Fusione fredda Renzo Mondaini—trascrizione

Curbina

As negative ions in the solution are attracted to and spinning around the sharp positive anode, isn't that reminiscent of the supposed behavior of electron clusters / EVOs?

LeBob

In the above case (i.e. in the ultra-low cost tests I have been doing so far) the energy would be coming from the electrical pulse(s) that formed the spinning sphere in the first place. So, no excess energy would be normally produced and the sphere formed would quickly dissolve after removing electrical power, but it might not do it instantaneously. This latter point is what I would reasonably expect (hope) to see at best.

One might argue however that under more extreme conditions in a similar configuration, actual clustering of matter and/or electrons would occur. If these composite particles or aggregates are a stable form of matter it means they are at a lower energy level than that of their constituents, and therefore that their formation would release energy. Their fuel or energy source in this case would be matter and electrons from the environment, and in the best case scenario their existence could be sustained in this way.

I just pulled the previous paragraph out of my hat, but it might not be entirely implausible.

Brief update, if anything for backup purposes.

• I could run some more tests today. I improved (probably not 100% fixed) the connection to the cathode and bridged the 5A fuse connection in the DC-DC boost converter.
• One thing I noticed before starting them was that immersed portion of the cathode plate looked oxidized. This could be the result of electrolysis stripping the passivation layer formed from diluted KOH after cleaning in citric acid along with other steel pieces, before this experiment series started.

• From initial tests at voltages in the range of 350–500V it seems that the electrolyte ball does keep rotating by its own inertia for a while after conduction to the cathode is interrupted.
• I have then tried to increase voltage up to 700V. Current draw does not seem as strong as before, but the discharges generated are definitely loud and energetic even with mild hearing protection. It also seems that they are now strong enough to overcome the previously observed disrupting electrolyte ball effect, and the appearance of the plasma formed has also changed, with the formation of an intense white spot close to the tip of the anode and a more incandescent looking plasma in its immediate surroundings. This is not quite visible from the videos, but it can be seen how now the plasma tends to light up the area more. Furthermore it is now possible to lift the anode at significant distances from the electrolyte surface once a plasma is initiated.
• I’ve actually made a couple videos at 700V, but they turned out blurry and a bit boring. and so I’ve merged them together into a single one here:

https://youtu.be/FemERzR94OU

• Unfortunately I could not reproduce the previous ring effect to the same extent as before, although it still occurs.
• Some of the water has vaporized, from the discharges and significant amounts routinely leave the cell as a kind of aerosol. It has warmed noticeably during these tests, although not to high levels.
• I think to improve the reaction further without increasing voltage (which might be already exceeding the safe level for the 2x400V capacitors) I will have to increase electrolyte concentration, which is still 0.75M K2CO3. Ideally a strong base (e.g. KOH or NaOH, or perhaps even LiOH) at high concentrations would be used like Bazhutov et al did (up to 10M), but I cannot run such experiment safely.
• Probably next time I will increase K2CO3 concentration to 1.5M and start from a lower voltage. I think it can be easily expected that all previously observed effects will increase in magnitude like they did before. I cannot do this in this exact moment as the reaction is too loud for the time of the day. Speaking of the noise, I don't know if it's just an effect of the discharges themselves, or if explosive chemical reactions are involved (e.g. possibly H2-O2 recombination).

After increasing again electrolyte concentration I've stumbled again—as in previous tests—upon the issue of excessive electrolyte splashing. Again some practical/experiment notes from the tests:

• Added 2.24g K2CO3 to reach 5.53g in total and 1.25M concentration in the assumed 32ml water (in reality it is probably a bit less than this due to losses). It dissolved quickly. The electrolyte is a bit murky possibly from Fe particles in suspension.
• Decreased voltage to 602V. Testing… severe splashing occurring but the discharges are not too loud. I think some energy is being wasted by sparks on the top connection to the anode wire, which is not well-made. The multimeter and the current clamp in DC mode seem to agree on current passed being low in the order of 0.02–0.03A, but in AC mode the current clamp shows up to 0.17–0.22A. Overall the sparks today do not seem very energetic however.
• Increased voltage to 701V … Splashing now excessive, reaction seems more inefficient than in the previous tests with a lower electrolyte concentration. I tried cutting the top end of a plastic bottle into a funnel and put it on the jar, which helped a bit, although a large amount of electrolyte droplets, as well as aerosol, still gets out of the relatively large opening. A wide and shallow-opening funnel could be more helpful, but gases will also have to be dealt with.

