Measurement of the enthalpy of formation of an iron pico-hydride and of its main properties (2017)

  • While looking for references for a related discussion, today I found this open access peer-reviewed paper (published on International Journal of Modern Physics B) by Jacques Dufour et al describing a "hot-tube" experiment with iron and sodium. I don't recall it being linked before in the LENR blogosphere, even though it should be related with LENR-like phenomena. The paper itself makes no mention of "LENR" nor "cold fusion", but as far as I am aware of the results have been discussed in various LENR meetings; Dufour is a known researcher in the field. This paper was originally published in August 2017.

    Measurement of the enthalpy of formation of an iron pico-hydride and of its main properties (open access)

    Jacques Dufour, Xavier Dufour, Fabienne Dioury, Jenny D. Vinko


    Abstract: Chemical reactions result from the outside shell electrons of the reacting species being shared in various types of combinations. Typical distances involved are tenths of nm, resulting in binding energies typically in the order of hundreds of kJ/mole (eV/atom). The synthesis of a novel “atomic system” formed from Iron and di-Hydrogen has been achieved. The measured enthalpy of formation is some 40 MJ/mole Fe and the distance between the hydrogen proton and the iron nucleus is some 8 pm, hence the proposed name: Iron Pico-Hydride. This compound is a permanent electric dipole of atomic size. Pico-Hydrides could, thus, play a significant role in HT superconductivity and in super-capacitors. The synthesis is compatible with the standard model.

    The paper is open access, thus freely downloadable.

  • Shane D.

    If I recall correctly, his recent work isn't really about nuclear reactions, but about the energy of formation of so-called pico-hydrides, as mentioned in the abstract above. It could be why he's not more often cited.

    On a loosely related note, Jenny D. Vinko, one of the paper co-authors, has organized the 12th International Workshop on Anomalies in Hydrogen Loaded Metals (related LENR-Forum thread here) and will be organizing the 13th on October 2018.

    Dufour et al presented an abstract of their work on the 12th (mentioned here by AlainCo in that L-F thread). This was just before the paper on International Journal of Modern Physics B was published. I found the paper while I was searching for this abstract (but actually I recall there was a similar one published earlier somewhere else).

    Also, curiously:

  • I thought I already posted this elsewhere, but It looks I didn't. A likely related presentation from the 2015 ISCMNS 11th International Workshop on Hydrogen Loaded Metals had this abstract (which I saved), but unfortunately it was removed from the website. I think the authors might have requested this to be done.


    Unconventional Heat Observation in the Hydrogen/Iron/Sodium System

    “It has been shown that a chemical binding between a hydrogen atom and a metal atom could be formed at picometer distance, where the hydrogen proton is at the vicinity of the K layer of the metal nucleus. This is explained by the formation of a polarized dipole composed of the electron of the hydrogen atom oscillating round 2 positive charges: the hydrogen proton and the metal nucleus. The 2 positive charges are not equal (1 for the proton and 26 in the case of iron) and this induces the polarization of the dipole. For the reaction to occur, electrons must be present in the reacting medium, where hydrogen is adsorbed on the metal (transition metals, like iron, adsorb hydrogen). Electrons are available when the vapor of an alkaline metal like sodium or lithium is present in the reacting medium and if the temperature is sufficiently high.”

    Sources: (not available/deleted)…org/work11/Agenda%202.htm

    This was, by the way, the reason why I originally created this thread at the time. I was specifically looking for this abstract (or possibly paper/presentation) and couldn't find it anymore, so I tried searching it and found that published paper instead.

  • Those links are empty sadly... But when information gets valuable in a capitalist society it gets put behind paywalls. A more positive perspective (but slightly peeved)!

  • The first link is the original source which is indeed dead, the second one shows an archived of version the page that hosted the document (search for "Dufour") as a half-proof that it existed.

    I clicked on the link that was associated with Dufour and it again came up empty. Wonder if he would share a pdf if asked?

  • I tried sifting through the documentation of the Dufour-Vinko patent application (which apparently got eventually "refused" in 2017 in a rather involved process—I should check out that more in detail) and I found that some of the papers and presentation that you seek are available there. See attached.

