News about Woodford and Industrial Heat

  • Seems a very speculative fishing expedition and is it about to go pear-shaped if investors realize their funds are insecure? You could only save an operation like this by having a working cold fusion demonstration reactor up and running the day after tomorrow. Just need to use Kg's of Ni powder.

    It's not much different than the land speculators operating in the 1840s and 1850s, during the height of the Homestead Act. You don't need a working reactor, you just need the perception that you are very close to having a working reactor when someone ELSE breaks through with THEIR working reactor.


    No one else was even close when the Wright brothers demonstrated their flights in 1908. But almost everyone bypassed them post haste as the aviation field broke wide open.

  • Not true at all- there were many who were close all over the world. But they were the most successful.

    The Wright brothers first controlled, powered flight was in 1903, so the world had 5 years to catch up. They didn't. Once the Wrights demonstrated it, then progress was very rapid.


    So if someone else was close (hint: Langley) then why didn't they move past the Wrights during those 5 years? They didn't because they weren't close.

  • Not true at all- there were many who were close all over the world. But they were the most successful.


    I disagree. I think kevmolenr is right, there was no else even close. A few were beginning to catch up by 1908. Santos flew 222 meters, but it was essentially an uncontrolled hop, not much better than the late 19th century flights. The French were the most advanced. After Wilbur Wright flew in front of the leading French aviators on August 8, they all agreed the Wrights were far ahead. That is what they told newspaper reporters. They had large egos, but they said things such as: "We are beaten" "We are as nothing." "We are as children compared to the Wrights." (Gasnier) "For us in France and everywhere, a new era in mechanical flight has commenced . . . It is marvellous" (Bleriot). "Mr. Wright has us all in his hands. What he does not know is not worth knowing" (Zens) "Today they are hallowed in France . . ." (Archdeacon). The demonstrations "proved over and over again . . . the Wrights have long mastered the art of artificial flying." (Times) "THE MOST WONDERFUL FLYING-MACHINE THAT HAS EVER BEEN MADE" (London Daily Mirror).


    See Crouch, The Bishop's Boys, chapter 26, and Combs, chapter 27



    You have far too a US-centric view of this.. But never mind,


    I suggest you read more of the history of early aviation, from 1890 to 1908. You will see that the Wrights were far ahead of everyone else. In the history of technology, it is rare that one inventor or one group has such a large lead over others, but it happened in this case. The only other example I can think of offhand was transistors at Bell Labs in 1948, and nuclear weapons in the U.S. during WWII. The latter was obviously a special case. Most of the European experts came to Los Alamos, so it was actually an international collaboration. It was also secret, for obvious reasons. If it had happened in peacetime other countries, especially the Soviet Union and Germany, would have kept up, I suppose.

  • I disagree. I think kevmolenr is right, there was no else even close. A few were beginning to catch up by 1908. Santos flew 222 meters, but it was essentially an uncontrolled hop, not much better than the late 19th century flights. The French were the most advanced. After Wilbur Wright flew in front of the leading French aviators on August 8, they all agreed the Wrights were far ahead. That is what they told newspaper reporters. They had large egos, but they said things such as: "We are beaten" "We are as nothing." "We are as children compared to the Wrights." (Gasnier) "For us in France and everywhere, a new era in mechanical flight has commenced . . . It is marvellous" (Bleriot). "Mr. Wright has us all in his hands. What he does not know is not worth knowing" (Zens) "Today they are hallowed in France . . ." (Archdeacon). The demonstrations "proved over and over again . . . the Wrights have long mastered the art of artificial flying." (Times) "THE MOST WONDERFUL FLYING-MACHINE THAT HAS EVER BEEN MADE" (London Daily Mirror).


    See Crouch, The Bishop's Boys, chapter 26, and Combs, chapter 27

    Sometimes the US-centric view is still the correct view. History is history.

  • After 1908, the French and other Europeans quickly caught up with the Wrights, and then surpassed them. European aviation hardly existed before 1908, but by 1914 a German pilot had flown 1900 km in 22 hours, and Sikorsky in Russia flew an airplane with 6 passengers in a comfortable cabin for 6 hours 33 minutes. Such performance was inconceivable with a 1908 Wright machine. Unthinkable. The Wrights continued to work after 1908 but they made little progress. They could never have rivaled Sikorsky. They did not have the kind of imagination that would rapidly improve the technology. As I recall, they did not even use seat belts, which was suicidal with airplanes of that era. Their control systems with levers were terrible, killing off several pilots, and they were too stubborn to admit it or improve it. They resembled some of the pioneering cold fusion researchers I know of, who shall remain nameless. See:


    https://www.lenr-canr.org/acrobat/RothwellJthewrightb.pdf


    You have to realize, the first 3 years of aviation were from 1908 to 1910. The technology effectively did not exist before that. Also, those years were a bloodbath. From 1908 to 1910, 33 pilots were killed, which is a significant fraction of all the pilots there were. Wright machines were especially dangerous. In 1910, 90 pilots were killed. Anthony Fokker wrote: "Every flying field I have known is soaked with the blood of my friends and brother pilots . . . My memory is one long obituary list." (Villard, p. 240). That was before WWI.


