Rossi and Hadronics discussed by Ugo Abundo.

  • My apologies if this is old news, but I only just came across this paper by Ugo Abundo (for whom I have the greatest respect) discussing theoretical aspects of the Rossi LENR system by reference to the works of the ever litigious Santilli. Who I like a lot less.

    Ugo Abundo

    Neural Calculus Lab at J. Von Neumann Foundation, via Clelia 15, 00181
    Rome, Italy; Email: [email protected]


    A recent, independent-party report shows that Rossi’s E-Cat reactor produces an excess heat that cannot be explained via quantum mechanical or chemical processes, thus supporting the possible presence of new nuclear processes.

    In this paper, we recall the studies by Don Carlo Borghi on the synthesis of the neutron from the Hydrogen, and the systematic, mathematical, theoretical andexperimental studies conducted by R. M. Santilli on the neutron synthesis via the covering hadronic mechanics and chemistry. We review in particular the detection of an apparent new bound state of a proton and an electron called
    ”neutroid,” which is solely predicted by hadronic mechanics with the characteristics of the neutron except spin zero, thus being different than Mills hydrino.

    We then recall Santilli’s new series of ”nucleoids” which are given by conventional nuclides when absorbing a neutroid or nucleoid, and illustrate their esoenergetic decay into stable nuclides. In this paper, we submit the hypothesis, apparently for the first time, that Rossi’s E-Cat reactor converts, at least in part, Hydrogen into Santilli’s neutroids by therefore avoiding the Coulomb repulsion between protons and nuclei present in current interpretation. The use of Santilli’s nucleoids and their esoenergetic decay then allow a quantitative interpretation of the excess heat in Rossi’s reactor. We close the paper by indicating the reasons according to which Santilli’s new species of MagneHydrogen offers realistic possibilities to enhance the energy output for Rossi’s as well as other Hydrogen-based nuclear transmutations.…aper-2014_Ottimizzato.pdf

  • A couple of things To note are:

    -Hadronic Journal is Santilli's own journal. He claims he was forced to self publish since no one wanted To publish his work.

    - even if Santilli is a crank, his Hadronic mechanics is taken seriously by some researchers, Unfortunately they all end publishing in one of Santilli's journalls

    I certainly Hope to see LENR helping humans to blossom, and I'm here to help it happen.

  • Does the conditions below are similar to quarkx?

    Don Borghi’s experiment is reviewed in detail in volume [2b] (see in particular L. Daddi
    [2c] and P. Giubbilini [2d]). We here merely recall that the experiment was conducted
    via a cylindrical metallic chamber (called ”klystron”) filled up with a partially ionized
    hydrogen gas at a fraction of 1bar pressure, traversed by an electric arc with about 500V
    and 10mA as well as by microwaves with 1010s
    frequency. In the cylindrical exterior of
    the chamber the experimentalists placed various materials suitable to become radioactive
    when subjected to a neutron flux (such as gold, silver and others). Following exposures of
    the order of weeks, the experimentalists reported nuclear transmutations due to a claimed
    neutron flux of the order of 104
    cps, apparently confirmed by beta emissions not present in
    the original material.


    there is also R.Mills connection (hydrino = arcogen?)

    First interpretation: this possibility is along Rutherford’s historical legacy (1), namely,
    that the ”entities” produced by the electric arc, rather than being neutrons, are a new
    bound state of protons and electrons at short distances. In fact, the entity depicted in Fig.
    2 is a Boson with spin 0 here tentatively called arcogen in the Greek meaning of being
    ”arc generated”), while the neutron as notoriously spin 1
    . Hence, the arcogen rest energy
    is expected to be the sum of the rest energies of proton and electron (938.78MeV ) less
    a large Coulomb binding energy, thus being considerable smaller than the neutron rest
    energy (939.56MeV ).
    This alternative is due to the possibilities that: i) ordinary stable nuclei absorb the arcogens;
    ii) said nuclei, rather than the arc, synthesize neutrons according to the standard
    model, i.e., reaction (2); and iii) ordinary neutrons are then released by the nuclei as part of
    their radioactive process. In this case counter PM1703GN does indeed detects neutrons,
    but they are of nuclear origin, rather than synthesized by the electric arc.
    In fact, Don Borghi was rather cautious in calling ”neutrons” the entities produced by his
    klystron [2a]. The same caution has been voiced by Daddi [2c] and others [2b]. Also. it
    should be noted that new bound states of protons and electrons below the Bohr’s ground
    state of the hydrogen have been predicted by various authors (see, e.g., Mills [2e]) and
    appear to be necessary in any case for a serious interpretation of the Sun spectral emission.