    I got them here:…075001&lng=en&tab=doclist

    Among the documents dated "07.11.2016" for the "Non-patent literature cited during the examination procedure".

    Other papers in older (2014-12-15) patent documentation are available as well. Unfortunately they are all in black and white and with no OCR (raw print scans/images).

    Some selected slides from the presentation below.

  • Dufour mentions that the iron Kshell emission of ~ 7 keV could be linked to the formation of iron picohydride..measured enthalpy of ~4.5 keV

    is such an energy coupling by photon or nonradiatively ( a la Mills)??

    Of course seeing 7 KeV photons in a complex reaction is not easy..

  • Amen! Much thanks can . RobertBryant That is a good question. Now I see why lithium may have helped previous experiments without significant contribution of lithium fission/fusion, it's useful as a free electron source. Sodium apparently is better and cheaper. Which one is more energy dense the nickel-hydrogen system or the iron-sodium-hydrogen system? The iron one says ~4.5 keV per reaction, nickel 10.something keV?

  • LeBob

    Perhaps this could be helpful:

    If the principle is the same, the formation of a Nickel pico-hydride would release slightly more energy than what is proposed for iron although I haven't read the theory in enough detail to confidently state this. (EDIT: this would be considering the excerpt below)

    Potassium would evaporate at lower temperatures and take less energy to ionize, which should be an advantage compared to sodium. I think a major factor is that hydrogen will readily take the molecular form under pressures close to atmospheric, which would hamper the proposed reaction that needs protons. So possibly lower pressures, higher temperatures, high-surface area catalytic surfaces (where hydrogen would be adsorbed as separate atoms) or a combination of these might help as well.

  • Dufour mentions that the iron Kshell emission of ~ 7 keV could be linked to the formation of iron picohydride..measured enthalpy of ~4.5 keV

    is such an energy coupling by photon or nonradiatively ( a la Mills)??

    Of course seeing 7 KeV photons in a complex reaction is not easy..

    Heavier elements should give off more energetic photons in the same reaction, and those would be easier to see externally. However it might not necessarily be as simple as it seems from a very quick read.

  • Dufour mentions that the iron Kshell emission of ~ 7 keV could be linked to the formation of iron picohydride..measured enthalpy of ~4.5 keV

    The problem with iron pico-hydride formation is that 56Fe has no magnetic moment and thus a classic magnetic bond can be excluded. An orbiting proton around Fe is weird too. 57Fe owns a faint magnetic moment thus we could guess that adding the proton could induce such a moment. 57Co has a very strong moment and could be induced too. Bringing an electron down to the k-shell in 56Fe ( 57Co) would release the said about 7.5keV as we would in fact have a 57Co nucleus. That's more or less what Dufour did show in Asti. A hybrid nucleus between 57Fe and 57Co. 57Fe has a low energy magnetic gamma state at 14.4keV that can accept the formation energy.

    The SO(4) quantum structure of 56Fe and 57Co and 57Fe shows that a direct conversion from 56Fe to 57Fe or 57Co does not work because of the needed reorganization of the internal quantum structure what will strongly slow down such a reaction. 56Fe has free neutron bonds that can interact symmetrically what could explain the strange object that has been found by at least two researchers so far. The net gain from 56Fe --> 57Fe or 57Co is between 7..8 MeV what is a very hard gamma and if it happens only a few hundred times/ s it's hard to detect in the background. further there is magnetic downscaling possible a shown for 57Fe..( 57Co --> 57Fe).

    At least an interesting system for basic LENR research.

  • Ahh is there indications of this deep chemical reaction being the main reaction in what SAFIRE has? This is denser than what Mills has claimed, which was itself a potentially revolutionary claim of density. If you think about it the claim that the hydrinos floated away through boundaries, used to explain the small amount of hydride compounds formed, may be explained away by the fact that the majority of the energy was coming from the formation of the pico-compounds. Hydride polymer chains with strange conductive effects where apparently formed from suncell-like experiments. What metals were present for hydrogen to form deep orbit bonds with? Actual results, but failure to stabilize process due to a wrong theory behind the engineering or too proud to consider pico-hydrides? The process of this reaction actually can work in the standard model.