Brilliant Light Power - Dec 16, 2016 UK Roadshow

Quote from Deleo

Tungsten has a melting point of 6100 degrees Fahrenheit. Something beyond any known chemical reaction is taking place for that to happen. And Mills didn't want it to happen.

I think you meant to say that Mills claims the Tungsten was vaporized, not melted. And he knows this because spectral lines for W atoms appeared in the spectrometer trace. The boiling point for W is about 10.6k degrees F. And we know that this is difficult to do because defense technologist have searched for centuries for the most efficient way to destroy heavy metal (i.e. tank armor). If all it took to win a tank battle is to trot out a couple of hair dryers and melt your opponent's defensive shield then I think we'd have that kind of weaponry by now.

Quote from optiongeek

I think you meant to say that Mills claims the Tungsten was vaporized, not melted. And he knows this because spectral lines for W atoms appeared in the spectrometer trace. The boiling point for W is about 10.6k degrees F. And we know that this is difficult to do because defense technologist have searched for centuries for the most efficient way to destroy heavy metal (i.e. tank armor). If all it took to win a tank battle is to trot out a couple of hair dryers and melt your opponent's defensive shield then I think we'd have that kind of weaponry by now.

The chemical origin of the power density required to vaporize tungsten in massive quantities is what is inconsistent about the Mills theory. The hydrino only contributes just a few electron volts per hydogen atom. A post upstream on this thread asserts that 100,000 cubic feet of hydrogen is required to sustain that level of power density.

No, the answers is that the SunCell is a LENR nuclear device in which transmutation is occurring. When the SunCell is released to the public, and a LENR interested group does a transmutation test on the ash from the sun cell, then the jig will be up for Mills and the preponderance of his patent applications will be invalidated.

This is why Mills is leasing them. The SunCells will still be BrLP's property. I think the leasing agreement will stipulate that you cannot look inside, and the device will be locked with a digital code to access. Only the maintenance people will be allowed to open it.

Quote from axil

A post upstream on this thread asserts that 100,000 cubic feet of hydrogen is required to sustain that level of power density.

This is incorrect. In a post (https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/g…versations/messages/11346) from Mills just yesterday he provides the energy content as "50 MJ/mole H2(1/4) production." Let's use water as the fuel instead of hydrogen since we don't need to worry about pressure. A mole of H20 is 18g, or 0.018 liters. Assuming 40% efficiency, a generator producing 250kW electric output will burn 600kJ * 3600 * 0.018 / 5.0 e7 ~= 3/4 liter of water per hour. Or about one 5-gallon bucket of the wet stuff every day.

Quote

I think you meant to say that Mills claims the Tungsten was vaporized, not melted.

But he does it in pressence of water vapor all the time - or not? The steam becomes corrosive at high temperatures thanx to dissociation of water into hydrogen and oxygen. For example, the mixture of water and hot iron shavings burns like the thermite. In addition, despite its high melting point, the tungsten isn't particularly resistant to heat, once the oxygen gets involved, as the tungsten trioxide is quite volatile (1,700 °C) and it sublimes out of surface of metal. I'm not saying, that new physics doesn't run there, but the burning of tungsten or molybdenum electrodes within electric arc inside steam is nothing what should surprise people here.

Quote from Deleo

I think the leasing agreement will stipulate that you cannot look inside, and the device will be locked with a digital code to access. Only the maintenance people will be allowed to open it.

No one would be allowed to sell, own or operate such machines in any first world country. All machines have to be certified by government safety regulators and by UL. UL demands full blueprints and a detailed list of all components. Dozens of actual machines have to be provided to regulators and to UL for testing, including destructive testing. The mechanism cannot be kept secret.

Locking the machine would also violate safety regulations. You have to have access to all parts of the machine in case of fire or a short circuit. Dangerous, high voltage wires have to be in bright orange insulation so the fire dept. can easily identify them. There are all kinds of other safety regs.

Furthermore, the only thing a company can do to discourage people from opening a machine is to say the warranty will be void if you open the machine. They have no legal means to prevent you. If a machine like this were real, every major industrial manufacturer on earth would get one and reverse engineer it within months.

Quote from Deleo

This is why Mills is leasing them. The SunCells will still be BrLP's property. I think the leasing agreement will stipulate that you cannot look inside, and the device will be locked with a digital code to access. Only the maintenance people will be allowed to open it.

This behavior on the part of Mills is inconsistent. He is telling his investors in his sales pitch how the SunCell works in great detail. But then when his customers want to verify Mill's truthfulness, when his customers what to verify what Mills is saying is true, Mills puts a lockdown of information strategy onto his product. Why would Mills do such a thing if he has nothing to hide, and if his theory of science is the true one?

He owes it to modern civilization to prove that his theory of science is the true one. An open access to the insides of the SunCell would allow this proved to be seen clearly and without restriction.

Why has Mills avoided doing a transmutation test to prove that his tech is not LENR?

Will Mills design include the venting of hydrogen feedstock to the outside of the SunCell to cover up the lack of hydrogen consumption of the SunCell? Such inconsistent behavior is the hallmark of flimflammery. I will be watching for such behavior that will prove that Mills is a Flim Flam man.

Quote from JedRothwell

All machines have to be certified by government safety regulators and by UL.

Please show me a law that says 'all machines' must be certified by the government or UL

Quote from zeus46

Please show me a law that says 'all machines' must be certified by the government or UL

Federal and state government safety regs cover all energy related machines such as generators or batteries. See, for example:

https://www.cpsc.gov/Regulatio…andards/Topics/Batteries/

The requirement for UL certification is not according to law. The insurance companies demand it. UL is "Underwriter's Laboratory," where underwriter is "a company liable for insured losses in return for a fee." If your product is not certified by UL, no vendor will take it. No store or other retail or wholesale outlet such as Amazon will stock it.

http://www.ul.com/aboutul/

Quote from THHuxley

If this is an argument for Mills it is a very bad one. Theoretical Physics is profoundly simple and beautiful, but not intuitive or concrete.