• I got a small shock when I turned off the power supply after a run because one of the output wires (insulated, but not rated for the voltages used) from the HV converter was in contact with the input power ground connection wire. Gotta be careful of where the wires go. This also means that some energy might be wasted in this way, so wiring will have to be improved besides safety reasons.
• I’ve made some slow-mo videos but they weren’t very impressive. The electrolyte solution has become opaque and was kind of foamy during the discharges. From the 240fps video, compared to previous ones, the plasma is now whiter and closer to how it looks in reality. I recall reading in some discussions that this color denotes a mode change in typical plasma electrolysis experiments? I'm not sure about that, though.
• The base frequency of the large spikes is only about 20-25 Hz from audio waveform analysis.
• Slow-mo video here: https://youtu.be/l8JjYBTXkzo (unlisted for now)

• I think the ideal range electrolyte concentration for these short crude tests at the voltages used with K2CO3 is about 0.50–0.75M. Above this level and splashing becomes an issue; not clear if due to the electrolyte itself or merely from the higher solution conductivity. A better setup is required.

Alan Smith

Foaming is a minor issue that I've only really noticed in the videos; the main problem here is the splashing or spraying of fine electrolyte droplets which seems to be directly caused by the discharges (rather than for example just the electrolyte solution getting agitated), the processes involved, or both. Fine droplets can be seen flying in all directions—also vertically—together with larger ones that usually end up depositing on the internal jar walls.

The formation of the finer ones might not necessarily be a bad thing (no way to determine this yet however) but it is definitely inconvenient in these manually-operated tests.

I don't recall where I've read it first, but last summer this came out—it might be of relevance to the many variations of "water explosion" experiments: Chemists discover water microdroplets spontaneously produce hydrogen peroxide

Spontaneous generation of hydrogen peroxide from aqueous microdroplets

https://doi.org/10.1073/pnas.1911883116

Quote

We show H2O2 is spontaneously produced from pure water by atomizing bulk water into microdroplets (1 μm to 20 µm in diameter). Production of H2O2, as assayed by H2O2-sensitve fluorescence dye peroxyfluor-1, increased with decreasing microdroplet size. Cleavage of 4-carboxyphenylboronic acid and conversion of phenylboronic acid to phenols in microdroplets further confirmed the generation of H2O2. The generated H2O2 concentration was ∼30 µM (∼1 part per million) as determined by titration with potassium titanium oxalate. Changing the spray gas to O2 or bubbling O2 decreased the yield of H2O2 in microdroplets, indicating that pure water microdroplets directly generate H2O2 without help from O2 either in air surrounding the droplet or dissolved in water. We consider various possible mechanisms for H2O2 formation and report a number of different experiments exploring this issue. We suggest that hydroxyl radical (OH) recombination is the most likely source, in which OH is generated by loss of an electron from OH− at or near the surface of the water microdroplet. This catalyst-free and voltage-free H2O2 production method provides innovative opportunities for green production of hydrogen peroxide.

EDIT: as H2O2 (hydrogen peroxide) is a potent oxidizer and explosive, it might potentially explain some unusual results in plasma discharge experiments.

EDIT2: speaking of antifoaming agents for aquaria, after a short search it looks like many products are food-grade silicone (PDMS)-based emulsions. I have a canister of silicone grease, perhaps tiny amounts will have similar effects?

Last tests for the year unless I come up with something else to check out.

• I noticed that from their patent application, at 10M concentration Bazhutov et al used significantly larger amounts of NaOH than what is useful for achieving the best electrical conductivity. Graph below from a document I linked earlier on the conductance of various substances.

• From their data, the reported excess heat increased roughly linearly with the electrolyte concentration. Putting aside that I cannot measure heat properly in my setup (except in case of very large effects), maybe it could be useful to do the same with these smaller-scale tests I’m doing using K2CO3. Eyeballed trendline in the graph.

• So I (eventually) increased K2CO3 in the solution to saturation, with about 32g K2CO3 in the supposed 32ml water (in reality slightly less). This should be 7.24M concentration. Not all the electrolyte managed to dissolve.
• Following this I dialed back voltage to the minimum allowed and contrary to expectations I could also obtain a tiny plasma at the point of contact of the anode with the surface even at 87V (the minimum that could be set across both electrodes). However at these low voltages it easily reverts to electrolysis. This could still be mainly due to the unfavorable characteristics of my DC boost converter.
• I’ve made a video of tests at an increasing voltage (87V, 125V, 175V, 225V). I haven't annotated this in the various sections, but the differences in the reaction can be clearly seen. Aerosol production and splashing started to become noticeable at 225V. At that point the electrolyte solution was also getting lukewarm from the tests. The video is a bit boring and low-quality.

• When triggering the discharges close to the jar wall, a large number of tiny bubbles that increase in number with the size of the electrolyte ball is easily visible. After the ball dissolves, touching again the same area with the anode causes a small audible explosion, possibly from trapped oxygen and hydrogen gases.
• Eventually I increased further voltage to 275V and made a few more tests. It seems that DC input current to the DC boost converter increases the larger the electrolyte ball becomes. It starts from 0.3–0.5A and increases to about 2.3A just before the ball bursts. Input voltage should be 12.2V, and can only decrease from that. Note that contrary to readings from the high voltage outputs, this is a more stable and more reliable value.
• In reality before testing with a saturated solution I tried at a 5M concentration and I could obtain the same tiny reaction at the minimum voltage at this level too.
• I haven't tried higher voltages yet due to not wanting concentrated electrolyte sprayed all over the place.

