Having, I think now, a little anteriority, in this Lenr business, I think that above all, this is jealousy that tries discriminating BEC.. They would have results while others only have words , theories or only concepts..

However, I reiterate my remark concerning the LF staff, always a lack of filtering concerning the phantasmagoria, I do not see mixing BEC or Storms with the INSISTANT balls of the kazak for example.

Quote from Shane D.

Understandable. It was a very constructive conversation until the past day or so, then unfortunately went off the deep end. The main reason we started the private, invitation only section, was so people like you could freely talk without being the target of someone else's word salad.

Looking forward to that live demo at the ICCF.

Quote from RobertBryant

Is there any evidence that a Bose Einstein condensate can exist at 600K on a nickel surface

"NUS researchers have predicted that an exotic state of matter, known as a Bose-Einstein condensate, can exist at relatively high temperatures (around 50 K to 100 K) ..

https://www.science.nus.edu.sg…condensation-of-excitons/

A Bose condensate exists on the anode of the SAFIRE system and that plasma has temperatures up to 80,000 F.

Quote from Cydonia

However, I reiterate my remark concerning the LF staff, always a lack of filtering concerning the phantasmagoria, I do not see mixing BEC or Storms with the INSISTANT balls of the kazak for example.

That is something the staff has debated many times. When do we step in? If we interfere too much we inhibit free expression. Too little and invariably we chase away those we most want to hear from.

At the end of the day, we do expect members to try and make the forum more hospitable to the big names. Most understand that, but the very few sometimes let their enthusiasm get the best of them.

And remember, every member has a say, and sometimes peer pressure is more effective than heavy handed moderating.

Quote from You clearly don't understand thermodynamics, nuclear physics or quantum mechanics. Based on your logic the W boson force carier could not exist.

The assumption that the LENR reaction involves nuclear reactions and fusion is why LENR is rejected by Science. Because of this assumption, LENR has become a laughing stock in Science. If LENR supported a fusion reaction, it would demonstrate neutrons, and gamma rays of a specific energy levels associated with the type of fusion that is occuring.

To the best of my understanding, nobody in the LENR community has ever explained why these tell tale fusion indicators were lacking in the LENR reaction. The assumption that LENR is a nuclear reaction is obviously invalid.

Quote from axil

A Bose condensate exists on the anode of the SAFIRE system and that plasma has temperatures up to 80,000 F.

is there a reference?

Quote from RobertBryant - is there a reference?

See

See

Post

RE: Safire eyes commercialization within 5 years, with launch of new company Aureon Energy!

FYI

Did you know that a rotating Bose condensate forms on the surface of the SAFIRE anode? Does the SAFIRE team know?

There is a computer program called BEC2HPC for computing the ground states of
the nonlinear Schrodinger equation and the Gross-Pitaevskii equation (GPE) for modeling rotating Bose-Einstein condensates (BEC). This program generates the SAFIRE vortex studded ball we associate with SAFIRE.

This Gross-Pitaevskii equation output tells us that a Bose condensate forms on the surface of…

axil

May 29th 2022

Quote from axil

See

page 12 of your reference shows this picture..

This picture is similar to this picture

https://arxiv.org/pdf/1001.0865.pdf

These are results from Rubidium atom condensates at ultracold tempratures in the region of 1 degrees K

These have very little to do with

" the SAFIRE system and that plasma has temperatures up to 80,000 F." =45000 degrees K

Also worth pointing out that the Abo-Shaeer paper shows an effect a very low temperature and at the micron scale, whereas Safire creates visible phenomena not only very hot but 1000x larger. Also, I am not aware also of any work demonstrating the presence of Rydberg matter at high temperatures, but if anyone does I would like to see it.

Quote from Alan Smith

any work demonstrating the presence of Rydberg matter at high temperatures,

My mind wonders...

NASA Hot and Cold Fusion

How hot is the hot side and how cold is the cold side? Is what may be happening (within engineered thin layers) are magneto-Peltier or magneto-Seebeck effects creating an expanded cold Rydberg atom on one side? Also, many atoms can rest inside such making it a very strange molecule. Consider inversely, on the other side of these thin film (semiconductor layers) are hot atoms or even ions perhaps.

In such a hot cold environment could a CMNS solitary Rydberg atom or two exist? Or even a group of these strange Rydberg Molecules? If so, what happens when they form and what happens when they collapse?

Giant Rydberg atoms: From scientific curiosity to quantum sensors

September 6, 2021 Fig.1 Ordered atomic array held in an optical lattice Image: © National Institute of Standards and Technology

F Barry Dunning and Thomas C Killian from the Department of Physics & Astronomy at Rice University depict the benefits of research into the remarkable physical and chemical properties of Rydberg atoms

Advances in experimental capabilities frequently open up new avenues for basic scientific research that lead to new, and unanticipated, practical applications. One such example is the study of exotic highly excited atomic states, termed Rydberg states after the Swedish spectroscopist J. R. Rydberg who first explored their characteristics. The novel properties of Rydberg states are now being exploited in areas such as sensing, quantum information and quantum simulation.

