Rossi vs. Darden developments [CASE CLOSED]

    Quote from JedRothwell

    I agree, that is the key question. As I said before, this is like drilling for oil. It can be hard to say when you have hit "suitcase rock" and it is time to give up, pack up, and go home. For me it would be the time you point to. When Darden tells Rossi the control produced as much apparent heat as the test sample, and Rossi refuses to acknowledge that, I would say it's over.


    The only thing I would consider after that would be for Rossi to hand over a single unit from the 1 MW reactor and have it tested by experts such as Murray, in NC. If he refused, I would have ended it. Perhaps I have a lower threshold than I.H. because I have seen many, many cold fusion claims fail.

    yes, turn over a system to someone else, but I would only want 1kW not 1MW. I just don't like the idea of trying to do a good control run at 1MW.

    Quote from IHSupporter

    yes, turn over a system to someone else, but I would only want 1kW not 1MW. I just don't like the idea of trying to do a good control run at 1MW.

    Yup. That's why I said "a single unit." I guess that's supposedly more than 1 KW.


    Calorimetry is easiest and most accurate between 10 W and 100 W, in my experience. It starts to get dangerous above 1 KW. Below 1 W, it starts to get difficult. It would be best to avoid phase changes (steam production).


    Some people have the odd notion that it is easier to measure a large effect, or that a large effect or a large machine is somehow more convincing.

    Quote from JedRothwell

    Awww, gee . . . Are we hurting your itty-witty feewings??? Poor baaaybee.

    Mr. Rothwell,


    I understand your client wants you to react to every post coming from a (potential) Rossi supporter. However, your latest reply is of such an abject low level that i cannot help myself to let you know. Please, beware of the slippery "quality floor" of this discussion. You (and your reputation) might slip and get hurt.


    Cheers,


    JB

    Quote from we_cat_global

    I understand your client wants you to react to every post coming from a (potential) Rossi supporter. However, your latest reply is of such an abject low level that i cannot help myself to let you know.

    You are so kind! But please, don't sacrifice yourself on my account. I'm . . . I'm just not worth it. (sniff) (Wipes tears from eyes)

    Quote from we_cat_global

    Please, beware of the slippery "quality floor" of this discussion. You (and your reputation) might slip and get hurt.

    Oh thank you Mr. Concern Troll.

    Quote from IH Fanboy

    Wow, the venom! The personal attacks! The foul language! You folks seem desperate as of late.


    I'm not sure why this seems 'desperate' to you. All these fake things Rossi has done are known facts. For example, Rossi himself stated that he has a Masters Degree in Engineering from Kensington U., and that he got credit for his patent applications. (He neglected to state that it was shut down by CA for fraud, was not accredited, and that there were no Master's level engineering courses offered by the 'University'). That's not desperate, it's just true.


    You know, you just want the truth, right? So there it is.


    All the other things, like serving time in jail, Petrodragon and thermoelectric failure, etc., that's all known to be true too. So that's good, right?


    Or is it that some truth is 'good' truth and other truth is 'desparate'? Glad you have that special ability to figure out which is which, as I certainly don't.

    Quote from sigmoidal

    All the other things, like serving time in jail, Petrodragon and thermoelectric failure, etc., that's all known to be true too. So that's good, right?


    Yep, serving time in jail on charges for which he was eventually acquitted. Fair huh?


    As for Petrodragon, read Matts book and maybe you will gain an understanding. In all of your getting, get an understanding.


    Thermoelectric failure? Sure, his prototypes having high performance could not be produced at scale. This is all documented well and the US government never sought any punitive action against Rossi, and never requested the funding be returned.


    The character assassination isn't called for. It makes you all seem very desperate.

    Quote from JedRothwell

    Of course they are in it for the money! They are venture capitalists.


    Seriously, what a stupid thing to say.


    Guy comes into a restaurant, sits down at a table, looks over a menu. IH Fanboy the waiter says: "I won't serve you! You are only here for the food."

    Well, I guess I am un-banned, at least for the moment. Unless I misinterpreted things (and I don't think I did) this kind of rhetoric is why so many of us were banned to begin with. Jed Rothwells constant and unreasonable verbal flagellation of anyone who doesn't agree with him (usually IH Fanboy) is disgusting and even more discouraging is the moderators apparent reluctance to hold him to the same high standards as many of the rest of us. Alan, Eric where are you on this?

    Rionrlty,

    I just deleted my comment (it was overboard). I am with you on this. IHFB does his homework and does follow up on an idea an provides good questions. Talking down to someone or using baby talk gets me. But I am not one to judge. But I would like it called to my attention if I do it. I would assume that Jed would like to know also. Maybe I would not like being told it at the time but I would appreciate it in the long run. It would make me a better advocate of my position.

    • Official Post
    Quote from Rionrlty

    Well, I guess I am un-banned, at least for the moment. Unless I misinterpreted things (and I don't think I did) this kind of rhetoric is why so many of us were banned to begin with. Jed Rothwells constant and unreasonable verbal flagellation of anyone who doesn't agree with him (usually IH Fanboy) is disgusting and even more discouraging is the moderators apparent reluctance to hold him to the same high standards as many of the rest of us. Alan, Eric where are you on this?


    Watching, as usual.


