Covid-19 News

    So vaccination (can) produces the same symptoms as long Covid.


    Big Pharma mafia:: Vaccines can help to cure long Covid. Any more questions?


    Yes, many more. In fact as I said above long COVID is badly defined, not well studied. Can vaccines have side effects because of adverse immune reponse? Sure. Does COVID generate side effects due to adverse immune response? Sure. The key question is where is the cross-over, where risk of COVID gets to be smaller than risk of vaccines.


    That is going to be an open scientiific question for quite some time. Those interested in it will not leap on evidence in one direction, but look at all evidence dispassionately.


    It is, alas, also a pressing political question. Publicising low incidence problems in vaccines leads to vaccine hesitancy which is bad for those who hesitate (they get COVID, and suffer) and bad for society (COVID rates are higher overall).


    Regulators have a responsibility to ensure that emergency use vaccines are only made available to those people who do not personally suffer more risk from the vaccine than from the virus.


    For emergency use, with COVID, we can be sure:

    The science will be uncertain, and change over time

    The pressure to allow more vaccination, for the good of all, is high in many countries.


    I have no reason to think the regulators who make these decisions in different countries are caving in to that pressure. But I'm glad i don't have to make that judgement. You can maybe get some insight by comparing different regulators but politics can push scientists towards different judgements in both directions. Doctors are as capable of infection with extreme-right (or extreme-left) memes as anyone.

    Quote from THHuxleynew

    https://journals.plos.org/plos…1371/journal.pmed.1003656


    interesting paper . Comparing those vaccinated with those who were infected with early wave COVID. Both have a long-term antibody response. But the natural antibody response is much more specific to the original variant than the vaccine response, and therefore does not so much help against delta.

    Good paper with 7 months window confirming the Japanese paper with 6 month window. Only few patients who had CoV-19 show a low reaction on live virus where low most of the time still is enough. Test time was 3 days where as the Japanese did wait 2 days. The method was the same.

    In fact they only use blood from sick people and do not compare it with blood from vaccinated!


    May be @THH messed up the link as he doubled the first one!

    Quote from THHuxleynew

    Regulators have a responsibility to ensure that emergency use vaccines are only made available to those people who do not personally suffer more risk from the vaccine than from the virus.

    It's not about the regulators that today US/UK/Europe are the same persons that generate their income from big pharma. FDA e.g. is highly corrupt. It's about big pharma/finance sector terror.

    What happened in USA /CA so far: Today 40% of all population will no longer take any vaccines (up from 3%) . You cannot hide 200'000 deaths and cripples. It's like in war. Everybody knows somebody and this produces a collective shock.


    E.g. the Pfizer vaccines should never have been allowed and latest be stopped after the first 1000 death. (Of course death from Pfizer induced COV-19 due to vaccine induced immune suppression)


    Once more:: Comparing other direct vaccine deaths is easy thanks to the huge US flu vaccination 2020. Just count the deaths after the flue vaccine(s) and compare it with the ones after the CoV-19 vaccines. Hint: Yearly deaths/year USA from vaccines = 20.

    No need to read any theme related paper = pharma propaganda.

    E.g. the Pfizer vaccines should never have been allowed and latest be stopped after the first 1000 death. (Of course death from Pfizer induced COV-19 due to vaccine induced immune suppression)


    I await (have been awaiting for many weeks) your explanation of how in that case UK death rates are so incredibly low versus case rates when we have a largely Pfizer vaccinated population, compared with originally when we did not have that. Or why, of that population, those in hospital (after age correction) show risks of this are > 10X higher for those unvaccinated.

    Quote from THHuxleynew

    I await (have been awaiting for many weeks) your explanation of how in that case UK death rates are so incredibly low versus case rates when we have a largely Pfizer vaccinated population, compared with originally when we did not have that

    Simply because UK makes no statistic of CoV-19 after first vaccine shot.

    In the phase III trial of Pfizer 200 out of 15'000 in the vaccine - after 1st jab developed symptoms and were clandestine excluded from the trial. (argument to close to jab... really funny...) The 200 sorted out you find the Pfizer phase III first report.


    Israel data is clear. During lock down steep increase (happened 2x!!) in cases after after the vaccination programs started.

    No other country ever had a steep increase long after a lock down started...

    We here have to thank Israel vaccine concentration camp guinea pigs for spending/to sacrifice their live for this data....


    Of course nobody will be paid to write a Mengele paper about this...

    So consider a time window of two weeks from the vaccine shot, two shots ,that add up to 4 weeks. There are 52 weeks a year so say that the intensity is around 1/10 a year to simplify.


    US has around 300million people, if we consider an even age distribution and all live 100 years, we get 3 million deaths a year,

    that lead to 3 million / 10 = 300.000 individuals die during these 4 weeks normally in USA and within 2 weeks from the vaccine shot roughly. Divide by 2/30 and you get 20.000 individuals that die within a day after a shot. divide by 25 and you get 800 that die within 1 hour of a vaccine shot etc. This is a very simple analysis but you get some ball park figures.


    So you need to answer, how is death by vaccine and death by age / other cause separated. Typically you would like to report all of those deaths and see if the numbers are significant higher than what we normally experience due to old age and monitor this statistic closely. What you do is to dived the sample into different groups like age sex co-morbidities, death cause or severe issue , time to death from shot and so on. You can bet that the experts are using quite sophisticated models to monitor these values. Also they also need to have a good sophisticated model for the natural deaths as we can't use this year, but deduce it from the last years. The monitoring of the deaths and medical issues is most probably also analyzed to infer if it is medically probable that there is a direct cause between vaccine and issues.