Normal ground-state atoms comprise a compact, positively charged nucleus surrounded by one or more negatively charged electrons tightly bound by electrostatic forces, resulting in an atomic diameter of a few tenths of a nanometre. If an electron in the atom is given energy it can transition into one of an allowed series of excited states whose energies and orbital motions are defined by the principal quantum number n. As the energy transfer, and n increase, the electron is able to travel farther from the nucleus. The atomic diameter increases as n2 and, for n~1,000 becomes a few tenths of a millimetre. Such high-n Rydberg atoms thus represent giants on the atomic landscape and their size results in very unusual physical and chemical properties. For example, the energy required to strip the excited electron from such atoms, which decreases as 1/n2, is very small, making them not only large, but also extremely fragile. Nonetheless, in atomic terms their lifetimes are long and can amount to milliseconds or more, ample time to allow their study.

The excited electron is so far from the nucleus and the remaining inner electrons that the electrostatic field it experiences from them is very weak. In consequence, its motion can be strongly perturbed, or even dominated, by the presence of small background electric (or magnetic) fields, or by the fields generated by neighbouring Rydberg atoms. Indeed, application of even a modest electric field can be sufficient to tear the excited electron from the atom. Because of this extreme sensitivity to external fields, Rydberg atoms are now being exploited as electric field sensors. Furthermore, since all atoms of a particular species possess identical properties, Rydberg-based electric-field “meters” can be readily reproduced with the knowledge that all will respond identically and share a common calibration.

To measure static electric fields, the changes they induce in the Rydberg energy level structure are observed using laser or microwave spectroscopy, an approach that can detect fields of only a few microvolts per centimetre. Rydberg atoms are also well-suited to detecting oscillating electric fields over a wide portion of the electromagnetic spectrum that spans radio frequencies to the near infrared, with applications in communications, radar, and health care.

Many such applications take advantage of an effect termed electromagnetically induced transparency which involves a cloud of atoms through which is directed a “probe” laser beam tuned to a frequency that the atoms would normally strongly absorb, and a superposed “control” laser beam tuned to excite the atoms to a Rydberg state. With careful choice of the control beam frequency its presence can lead to the transmission of the probe beam through the otherwise opaque medium. Given that Rydberg states are extremely sensitive to external electric fields, their presence can cause marked changes in the probe beam transmission.

Rydberg atoms are so large that in dense gases the electron orbit can enclose many ground-state atoms whose interactions with the electron create a weak chemical bond, forming giant ultralong-range “Rydberg molecules” whose size is comparable to that of the parent Rydberg atoms. Such molecules are not stable at room temperature, but laser cooling techniques now allow production of very cold dense gases, permitting the formation of giant molecules comprising tens to hundreds of “atoms bound within an atom.”

The atoms in such a molecule constitute a novel form of “quantum matter” with which to study how many-body interactions lead to collective phenomena, like the formation of “quasi-particles” that play an important role in determining the electronic and magnetic properties of materials.

Rydberg-Rydberg interactions underpin many studies involving quantum simulation and quantum logic devices. Such interactions, which are millions of times stronger than those between ground-state atoms, can be controlled by the choice of the Rydberg states excited and by their physical separations. Much of this work exploits “dipole blockade” in which resonant excitation of one atom to a Rydberg state shifts the energies of neighbouring atoms within some critical “blockade radius,” preventing their subsequent excitation. The use of tightly focused laser beams as “optical tweezers” to trap and position atoms has enabled the realisation of Rydberg quantum gates. These gates feature two atoms positioned within a blockade radius and utilise conditional logic, where excitation of the second atom is governed by excitation of the first. Such gates have proven to be fast, reliable and hold promise in the development of a possible quantum computer.

The use of multiple tweezers, or of “optical lattices” formed by intersecting laser beams, provides the opportunity to assemble ordered arrays of Rydberg atoms whose geometrical arrangements match those found in many thin films and solids. Through their interactions they provide a “quantum simulator” with which to examine the properties of the systems they mimic, especially properties such as high-temperature superconductivity and magnetism that result from collective internal interactions, and that are frequently too complex to simulate even on a modern computer. In addition, by varying the atomic arrangements, a wide variety of “artificial” structures not normally found in nature can be engineered and their properties examined. Furthermore, the effects of defects present in a material can be explored by removing selected atoms from the array and examining the changes that this introduces. Such studies speak to the design and engineering of new materials with tailored electronic, magnetic, and even thermal properties.

