Demonstration of the E-Cat QX - 24 November - Summary thread

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    You should factor in to your answer the fact (stated by Rossi, so tendentious, but I'll admit it) that Rossi does not have certification for any markets except industrial and would therefore aim at industrial commercialisation. Just as what he was claiming to do during the IH test.

    Rossi has no real certification of ANY kind. All he has is a worthless SELF certification. No reputable organization would give him a certificate.


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    Rossi can hope to get money from one-off big pocket investors who buy his "the establishment has it in for me" story, and are foolish. There have always been foolish rich people.

    Sure. But in this case, there is not only the internet data and discussion of Rossi's past experiments and Krivit's meticulous summary of his criminal past. Now, there is an extensive record in the form of sworn depositions of Rossi's one year record of consistent lying, evasion and failure with IH who had EVERY REASON to make the ecat work and none at all not to. Anyone who gives him millions in the light of that history and without new, proper, independent testing DESERVES to be defrauded because they are so monumentally stupid, negligent and incompetent that it's hard to imagine it. The only things Rossi can hope for are that 1) the pretrial stuff is too voluminous and complex to bother with and 2) some sort of bizarro conspiracy theory to account for the rest of Rossi's sorry history. And yes, somebody with money may be dumb enough to give some to him! Wow!


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    TTH wrote: Alan, I don't see any material difference between us in analysis of this test (maybe I am wrong?).

    I don't think Alan made any analysis of the "test" and I don't expect him to even give an opinion on its validity. It would not be his style, IMO.

    • Official Post
    Quote from oldguy

    I wonder if it could be as simple as just there is an air leak to the tube and the electrodes are consumable- That is just burning the electrodes. It wouldn't take much to keep 20W of heat going for an hour by chemistry.


    That's a really easy trick, not! You try doing it, I have with iron, carbon. tungsten. Impossible to control and in this case, how would the electrode gap be maintained as they burnt away at a precise speed? And where does the smoke go? That is the really tricky part. No midgets inside the pipe.

    • Official Post
    • Quote
      Mats Lewan said..

      "I discussed the dummy tests with Rossi two months before the demo. Shortly before the demo Rossi only wanted to do the short circuit test, not the 800 ohm, since the waveform would be altered in a way that would reveal sensible information, he said. I told him that in that case it was meaningless to do the test at all. He came back a few days later and said he would do it.

      Whatever adjustment he did before the dummy test, legitimate or not, it’s a serious problem. The input measurement was already weak as it was. Now I suppose the only conclusive test would be to repeat the measurements when he has a developed control system that doesn’t need cooling so you can measure COP of the whole system."

    Well said that man and entirely correct.

    can ,

    Standard plasma lighting technology uses AC to equalize wear on the the electrodes, and balance the heat from end to end. In automotive use, bulbs (and ballasts) last typically 3+ times longer using AC output compared to DC output. (Aftermarket retrofit cheap ballasts are almost all DC, because they are cheap to build. Factory automobile systems are exclusively AC output.)


    Some DC plasma systems reverse the direction from the last at each new start (mostly to keep Hg, etc from accumulating at one end). Some arcs are cone shaped due to electrons repelling each other, so the DC electrodes are configured as a sharp point opposite a larger cylinder to equalize heat.

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    You both think you could easily verify the performance of the QX but anyone else, particularly if they are rich, are too dumb to do so.

    I know I could. Just putting an oscilloscope across the reactor would answer most of the critics here and would be one of the first things to do

    First thing to do indeed... so why didn't Rossi do it? Oh... I know. Doesn't want to give away IP, right, Adrian. So how would that give away IP? What sort of IP that couldn't be easily discovered anyway would be given away with a scope picture? What about Rossi's extensive patent collection? Why wouldn't that protect his IP like patents do everyone else's?


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    There is some proof from the demonstration about the performance of the QX. There is no proof from the critics who are just speculating about possibilities. Wait for more facts.

    How long, Adrian? Six years of evasion and lies and cheating investors isn't enough for you to draw conclusions? Wow.


    The whole discussion about an overheating power supply is specious and idiotic. Power supplies have been around for centuries. Modern power supplies don't overheat unless they are misused. So Rossi has technology to produce plasma fusion on a desktop and he can't figure out how to use a properly rated power supply? And how to remote it away from the equipment so the heat from the power supply isn't confounded with the heat from the experiment? Seriously? ANYONE believes that? This entire caper is approaching Nigerian scams in its transparency to anyone who can think enough to dress themselves in the morning.

    It is an obvious fact (as mentioned above) that Fabiani flips a switch in the control box at time 2:31:08 before the 800 ohm test.

    This alone invalidates the whole demo and is a strong indication of foul play.


    There is also a gaping hole in the logic that prevents measuring the voltage over the reactor.