  • Things are getting interesting.

    Deuterium is a known source for neutrons and dozens of patents are around for it. Normal hydrogen contains enough D to produce few neutron on demand. You cannot produce a neutron from H alone as this would need very high energy and a special host for hydrogen.

    Santilli was the first man who did experiment with H* and also sells magnetically compressed fuel by feeding it with H*.

    And of course QM for describing a nucleus is nonsense as the nucleus certainly is stable and never shows a probabilistic behavior, just to give then obvious reasons.

  • Yup I did wonder how he would achieve it without neutrinos

    I’m definitely inclined to Wyttenbach’s models. I may misunderstand some parts of of his SO(4) theory but I can certainly see they are elegant and to me that’s a big indicator he is in the right track. But if something is happening to generate neutrons then it’s also definitely curious. Sometimes different even incomplete models can give useful insights. But they do need to be backed by data.

    Interesting and good point about Deuterium.

    But on a higher level it’s also very interesting the more general coincidences I think.

  • Well, from various persons one gets the impression that Santilli is prone to some strange ideas. I think JedRothwellmay have some comment on that.

    I cannot comment on his technical claims, but his personal behavior is odious. He sued Gene Mallove and cost Gene a ton of money, which he could not afford. He threatened to sue me and various other people. In the end, all of the suits were dismissed. As I recall, the judge was upset with Santilli.

  • Could be that he invented the pseudo-proton theory as just another way around the Coulomb barrier - we've had 'tunnelling' thru the barrier, conversion of protons to neutrons via electron capture and now neutron capture of electrons to form negatively charged protons he calls pseudo-protons? It all sounds completely unlikely amongst the long list of other competing theories attempting to explain cold fusion. All theoretical and experimental LENR now seems questionable - too many random theories attempting to account for random experimental data.

  • JedRothwell Ahh I see. There is some complicated history there. I’m sorry to see that Jed. and for Gene too. I maybe naïf but I do wish disputes were resolved more simply with respect that each side is human with all the feelings and pressure, failings and complex thoughts that that entails. It’s always a shame when it gets out of hand. I try to stay technology focused but it’s sad that thing go like that from time to time.

    This story though triggered me to look back in history in these blogs and it’s amazing. I’ve just realized though how far back some ideas we discuss now go and how much they were discussed in these forums. It amazes me that they become increasingly relevant in these days.

    I hope some day everyone gets past differences even though that’s hard and focuses on just how truely amazing the technology history is.

    Perhaps that diversity of sources and it’s complexity is all part of its story perhaps in a way all though painful for some it’s part of what gets us here today.

  • There’s a whole parallel thread to the LENR story going all the way back to the 90’s to now that I somehow missed or at least didn’t fully grasp. It does put some things in to context. There is a lot of hurt and sadness perhaps on all sides from the very beginning to now.

    The best all round is for LENR to be shown. And contributors recognized.

  • Santilli is a very controversial character, and has a track record of being quirky, temperamental, outspoken, temper tantrum prone, and incapable of backing off or recognizing when is caught red handed in a flat out lie. That said, I once asked online a person who was an actual plasma phycisist and PhD, what he thought of Hadronic Mechanics. He told me that Santilli is the kind of guy that will be proven right decades after his death, and that there was a handfull of people in the world actually capable of understanding what Hadronic Mechanics is about. I was impressed by that comment, but seems that kind of rather positive opinion about Santilli is rather rare among his peers.

    I certainly Hope to see LENR helping humans to blossom, and I'm here to help it happen.