After much internal consideration, and feedback from the members, we have settled on a compromise that will hopefully make everyone happy. It appears Rossi may be setting up for another demonstration of some sort. If so, we will keep the Rossi threads open until that event happens, and then decide on a course of action. This will be his last opportunity as far as LENR-Forum is concerned, to convincingly show he has what he claims.
Rossi threads will remain open for the time being.
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Shane,
I am a scientist, i.e. I believe in the scientific method of proving or disproving hypotheses. I come to LENR Forum for the open views on both sides (supporters or skeptics) of the "LENR" (or cold fusion, or whatever model we want to call this excess energy phenomena). Here LENR Forum serves a societal good purpose as it is 1) concentrated on the topic of each device/experiment; and 2) open for those who follow each device/experiment with greater time investment or contacts then other people (like me) have. It spreads information. It is up for the reader to digest the information and draw their own inferences. In general I find the quality of the commentary, on both sides (supporting or skeptical) of very high quality, and better than a competing forum that appears to only favor one side.
Please keep a Rossi thread open so that the news and commentary on his experiment can be transmitted to the rest of us.
Thank you,
Anonymous
P.S. I am a Rossi skeptic but that doesn't mean I don't want to hear from both people who think he "has it" and people who think he has nothing. I always keep an open mind until something is proven (using the scientific method) beyond any reasonable doubt.
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Rossi thread open so that the news and commentary on his experiment can
Fine..
but let the commentary be on the experiment and not on the personality/underwear ... pls
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After much internal consideration, and feedback from the members, we have settled on a compromise that will hopefully make everyone happy. It appears Rossi may be setting up for another demonstration of some sort. If so, we will keep the Rossi threads open until that event happens, and then decide on a course of action. This will be his last opportunity as far as LENR-Forum is concerned, to convincingly show he has what he claims.
Please remember who brought LENR to the attention of a lot of people about 10 years ago.
LENR forum was founded due to Rossi's activities and the big discussions it invoked back in 2011/2012.
I don't understand why it is even considered to close all Rossi's threads.
In my view the only reason is that those threads are considered to be closed is because of moderation issues.
These moderations issues are mainly due to some posters that never stop arguing why they have the correct opinion and others not.
Time will tell whether Rossi is a genius or a narcissistic pseudo scientist.Until then I fully support the forum keeping Rossi threads open and remind some posters that sometimes it's better to refrain from further comments rather than fight endless discussions that do not contribute any further.
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Shane,
I am a scientist, i.e. I believe in the scientific method of proving or disproving hypotheses. I come to LENR Forum for the open views on both sides (supporters or skeptics) of the "LENR" (or cold fusion, or whatever model we want to call this excess energy phenomena). Here LENR Forum serves a societal good purpose as it is 1) concentrated on the topic of each device/experiment; and 2) open for those who follow each device/experiment with greater time investment or contacts then other people (like me) have. It spreads information. It is up for the reader to digest the information and draw their own inferences. In general I find the quality of the commentary, on both sides (supporting or skeptical) of very high quality, and better than a competing forum that appears to only favor one side.
Please keep a Rossi thread open so that the news and commentary on his experiment can be transmitted to the rest of us.
Thank you,
Anonymous
P.S. I am a Rossi skeptic but that doesn't mean I don't want to hear from both people who think he "has it" and people who think he has nothing. I always keep an open mind until something is proven (using the scientific method) beyond any reasonable doubt.
You will not extract very much info from Rossi or in fact any US commercial based LENR developers. The open source approach is foreign to most of those developers. Mizuno is a pleasant exception and then there are the Russians who are usually open. You should look into open source LENR for data. There is a lot of it and it is very informative. With that data as background, the work that Rossi is doing is more understandable. There are about 10 LENR open source systems that provide open source info which is sufficient to form a detailed theory of the LENR reaction. The SAFIRE project has recently extended a cooperative hand to the open source crew. This system is very interesting since it is unlike most other LENR approaches. The many and varied open source systems provide a solid platform for the formation of informed opinion.
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The main problem talking about Rossi is that he brings out strong emotions for and against. Understandably, as there are those public court documents for all to see, his JONP as a constant reminder of his (lack of) character, weighed against him possibly having something that could save the planet. Not much in between, hence we fight, and emotions run raw.“
From my experience, there is not a single topic of discussion on the Internet that does not bring out strong emotions and unruly behavior. As the old expression goes, if you can’t stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. -
Mats Lewan comment ECat World blog.
Mats Lewan posted this here on ECW today:
“The essential consequence of the SSM version is that he will be able to do a demo pulling the plug and eliminating the input power altogether. That makes verification simple: Any amount of heat produced over a sufficiently long time proves energy production beyond chemical reactions. Done.
