turned off at 10:00 a.m., did some repairs or cleaning, and then restarted at 4:00 p.m. That would be 6 hours at half the flow. The daily total would be 31,500 which would show up as 31,000.

It is extremely unlikely he could shut down in the evening, tweak the flow to exactly half, and then wait until the same hour and minute the next day before turning on and tweaking the flow back up, again to an exact amount. Why would anyone bother to make the flow exactly 750 L/h anyway? Why not 810 or 680? Making it exactly 750 for no particular reason makes no sense.

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Now that you've looked at the actual data I agree with you. Depending on when half the reactors were turned on and off we'd get an intermediate value on each day.

Quote from PeterMetz

In Exhibit 5, the letter to Penon, Murray said piping was DN40 which as many people figured out couldn't be correct for the main steam pipe.

It probably was correct. It just meant there could not be as much steam as Penon claimed, but that is obvious for many other reasons. Penon and Rossi never responded to Exhibit 5, so I assume everything in it is correct. If they had answers, they would have given them.

Rossi apparently ripped out the pipes to hide evidence, but perhaps there are still holes in the wall.

Anyway, DN40 or 80 makes no difference. There are, as I said, many other reasons showing why the claims are impossible and the data is fake.