    Personally, I would not dream of banning Jed unless he went much further overboard than he currently does, he is most welcome here. As a long-time observer and documenter of the whole field of LENR he is a kind of national treasure - a treasure who uses his real name, too. I understand that Jed is possibly almost as grouchy as I can be, though less grouchy than some, and that he gets frustrated when other people fail to see things in the same light as he does. Natural enough since he feels he is working from a sound knowledge base about the situation between Rossi and IH. So long as he doesn't start threatening to launch munitions at those who hold opposing points of view he is safer here than some I won't mention.


    The very last thing this forum needs to be is an echo-chamber for one point of view on Rossi - or indeed anything else. There are other forums for that. Disparate points of view are acceptable, always. Bullying, doxxing, trolling, insulting, threatening, - all banning offences usually after several warnings, but a little grumpiness is mostly acceptable.

    @Jed


    IH here have all the aces when it comes to the technical arguments, and the legal arguments. There are a few here who have a strange and biased slant on this issue (to me, at least) who still seem to be supporting Rossi or at least determined to paint IH as bad, and who use convoluted arguments to support this. No doubt they view me as biased.


    That is Ok by me, all sides should be heard, mainly because that makes it easier to understand the weakness of some arguments.


    It does not help this process when things degenerate to a brawl not about facts but about the character of those posting.


    RR and IHFB have in the past often brought things down to this level, and we_cat_global seems to be continuing (with the your client comment). It would be great if you (and I, etc) restrained ourselves from such personal comments.


    Reading what you have written above it is mostly fine, about the topic not the posters. Where it goes over the top (and I've done this myself) is: If you find the evidence clouded, it is because you do not understand elementary physics. You demonstrated your ignorance when you said that a leak from the pipe produced steam. Of course it did.


    The temptation to reply like that is great, I know, but it inflames the argument and you could equally have made the point as: Your position that the evidence is clouded comes from your incorrect analysis of a straightforward physical system where (for example) you incorrectly interpret the significance of a leak producing steam. That rewrite has the merit that your comment can be challenged on purely technical grounds if it is untrue, and it does not make assumptions about the character, motivation, or intellectual ability of the poster.


    Keeping to more neutral statements then prevents things degenerating to the extent of:


    Are we hurting your itty-witty feewings???

    Wow, the venom! The personal attacks! The foul language! You folks seem desperate as of late.


    @moderators

    It might be helpful to give warnings, not banning, if you think anyone has overstepped the mark on the last few pages. By my count that is we_cat_global, Jed, IHFB. But when things get heated we can all do it, and I certainly have.


    Regards, THH

    Dewey who will permitted to return soon at least had a kind of charm and very peculiar sense of humor plus sincerity, Abd has a prodigious memory- but Rothwell is simply double distilated illwill and rudeness.

    It was very disturbing watching him on the short, abrupt way from commiting character assassination to making character suicide. His character, trustworthiness, credibility and moral image are all dead for now.

    He has old so many dreadfully untrue things (inspired by Murray and Smith) about instruments and measurements

    of the Doral Plant that it is elementary decency to apologize

    but he has not the slightest intention to do this he respects

    the decalog of the oppressors.

    He is not able to fake intelligence and/or competence so has to throw with horseshit in those who disagree with him.

    If I think about past- he always was a manipulator- by division fiercely attacking the skeptics and by association he obviously was convinced that by comparing cold fusion with aviation

    historically thinking, cold fusion will start a fast triumphal march. It did not happened.

    I am also asking the moderators to tell Jed to abstain from insults. BTW- what i wrote here are actually compliments.


    peter

    • Official Post

    @ THH


    Warnings are always or often made before someone gets banned, though some may claim it was a surprise. Offenders may be warned publicly in the forum or privately. Dewey had quite a few warnings, for example. I (and other mods) have also created private conversations with some of our less sociable members in which we have sought to illustrate why they are cruising for a bruising. To think that banning comes as a surprise to anyone would be a mistake, for some it is like a Purple Heart that shows they were wounded in the fight against stupidity, banning is actively sought because it confirms their own importance. And just sometimes, they get their wish. In general the forum is better for it.


    BTW, there is a little warning triangle with an exclamation mark inside it attached to every post -'report content' - it flags up a moderation request. Use it whenever you feel it is necessary.

    To IHH


    Dear THH,


    you wrote

    IH here have all the aces when it comes to the technical arguments, and the legal arguments. There are a few here who have a strange and biased slant on this issue (to me, at least) who still seem to be supporting Rossi or at least determined to paint IH as bad, and who use convoluted arguments to support this. No doubt they view me as biased.


    If this is so I have a humble request and a raher angry question to you:

    a) The request

    - can you make a very short summary of the aces (5 or 5?)

    of IH- legal and technical that make their situation so fine? Based on the Court documents, obviously not on what we discuss here. Thanks.


    b) The question

    Again if IH is a potential easy winner (i.a. the ERV report is

    already destroyed) then why is necessary to organize the present Rossi character assassination ritual in the frame of a thread dedicated to the Trial?

    It looks as a compensation, replacement for something

    more efficient that is missing. Thanks again.

    peter

    Quote from Alan Smith

    Peter Gluck


    Your views on this are well-known and noted Peter. However, I'm not sure they are helpful in this instance, we seek to put oil on troubled waters.


    PLEASE GET THIS THREAD BACK CLOSER TO THE TOPIC 'Rossi vs Darden.'

    Dear Alan,


    What i am writing are simply answers to views also well known

    plus to insults addressed to IHFB and me directly. Otherwise

    I do not care or rowdies. Please do not be angry with me, i answered a nasty provocation.

    peter

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