MIZUNO REPLICATION AND MATERIALS ONLY

    Our reactor has both internal and external heating. Operating in the air can be also considered as load.


    Daniel_G's reactor will require either secondary heating or adjustable load. With adjustable load they can keep reactor power constant.

    The problem with published Mizuno reactor design is it reacts extremely to the load.


    What we found is that the reason why internal heating is significantly better (if load is low) that for reaction itself the temperature difference must be present inside the cell. Temperature difference will cause gas to move. In the similar way as a wind is created in the air.The same thing will happen with Daniel_G's reactor even if it has very different shape.

    If your reactor is smaller, similarly to Alan's, there is almost no temperature difference and possibility how the gas could circulate.


    So the reactor design is extremely important. Including dimension. I appreciate that magicsound will try to modify his reactor.

    On the other hand there are more ways to achieve what is needed. Rossi found it very soon.

    But it all has to be properly dimensioned, including heater wattage and its size.

    What about placing a reversible hydride upstream in the gas feedline? It could be externally heated and controlled automatically, and possibly not affect too much reactor calorimetry in the current (magicsound's) configuration.

    Bob Greenyer MFMP Video.


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    Quote from magicsound

    Daniel hasn't offered to collaborate or share materials, designs, or data - other than his sparse description of the "furnace". If he wants to contribute to this discussion, I for one would welcome it and he knows where we are.

    Hello Alan, for my day job I run another startup which is closing a major funding deal now so I don't have much extra bandwidth but if there is anything useful I could contribute I would be happy to oblige, time permitting. There is nothing magic (pun intended) about my personal experience as I am still a relative newcomer. I do have extensive experience in engineering and metrology but would consider myself a halfway decent experimentalist but armchair physicist. My real skill is putting together talented teams, something I haven't been able to do with Mizuno due to many factors.


    Walking the tightrope between IP issues and transparency is something I honestly hate but it comes with the territory. I believe we could probably help more. I was very interested in the real time RGA data and wish this could be somehow coupled with other spectrography to show the higher metal composition real time as well as the gases.


    Working with a genius like Mizuno, he will have like 30 design iterations before we finish our morning coffee. Much has changed since the original publication and its very satisfying that Me356 is helping with this open sourced version of Mizuno's technology. Strategically if we are moving in the right direction or not, time will tell. Hopefully prototypes will be available after the new year. We have produced parts for 5 units. It would be great to have you do some third party testing on those devices but as its a new design we currently have no idea whether they will even produce excess heat or not. If we get some good signs that this is happening we would be more than happy to discuss details of possible collaboration. The door is open to any credible third party.


    Metrology equipment is expensive. Building the new prototypes involves an international effort covering a broad range of various skills. I personally am not in this for the money. I don't receive a salary and any monies raised go to buy precious equipment and parts. I would love to see this technology benefit society. Happy to play even the tiniest part.


    If anyone has any ideas how to test a 24 x 34 x 0.8cm reactor, I am all ears. We want to focus on the heat production and control as this is what has value to investors.

    Hi Daniel_G


    I take it the reactor casing is steel?


    A suggestion. Sit your reactor on top of a thermostatically controlled hot-plate with the reactors upper surface exposed to the air. Put surface contact thermocouples on the exposed surface, and if needs be between hotplate and the bottom surface. A non-contact IR bolometer might also be useful.


    As you raise the hotplate temperature, the exposed upper surface will also heat up due to conduction radiation and convection effects within and around the reactor.


    Log the reactor(under-surface temperature and the exposed surface temperature. Without LENR occurring there should be an approximately linear relationship between the temperature of the two surfaces. Using this method there is also heat-flow through the body of the reactor from hotter to colder - which seems to be a requirement for these systems.


    If the temperature of the upper surface departs from that approximately linear relationship with the temperature of the bottom surface because of LENR heating within the reactor it will be readily seen. A control system with un-treated mesh etc would be useful of course.

    Thank you for the reply Daniel_G. I also very appreciate you are here.