    People were willing to take far more risks to develop technology a century ago than they are today. If 90 people were killed developing self-driving cars, they would never see the light of day. If even 5 or 10 are killed developing cold fusion, I expect the research would be banned worldwide. After Mizuno experienced an explosion, the University did not allow him to do any more research. See: https://lenr-canr.org/?page_id=187#PhotosAccidents


    In my opinion, today's extreme caution is going too far. If we do not take risks, we take a far greater risk of global warming, and we kill far more people with pollution.

  • Article describes the predicament of the Woodford funds.


    https://www.standard.co.uk/bus…eem-himself-a4107151.html


    As the funds have shrunk with redemptions the unquoted parts have become larger parts of the fund, and with IH and some others increasing its value so much it skews the percentage of unquoted stocks to over 10% of the funds.


    Views range from "he is going through a bad patch" to "he's totally lost it!"


    As an investor in Woodford I am hanging on in the hope of good news, but not investing any more due to some real stinkers that he has picked (NorthWest Biotherapeutics, Prothena among others).

    Add to which he trumpeted the multi-year due diligence they had put into practice before they ever invested in IH. Having seen what happened after that it puts a big question mark over what they consider due diligence.


    However I continue to be a believer in LENR and a supporter of IH. Call me naive but I think they are trying to do some good, or possibly great things. So lets see what happens.

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    Having seen what happened after that it puts a big question mark over what they consider due diligence

    Woodford was asked that in a discussion option at the end of a newsletter a few years back. One of the surrogates responded that how they did their "due diligence" on Rossi and IH was proprietary. How convenient. And they quickly closed the discussion, in effect censoring their own shareholders. Not confidence inspiring, was it?


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    As an investor in Woodford I am hanging on in the hope of good news

    If you're waiting for Woodford to make money from IH in a legitimate manner, I hope you're a young person and extremely patient.

  • Inflating share prices... like, if I understand it right, they have already done.

    How do you know they inflated the prices? Maybe other people have priced it at levels they consider reasonable. And how do you know these prices are inflated? Have you evaluated the technology in detail? Can you tell us with any certainty whether their cold fusion research will succeed, or fail? If you can, you are a superlative genius capable of seeing through time and knowing what experiments will reveal even before those experiments are planned and executed. As I said, people do experiments because that is the only way to learn from nature. If you know already, we don't need to do the experiments. Just tell us how cold fusion works. We can then price out the shares and also make billions selling cold fusion.


    If you know for a fact that the experiments IH is funding will not work, then of course these prices are inflated. But you cannot blame IH for that. Unlike you, they are not clairvoyant. On the other hand, if you don't know how the research will turn out, and if it does work after all, then these shares may be severely undervalued.

  • I'm not sure of the details but IIRC, the shares received an initial evaluation which was quite generous and was based on the amount invested and the probability of finding anything. Then, suddenly, the shares were evaluated at 10x that amount for no apparent reason. The other issue is that there isn't much of a market for IH shares and a lessening market for Woodford's fund in which those shares are listed, based on sucky past performance.


    I can't tell you whether or not CF works but I can tell you that if it worked really well, one would expect a lot of consequences, none of which, in fact exist, inasmuch as is publicly revealed. So I assign it a low probability for the usual, well trodden reasons you disagree with.

  • How do you know they inflated the prices?


    Problem is that IH valuation is not based on a liquid market. I suspect there are absolutely zero buyers at the $4 bn valuation, but many sellers. Another problem is the not so transparent way this valuation was done (which you should expect it to be if you were a Woodford share holder). It looks like it is based on IH raising more capital during 2018 from unknown new investors at this price tag!!! But we have no clue about any of this (who and why would anyone buy at that price beats me) - it could be a pump and dump setup by Darden and friends simply to raise the valuation for marketing purposes or to make it possible for insider share holders to exit at an inflated price.

  • The level of ignorance that haunts certain niches of this place remains astounding.

    They think that everything is manipulated which is true for those who follow a con - sadly, its the only world they know.

    Those with bitter nothingness can only imagine how other things are discovered and made to work. All the while, they hide behind and speak through anonymous handles.


    We're using our own time and money to try and mitigate pollution and bring hope to those who have none.

    If we do our job - that mission gets accomplished and certain folks will get a very nice return for the risk and abuse they have taken in supporting our efforts.


    BTW - Darden is never going to sell his shares of IH. He is one committed dude.

  • We're using our own time and money to try and mitigate pollution and bring hope to those who have none.


    Sound a bit like green washing PR to me, but if you say so Dewey, if you say so ...


    btw, i dont consider myself ignorant in these matters, this stuff happens all the time. everywhere. its not rocket science. its basic grey zone finance. And guess who are the money/lawyer guys in this story... ;)