Quote from Arun Luthra

Anyone care to speculate on why the deuterium 327 MHz peak would light up in a light water experiment?

Mondaini said that, but while the first peak (A) was indeed almost at 117 MHz, the second one (B) is not exactly centered at 327 MHz in his graph, if you agree that it starts at 0 Mhz, ends at 2000 MHz and has 10 major subdivisions. I tried digitalizing a perspective-corrected version using https://apps.automeris.io/wpd/

The contents of the zipfile attached in the post can be opened with the web application linked above.

By the way, eventually I tried reverting to the typical Mizuno/Mondaini polarity after experimenting with the thin anode for several days. The reaction is visually much more intense, but current draw (DC from a multimeter) is also significantly higher, as well as electrode consumption. Lower voltages can be used at a generally low splashing level.

At saturation K2CO3 concentration it was possible to trigger the reaction even at 100V in one attempt, but it was hard to initiate due to the sagging voltage from the DC boost converter under load (given by electrolysis). Once it starts and the cathode or the electrolyte solution heats up, it becomes easier to maintain. Under this mode of operation the cathode appears to be rapidly consumed.

I think the most significant observation that I could make with this polarity is that no explosive (?) electrolyte balls (clumps) form around the thin cathode. On the other hand, alkali deposition—probably as hydroxides—occurs instead. The cathode becomes covered by a solid white substance that easily dissolves in water. This can be seen in the videos below and even better in another further below.

In another test using a flat but sharp cathode, noticing severe difficulties in starting the reaction due to the limited power of the DC boost converter, but also that it seemed easier to start it on the jar wall close to the surface, I put some pieces of broken glass into the jar, partially immersed in the electrolyte. The idea was that the reaction would be initiated more easily through the electrolyte film adsorbed on glass surface.

I noticed that the glass pieces easily melted and started themselves conducting a current, glowing in the process. However one more factor with this is that the electrolyte will decompose, forming locally high concentrations of KOH (and NaOH from the glass material may also be produced). Ordinary soda glass is highly susceptible to concentrated hydroxides.

In the end I got complaints about noise (did I mention it is loud?) and got asked if I was doing dangerous stuff, so I figured it would be probably better to stop for the time being.

Arun Luthra

I think the radio peaks will be mainly a function of the plasma discharge rate (it might seem continuous but it's highly intermittent), conditions of the system, and properties of the circuit formed (how resonant it is, etc). The interrupted discharges will cause a large number of harmonics extending to very high frequencies.

Furthermore, when using PWM-controlled devices for modulating or producing the discharges, they might be seen too in the radio spectrum. This will probably have not been the case in Mondaini's experiments with a Variac, but it was in mine as I was using a switching-mode 12V power supply and the previously discussed DC boost converter. The latter seemed to automatically adjust its frequency depending on load, at least from the faint noise it produced.

So any prominent peak would have to be verified to be truly independent of these variables.

Arun Luthra

What 490V DC power supply did you use? Have you also tried using the opposite polarity (i.e. Bazhutov/Parkhomov anodic plasma arrangement) ? At high voltages it should be easier to manage because current draw will be lower, but the behavior will also be different.

For what it's worth, earlier I planned to eventually purchase 1mm-diameter tungsten welding rods, to be sanded down into a needle with a power screwdriver and coarse-grit alumina-based sandpaper.

Regarding the electrolyte, it is tempting to start with just very little concentrations, but in the end I found that it makes the reaction more difficult to initiate, with higher voltages required than with larger amounts.

Arun Luthra

What component did fail? Mine has resisted abuse fairly well (surviving even wrong input polarity—the 5A fuse did blow though), but I avoided shorting the outputs or overloading the device as the manufacturer recommended.

I have been considering building my own with a simplified construction, more rugged components and much larger capacitance, also so that I could have proper grounding while still obtaining high voltages, but while boost converters in principle are simple devices, designing one so that it won't destroy itself when the outputs are shorted is not trivial. Perhaps a different approach, with the condition that I won't be using wall AC voltage directly, will be easier (EDIT: e.g. custom flyback transformer).

I think Parkhomov's latest report (as discussed in another thread) best represents a typical Bazhutov-type setup. It is not that different from the ordinary one using a thin cathode, nor complex. It has a cylindrical cathode with an opening to better observe the reaction, but that is probably not a critical parameter since the best results are apparently obtained when the sharp anode is not immersed in the electrolyte and a spark discharge occurs at a sufficiently high voltage.

Typical Bazhutov replication experiments as reported by other Russian sources in the past years did run with immersed electrodes, but at much higher average power, which will likely have the effect of producing more sparks due to the generated gases forming a sort of insulating layer around the anode.