And as far as I understand, he’s ready to do such a test as soon as he achieves a stable sum version. No sigma stuff. Will try to assist him in this.” -
I want a sigma drama for one more time!
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The main problem talking about Rossi is that he brings out strong emotions for and against. Understandably, as there are those public court documents for all to see, his JONP as a constant reminder of his (lack of) character, weighed against him possibly having something that could save the planet. Not much in between, hence we fight, and emotions run raw.
That can distract from the main purpose of this forum, which is as you say for "a societal good purpose" of discussing, promoting, and hopefully advancing LENR. Not all are like you, and while we have very healthy membership ranks, and many more Guest followers, there are many who are so turned off to the mud slinging they stay away.
The main problem is lack of courtesy in civil discourse. Polite disagreement is fine. Impolite ad hominem attacks are unacceptable. We are discussing science and if each poster would abide by the self-imposed rule of making certain their on topic response is to the observed facts and not embellished to be aggravating to other readers, it would both increase the signal to noise ratio and would allow us the bandwidth to discuss the technical merits and flaws in the science (and the experiments) we review.
Ad hominem attacks here are like terrorism -- they spoil for all the ability of the institution (in this case the forum) to function for all. Unfortunately this requires good forum moderation (to remove these flame bombs) of which I am greatly appreciative of your collective efforts as moderators. Thank you.
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Keeping thread open till holidays was great idea. Let's allow Rossi great team of Dasher, Dancer, Prancer, Vixen, Comet, Cupid, Dunder, Blixem and Rudolph to compete their great work.
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Forget to mention Vicodin
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Life will be dull without the Rossi intrigue!
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Life will be dull without the Rossi intrigue!
If it comes to that, we will have Grief Counselor's available. Members get a 20% discount off the hourly rate.
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The main problem is lack of courtesy in civil discourse. Polite disagreement is fine. Impolite ad hominem attacks are unacceptable. We are discussing science and if each poster would abide by the self-imposed rule of making certain their on topic response is to the observed facts and not embellished to be aggravating to other readers, it would both increase the signal to noise ratio and would allow us the bandwidth to discuss the technical merits and flaws in the science (and the experiments) we review.
Ad hominem attacks here are like terrorism -- they spoil for all the ability of the institution (in this case the forum) to function for all. Unfortunately this requires good forum moderation (to remove these flame bombs) of which I am greatly appreciative of your collective efforts as moderators. Thank you.
Agreed. In the case of Rossi the proper comment must however note his past lies, bad behaviour towards business partners, accumulation of a large property portfolio in Florida via a tangled web of companies (perhaps not in itself an issue but notable), and extreme on record technical incompetence.
These matters (except perhaps the financial dealings) are directly relevant to any evaluation of the reliability of his statements, and the probability of his ever having had what he claims.
Noting these historic facts summarised as "Rossi is an inveterate liar, or else so divorced from reality that he does not recognise his own falshoods" is not an ad hominem attack. Further, speculating on Rossi's unusual and interesting character, important to his obvious charisma, is not an ad hominem attack and in fact such consideration is essential in making full sense of his history. Those who neglect this end up with naive arguments such as "he must have something or he would not behave as he does, and would not have attracted the support he has over the years" when I'd argue the opposite is true.
I'd also point out that if Rossi relied on external evidence (rather than his own unsubstantiated claims) all this speculation about his character, how many other people he has convinced, etc would be irrelevant to the discussion. he brings it on himself.
THH
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After much internal consideration, and feedback from the members, we have settled on a compromise that will hopefully make everyone happy.
The compromise was one Rossi thread instead of 0! Now we have five nonsense threads about a thing that even when it will happen will not happen...
If you need traffic to get more money from the adds please inform us all openly!
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WOW
Rossi has 5 threads in the top
10 hit parade.
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i think just that moderator's have different opinion of how to handle this case, the result is that demagogy prevails over scientific quality.
LF's lost himself.
Demagogy definition:
Action to flatter and excite popular passions to increase its popularity, its power.
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The compromise was one Rossi thread instead of 0! Now we have five nonsense threads about a thing that even when it will happen will not happen...
If you need traffic to get more money from the adds please inform us all openly!
Funny how that worked out...LOLs. Trust me, this is not what we wanted. And no, letting them run has nothing to do with ad revenue, or demagogy. Last night we were discussing how to handle these new threads, without hurting the feelings of the authors who started them. We will figure something out. Probably consolidate them one night when no one is looking.
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I'd suggest letting all the threads remain as is. Andrea Rossi, The SAFIRE Project, and BLP are all utilizing extremely similar technologies - the negative resistance regime of a plasma discharge with various fuel combinations. I think that letting the Rossi threads take up lots of space here at LENR Forums might motivate The SAFIRE Project or BLP supporters to compose content to compete with them.