Although once purely a scientific curiosity, giant Rydberg atoms are now finding important applications in many technologically important areas. Continuing research into their remarkable physical and chemical properties promises exciting new discoveries that will herald an even broader range of applications.

*Please note: This is a commercial profile

© 2019. This work is licensed under a

Creative Commons 4.0 2021 license.

https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/se.

Contributor Profile

F Dunning Dunning

Sam and Helen Worden Professor of Physics
Department of Physics and Astronomy, Rice University
Website: Visit Website

Bose-Einstein condensate created at room temperature

Instead of atoms, condensation was achieved using quasiparticles.

arstechnica.com

Bose-Einstein condensate created at room temperature

Because the BEC temperature increases with decreasing particle mass, one approach to increasing its temperature is to use particles with smaller mass, such as excitons (bound electron-hole pairs induced by optical excitation).

But the polariton has negative mass so it is not yet understood how high the polariton condensate temperature can reach in a negative mass condition.

Polariton condensation is formed in a polariton laser which operates at room temperatures.

Room-temperature polariton nano-laser

Room-temperature polariton nano-laser

Researchers have developed a polariton nano-laser operating at room temperature.

www.sciencedaily.com

One way to test that the light emitted by the SAFIRE anode is coherent is to test its light emissions for polarization since as is the case for a laser a high temperature bose condensate will generate polarized light.

A plasma based LENR reactor will therefore generate polarized light.

As a point of interest

2021-04-02 17:11 KeithT

Dear Andrea,

Is the light emitted by the Ecat SKLed polarized?

Regards,

Keith Thomson.

2021-04-03 08:34 Andrea Rossi

KeithT:

Yes,

Warm Regards,

A.R.

I am afraid room temperature is not the reference that was requested regarding safire anode temperature.

Quote from axil

The assumption that the LENR reaction involves nuclear reactions and fusion is why LENR is rejected by Science. Because of this assumption, LENR has become a laughing stock in Science. If LENR supported a fusion reaction, it would demonstrate neutrons, and gamma rays of a specific energy levels associated with the type of fusion that is occuring.

To the best of my understanding, nobody in the LENR community has ever explained why these tell tale fusion indicators were lacking in the LENR reaction. The assumption that LENR is a nuclear reaction is obviously invalid.

If you want indisputable evidence of nuclear reaction, then like any real evidence for any reaction, you need to do mass balance and stoichiometry. That of course is enough transmutation to create a bomb about 1/10 the size of the one that was dropped on Hiroshima. I have done the mass balance and stoichiometry for arc-based reactions in water and in deuterium gas. The data has high accuracy and precise and the data has independent verification, some of it by NASA. This has been reported several times in this forum.

The nuclear reactions occur in a cluster. The cluster is a result of the effects of special relativity (a locally induced gravity field). The cluster has the unusual property of causing photon condensation. That is to say that photons at the hydrogen ionization energy are combined to create photon in the Mev range. These Mev range photons cause the nuclear reactions. There are a series of steps involving fusion which fusion produce a high atomic weight atoms which fission. All this happens within the cluster. The cluster distributes the energy so there are far fewer neutrons and gammas that expected. What is worst is that most of the energy is carried away by radiation that has mass. Unfortunately, that means the heat yield is low and the entropy is high. I have reported this the massive radiation can be forced to self-annihilate (can be converted to light) but have not yet demonstrated that in high yield. If I am successful in that quest, then these nuclear reactions will be commercially useful.

As far as I can see only extreme prejudice and the popularity of being detractor of LENR has keep this information from main-stream science. The information is published in the public domain. Did you think that the tone toward LENR in serious circle had change for no reason?

Quote from axil

To the best of my understanding, nobody in the LENR community has ever explained why these tell tale fusion indicators were lacking in the LENR reaction. The assumption that LENR is a nuclear reaction is obviously invalid.

According to Wyttenbach kinectic fusion is not the same like LENR fusion, but still a nuclear process. Give it a read....

To understand the reaction, it is useful to examine that condition in an extreme case.

The ferrosilicon smelting transmutes 4 tons of carbon into other elements per day over months.

Quote

It was evident that roughly 20% more metal than could be accounted for from the input feed was being produced and consequently we have been obliged to come to the conclusion that anomalous quantities of Si (2.8 ton/day) and Fe (1.45 ton/day) were being synthesized during the smelting process.

http://coldfusioncommunity.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/244_JCMNS-Vol24.pdf

Quote from the document - A worth noting feature of the Silcal observation s was that there was no dramatic change whatsoever in the energy dissipation. Using the estimated energy release values of 17.13 MeV/atom of Si or 49.58 MeV per atom of Fe given in Appendix B, for the postulated nuclear transmutation reactions, it can be shown that corresponding to 4.25 ton of metal transmutation, the power generated should have been the equivalent of the total thermal power generated by hundreds of 1000MWe nuclear power stations.