    The given reason for this is that such a measurement could reveal sensitive information about the operation of the gadget.

    At the same time Rossi has told us over and over again that the reactor essentially is an electric short with zero resistance.

    To me this indicates that the secret that must not be revealed is that the voltage is anything but zero.

    Quote from interested observer

    drian, considering the statements you are making about the QX, why aren't YOU waiting for more facts?

    I don't need more facts to know what the claims are. As I said, whether trickery was involved will have to wait for due diligence or sale of working units.

    Can't you parse simple English?


    Lots of anonymous crap. Are you ashamed to put your name below what you write?

    Paradigmnoia

    For what it's worth, in twin carbon arc welding too (the closest thing to the tests/experiments I did) it's a known fact that AC makes for an even electrode wear compared to using DC.


    Rossi is applying a DC arc (even if with an AC component), so one of his electrodes will wear faster than the other at any given time.

    • Official Post

    He says not an arc- a plasma. Appeared to me to be started with an arc, and ended with an arc of opposite polarity from a look at the scope shots. But not a continuous arc - there is a good chance the mocrophones would have got the EM from that - or drom the un-shielded wiring - and the start and finish spark was audible and quite visible on the RHS of the front row, as I suspect an arc would have been.

    Quote from can

    Paradigmnoia

    For what it's worth, in twin carbon arc welding too (the closest thing to the tests/experiments I did) it's a known fact that AC makes for an even electrode wear compared to using DC.


    Rossi is applying a DC arc (even if with an AC component), so one of his electrodes will wear faster than the other at any given time.

    If his electrodes are truly nickel, it isn't the initial arc that is going to be a problem.

    Quote from maryyugo

    What sort of IP that couldn't be easily discovered anyway would be given away with a scope picture? What about Rossi's extensive patent collection? Why wouldn't that protect his IP like patents do everyone else's?


    Maybe the wave forms/frequencies, possibly feedback from the reactor and other characteristics? Which patent collection do you mean that should cover this? And as Rossi said (probably true); it costs a lot of money to protect patents. I guess this is why wants to keep some aspects of the reactor secret, or what do you think?

    It was noted on Moletrap that Rossi should be able to self run the ecatQX if it has electrical output and a >500 COP. Indeed. Rossi typically misdirects about this by noting in the talk that the power it requires to run is only on half the time. This was not shown that I know of. But the real misdirection is when Rossi says the power required to run it is negligible compared to the output and thus doesn't matter. This completely disregards the issue which is that if the device could self run and make a lot of heat or electricity in demonstrable isolation from power for prolonged periods during a demo, it would prove the concept. While the current DPS proves absolutely nothing except that Rossi is an inept junk collector and assembler of crap parts that do nothing but mislead.

    Alan Smith

    An electric arc is still a plasma, after all. The flashes are visible in the video too, e.g. from 1:27:28 here. It does look as if every flash event is actually composed of many flashes in quick succession:


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    Paradigmnoia

    What sort of problem would eventually occur? Certainly it wouldn't be the same as with hardened electrode materials of HID lamps.


    Or... The key word here could be "essentially" which could indicate that the secret that must not be revealed is that the voltage varies in ways Rossi do not want to reveal?

    can , Eric Walker ,

    Nickel melts at a lot lower temperature than the plasma is reported to be at.

    Eventually the nickel will melt, boil or sublimate, and end up coating the "bulb" area. Even a fine dusting will be conductive at some point, creating starting problems. The coating will also reflect heat inwards, leading to heat failure. Nickel is a great IR reflector.


    Tungsten is used in many systems for a good reason.


    what if the wave form shown on the scope didn't go into the reactor but was dissipated directly inside the control box?

    and the reactor was a simple heater controlled by an other circuit inside the box?

    Quote from Gerard McEk

    Here is how Mats thinks about the event:

    https://animpossibleinvention.…cat-qx-demo-in-stockholm/

    I believe it is an excellent summary!


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    Mats:

    At the demo, as seen in the video recording, Rossi was adjusting something inside the control system just before making the dummy measurements. Obviously, someone could wonder if he was changing the system in order to obtain a desired measured value.

    His own answer was that he was opening an air intake after two hours of operation since the active cooling was not operating when the system was turned off.

    Clearly this comes down to a question of trust, and personally, discussing this detail with Rossi for some time, I have come to the conclusion that his explanation is reasonable and trustworthy.

    However, as I stated above, if I were an investor considering to invest in this technology, I would require further private tests being made with accurate measurements made by third-party experts, specifically regarding the electrical input power, making such tests in a way that these experts would consider to be relevant.



    Obviously Mats knows he has to be diplomatic with Rossi, and that if he were to show doubt to what Rossi says, it would be the end of their collaboration.

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