Quote from THHuxley

If you look at the maths of QM it is so very beautiful and coherent, because simple. And it leads ineluctably to things very different from our intuition, and very precisely in accordance with experiment. So you want something more concrete. Fine, but that does not make you right, and it is an attempt to make the universe bend to the shape of your conceptualisation, when better would be to attempt the opposite.

@THH: Happy new year and thanks for the QM reference!

On page 15, in the introduction of his GUT-CP theory Mills explains in detail where QM fails. In fact he cites others, who explain why QM fails.

The beauty of maths within QM comes from the bilinear form of the equations, which allows you to convolute a time dependent part and a location dependent one, to describe the “reality” in one complex huge formula.

The radial solutions of QM are more or less known since Maxwell and are based on spherical harmonics. Luckily for Schrödinger/Bohr etc., the radial solution was sufficient to correctly deviate all the energy levels of the hydrogen atom. For that reason it was not important in which mathematical form the radial solution was presented!

But the big mess of QM starts with the quantum numbers associated with the non radial (ϕ, φ) representation of the wave function, which has to many degrees of freedom!
Further on QM delivers no explanation how the momentum of a photon is generated out of the momentum of the orbit. A deduction of the electron g-factor is simply impossible with classical QM, where as with GUT-CP you get it from first (Maxwell) principles.

Just read the “introduction” page 15 ff. Of Mills GUT-CP which he titles: SHORTCOMINGS OF QUANTUM THEORY AND REASONS FOR A COMPLETE REVISION OF ATOMIC THEORY...

May be we should start a new thread to explain the benefits of GUT-CP, what it has in common with QM and what the differences are.

PS: The hydrino-theory is just a mathematical consequence of the Mill's formalism. We can easily note that some of it's explanations are as unphysical as current QM and certainly need further explanation – like QM needed and now exists thanks to Mills.

Quote from JedRothwell

The requirement for UL certification is not according to law. The insurance companies demand it. UL is "Underwriter's Laboratory," where underwriter is "a company liable for insured losses in return for a fee." If your product is not certified by UL, no vendor will take it. No store or other retail or wholesale outlet such as Amazon will stock

Then you'll no doubt agree Mills was very smart to select an engineering firm that is UL-certified to develop the prototypes. His devices will be UL compliant on day one.

Quote from optiongeek

His devices will be UL compliant on day one.

In that case the mechanism will not be secret. It will either be patented or it will effectively be in the public domain.

In any case, locking the device or trying to prevent the user from looking inside it will not work. It will be reverse engineered.

It is not clear to me whether Mills plans to try to lock the device, or whether that is speculation by people here. Anyway, that will not work.

Several inventors and companies such as Defkalion came up with this idea of keeping the device secret by physically locking it, or by having it self-destruct if you open it. Such methods would never be allowed by regulators. They would be dangerous.

Mills has stated that he wont sell the Sun Cell (pun intended) but will lease the device based on its KW/H output. As long as he can deliver on his guarantee of the amount of output and the reliability of the device the customer doesn't need to know how it functions, just that it does.

Quote from JedRothwell

Several inventors and companies such as Defkalion came up with this idea of keeping the device secret by physically locking it, or by having it self-destruct if you open it. Such methods would never be allowed by regulators.

@JED: One of the fundaments of capitalism is property: Everything you buy is your property. A self destruction is a delayed action on your property and certainly the seller will owe you a replacement. Thus no reseller will list such an item!
But: Delayed actions are not forbidden at all. They are needed for safety reasons, thus "legal things" can become very complicated.. for both sides...

Quote from JedRothwell

In that case the mechanism will not be secret. It will either be patented or it will effectively be in the public domain.

Mills has been quite open about the design - every single component has been identified in detail. He even recently discussed the source of stable oxide used to form the nascent H2O which until now had been considered confidential. Whatever schemes you are imaging for Mills "locking down" the design are entirely of your own invention.

He has stated publicly that the device will be protected by patents and other intellectual property rights. He has been working with prestige IP law firms to ensure this and preserving IP rights may indeed be a factor in the decision to lease rather than sell. IP laws leave him little choice. If he were not diligent in asserting and defending his IP, he could inadvertently put them at risk. Significantly, I believe BrLP will require any basic research using the device (or even non-BrLP sanctioned replications of the effect) to be done under license as a way to protect those IP rights. And if I were drafting that license agreement, I would be sure to include a clause that assigns all IP rights on new discoveries back to BrLP. This way, if a leased unit was purloined and hacked, BrLP would have a clear right to dispute any subsequent IP claims from that act. With minor exceptions related to pure "tinkering", IP laws are pretty clear. If someone owns a patent you can't use that idea to invent around it without permission. The exceptions to this precedent would not allow any commercial endeavor. Yes, this will rankle. But it's entirely within BrLP's rights (and fiduciary responsibility) to do so.

Mills has a 25 year head-start. He's going to own the technology rights for a long time unless someone takes them from him by force.

Quote from optiongeek

If someone owns a patent you can't use that idea to invent around it without permission.

This sounds incorrect to me, unless I've misunderstood your meaning. My understanding is that if someone finds a way to invent around the claims of the patent, disclosing a device that operates in a similar but novel manner that is not covered by the original patent, there is nothing for the inventor to assert, and no permission is needed.