.

We are not dealing with a few atoms here. We are seeing conversion of TONS of material. In this situation, the accounting of the inputs and outputs are easy. Because of the huge amounts of stuff involved here, there is little chance for error in any scale that matters.

Quote from axil

To understand the reaction,

to understand which reaction?

Quote

to understand which reaction?

If you read the article, cold fusion/LENR was referenced

Quote from axil

To understand the reaction, it is useful to examine that condition in an extreme case.

The ferrosilicon smelting transmutes 4 tons of carbon into other elements per day over months.

http://coldfusioncommunity.net…18/08/244_JCMNS-Vol24.pdf

We are not dealing with a few atoms here. We are seeing conversion of TONS of material. In this situation, the accounting of the inputs and outputs are easy. Because of the huge amounts of stuff involved here, there is little chance for error in any scale that matters.

There are two pathways based on most observed products from reaction pathways. The first few steps split deuterium and absorb a neutron to the target (usually an oxygen target). These are the same steps in both pathways but branching happens when O18 is formed. In one path O18 absorbs a complete deuteron or its equivalent (when the cluster is active enough it produces deuterium from protium or by fission of Fe54). In the other O18 absorbs a neutron. All the neutrons (except for production of deuterium) come from splitting deuterium. After the splitting of the pathways both reactions absorb deuterium for each step (except last steps) The F19 pathway goes to Ne21 to Na23 to Mg25 to Al27 then Al27 fuses to Fe54. The F20 pathway goes to Na22 to Mg 24 to Al26 to Si28. The Si28 often fissions to N14. Isotopic analysis of the Ferrosilicate steel would likely produce Fe with a very unnatural isotopic distribution.

Ed Storms did the transmutation analysis of the LeClair cavitation experiments. That experiment showed aluminum and water transmuted to every element in the periodic table including transuranic elements.

Such transmutation cannot be actioned through nuclear fusion and/or fission.

MagicSound has replicated to a limited extent Leclair's cavitation experiment using a rudimentary cavitation cleaner. His experiment has produced a hollow crenulated micro sphere of transmuted matter that includes iron carbon and other listed in the MagicSound's SEM micrograph as follows:

https://cdn.substack.com/image/fetch/w_1456,c_limit,f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F35fdf076-2720-4ce3-b215-71535f1b8c1b_1200x512.png

There is some other undefined process occurring in transmutation that defies our current understanding but it is not nuclear energy based.

That simple cavitation experiment that any child can do is explained in this post

Post

RE: Brillouin Energy Corporation (BEC) updates.

The EVO in an intensely magnetic system. The polariton that forms the Bose condensate maintains the Spin of the electron while losing its charge and mass. The magnetic nature of the EVO can be observed in the ULTR experiment. You can perform this experiment in your kitchen using a cavitation cleaner.

youtube.com/watch?v=By1xWRLE4pY

This experiment was performed by magicsound

Here is my post expressing my take on this experiment

Nobody had ever expected to see quantum effects coming out of a…

axil

May 29th 2022

Even though there is no nuclear processes involved in the NAE, I will use this term to describe the zone where the reaction takes.

The LENR process proceeds in distinct two stages, the first is the transmutation stage and the second is the production of energy stage. The first stage proceeds in a quantum mechanical coherent NAE called and Exotic vacuum Object in a state of superposition. Any energy that is generated in this stage is lost because of the nature of superposition.

The second stage produces energy when the NAE becomes unstable and explodes in a Bosenova. High energy electrons and photons are released during the Bosenova. The NAE is comprised of a Bose condensate of Anderson-Higgs polaritons. The matter constituent of these polaritons originates from the Anderson-Higgs amplitude mode in superconductors.

See here for a description of this type of Higgs polariton

https://s3.amazonaws.com/sf-web-assets-prod/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/30170003/Galitski_Flatiron_cavity_talk.pdf

Quote from BEC

1. Please don't waste our time with never seen or suspected reactions. Also, ⁵⁸Co, if made using neutron spallation, decays to 58Ni.

We are not discussing neutron spallation. More than 99.45% of ground state ⁵⁸Co decays to ⁵⁸Fe with 810 keV gammas and a half life of 70 days. The fact that these gammas are "never seen" strongly suggests your electron capture model is incorrect. Among the naturally occurring isotopes there are 19 which could capture 780 keV electrons to produce positron emitting radioactive products and corresponding 511 keV gammas. Not observed.

If you still think that electron capture is a valid mechanism please produce evidence.