    We thought about building a flat reactor type as well - quite similar to old Rossi reactor, but from the point of engineering I am not certain about sealing and loading the meshes inside the container.

    I mean if the container is meant to be sealed perfectly, it will require welding everywhere including a feedthrough to fill the gas.

    Quote from me356

    Thank you for the reply Daniel_G. I also very appreciate you are here.


    We thought about building a flat reactor type as well - quite similar to old Rossi reactor, but from the point of engineering I am not certain about sealing and loading the meshes inside the container.

    I mean if the container is meant to be sealed perfectly, it will require welding everywhere including a feedthrough to fill the gas.

    That is exactly what we are doing with handheld laser welding. It takes a veteran welder with a steady hand to do this and it’s one of the bottlenecks of the process but as Elon says, if they don’t blow up a few rockets they are actually pushing the edge. When you actually do this stuff vs. just talking about it, it can quickly become a can of worms.


    I think it’s no problem to share photos here when we get it done. I was considering almost exactly what Alan Smith said and will likely try something like that but eventually I want to have a mass flow calorimeter running on these prototypes but first there is still a big IF we can actually make the new design work. I’m cramming 40m2 of surface area in something the size of a MacBook Pro.

    Quote from magicsound

    A quick update: de-loading the mesh from MR5.1 was partially successful. After several hours at 6E-5 Pa, 260°C the cell was allowed to cool, and ~80 Pa D2 was added. The pressure dropped to 17 Pa within a few minutes, showing absorption had been partially restored. Subsequent heating to 260°C showed no deviation from the thermal calibration values.


    I've given some thought to the points raised by me356, and what was learned from MR5.1. Specifically, running the cell at the recommended lower pressure, with the observed fast and deep absorption of D2 makes the thermal calibration of the system far more complex, as convective heat transfer through the gas goes to zero. So I'll be spending some time exploring what is now a three-parameter calibration space, before attempting further tests with the remaining two prepared meshes.


    That was the last we heard about the me356 replication attempt. Update would be nice.


    Members/guests unfamiliar with what is going on: me356 claimed to have mastered the Mizuno reaction by way of a specially prepared mesh. He then offered his mesh, along with assistance, for others willing to try. MFMP's magicsound and Bob Greenyer took him up on the offer.


    First MFMP attempt using 3 of the 5 supplied meshes failed. MFMP was prepping to do a follow-up using the remaining 2. No new info provided since then.

    Quote from Bruce__H

    It would also be nice to see an update from Daniel_G who was claiming much success with meshes prepared under Mizuno's supervision.

    I can't speak about their latest technology related work, but can pass on that the court decided in Mizuno's favor in their legal case against Clean Planet. Last I was told, they were in the settlement phase. Now, maybe with that settled, both Mizuno and Yoshino can dedicate their full attention to R/D.

    I rebuilt my reactor, now with an internal heater and some exterior insulation. Initial calibration went well, though some further testing is needed before adding the treated meshes sent by me356. Here's my live doc showing some build details and the calibration curve:

    Magicsound Lab MR6
    Magicsound Lab MR6: A Mizuno R20 Analogue Work in process: Last revision 20 January ©2023 Creative Commons The work presented in this document follows earlier…
    tinyurl.com

    Hello!


    Nobody else was interested in testing the meshes so there is not much new unfortunately.


    Alan made some important changes to the reactor recently that will add much higher probability for success. I still have to insist it would be even better to have cell with similar dimension as Mizuno had as it is one of the critical factor. But I understand it is expensive and time consuming. Yet I believe it will be enough to see clear excess.

    In short internal heater is really playing a big role, similarly dimension. But this was shared even by Prof Mizuno. Yes, there are several factors that can render null results unfortunately. But I am sure it will be much better this time, thanks to Alan's hard work.


    Week ago I shipped another set of prepared meshes to Alan.

    At the same time I received donation from Jed that covered costs for sent meshes. I have to thank you very much!


    In the meantime we are preparing much bigger reactor than previously with hope to achieve great results even under high load.

    It has roughly 2 times bigger volume than Mizuno reactor.

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