    There is no way that comparing flue shots with covid shots will lead to a better model. And astronomically big numbers cannot possibly be hidden due to some kind of conspiracy or bribing as that scheme needs to cover essentially all governments that employ

    an in hose analysis of the vaccines and they are many. Smaller variations, yes sure, but not huge ones, that's simply out of the question.


    With blood-cloths, I think they found that for the age group the numbers was alarmingly high, in Norway I think, and it have caused research to search for the medical cause and stall the vaccination for a more detailed investigation, like going through all the medical records etc, the research community is on to it.


    There has also gone off an alarm that young people can get problems now lately and expert voices in sweden calls for young People to

    not be vaccinated, and I agree together with my children's mother, with that caution.


    What I would like to know is if they group people into groups of how well their immune system works generally, I think that this

    group could correlate with some of the drawbacks in the databases.

    • Official Post

    The Olympic Games in Japan will be held without spectators at venues in and around the capital after a spike in coronavirus infections.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-57760883?xtor=ES-211-


    Olympics Minister Tamayo Marukawa made the announcement after talks with officials and organisers on Thursday.

    A state of emergency in Tokyo will run throughout the Games, to combat coronavirus.

    Prime Minister Yoshihide Suga told reporters it would run from 12 July and remain in place until 22 August.

    Bars and restaurants will not be allowed to serve alcohol and must close by 20:00 (11:00 GMT).

    Venues in Tokyo and other areas near the capital city will not be allowed to hold events with fans during the Games.

    But stadiums in the regions of Fukushima, Miyagi and Shizuoka will be permitted to have spectators up to 50% of capacity and up to 10,000 people.

    Coronavirus infections are rising in Tokyo as the 23 July opening ceremony edges closer.

    There has been widespread opposition to the Games in Japan, with calls for them to be postponed or cancelled.

    After meeting government officials, Tokyo 2020 President Seiko Hashimoto said: "It is regrettable that we are delivering the Games in a very limited format, facing the spread of coronavirus infections. "I am sorry to those who purchased tickets and everyone in local areas."


    Tokyo governor Yuriko Koike said that holding Olympic events without spectators was "heart-breaking" for those who wanted to attend. It was not immediately clear if refunds will be made available to some or all ticketholders. Mr Suga announced the state of emergency in Tokyo earlier in the day.

    "Taking into consideration the effect of coronavirus variants and not to let the infections spread again to the rest of the nation, we need to strengthen our countermeasures," the prime minister said.


    The state of emergency was announced after a meeting between the organising committee, the government and the International Olympic Committee president, Thomas Bach, who has just arrived in Japan.

    The Olympic Games are scheduled to take place in the Japanese capital between 23 July and 8 August. The Paralympic Games are between 24 August and 5 September.

    What's happening with Covid in Japan? A new wave of infections began in April, but overall the country has had relatively low case numbers and a death toll of around 14,900.

    On Wednesday, there were 2,180 new cases reported in the country. Some 920 of those were in Tokyo, up from 714 last week and its highest since 1,010 on 13 May.

    Quote from Wyttenbach

    Good paper with 7 months window confirming the Japanese paper with 6 month window. Only few patients who had CoV-19 show a low reaction on live virus where low most of the time still is enough. Test time was 3 days where as the Japanese did wait 2 days. The method was the same.

    In fact they only use blood from sick people and do not compare it with blood from vaccinated!


    May be @THH messed up the link as he doubled the first one!

    W, I see a lot of these papers - while titers may be low in actual patients - presumably real world performance could have them being ramped up very fast. In fact, it is possible a health person with low titers could respond very fast, vs an elderly person with higher titers that are sub-neutralizing.


    How much does this bench-lab work correlate with real world performance (not even accounting for T-cells)?

    Quote from Alan Smith

    A state of emergency in Tokyo will run throughout the Games, to combat coronavirus.

    An ivermectin clinical trial will be run by Kowa pharmaceuticals..


    A lttle bit late.. probably the Philippines/Indonesia trials will beat them to the post

    https://www.tokai-tv.com/tokainews/article_20210702_179074

    Code
    The clinical trial will be conducted in collaboration with Kitasato University in Tokyo, targeting approximately 1,000 mildly ill patients with the new corona such as Aichi and Tokyo.
    Quote from stefan

    So you need to answer, how is death by vaccine and death by age / other cause separated.

    Stefan we know that you work for a company that also makes money from big pharma studies. But with your math background you should understand that we here do not talk of 4 weeks time frame. The setup time for vaccine related death is in average between 3-6 hours. Many die within an hour. Today we can help a big portion of them - that die very early. Some die because idiots give the jab that do not check for a blood vessel hit.


    Go once into the wonder/vaers database at look at the 30% of fully documented cases. Even if death sometimes is delayed by a few days the event of no return did set up the same day of vaccination. You should no longer make of fool of you because others expect this.

    Quote from stefan

    There is no way that comparing flue shots with covid shots will lead to a better model.

    Exactly this is the approach you propose. Do it simple use the same time frame for flue shots. As said do make yourself a fool.


    USA currently has the same amount of CoV-19 vaccinated than flu vaccinated 2020. So we effectively can 1:1 compare.


    As the forced to retract paper shows:: Currently CoV-19 Vaccines for most of us are a greater risk than getting CoV-19. I would set the no go limit somewhere between 45...65 depending on health condition. Vaccinating children is worse than any WWII crime done by Mengele.



    Quote from Navid

    How much does this bench-lab work correlate with real world performance (not even accounting for T-cells)?

    T-Cells can work in these tests as the time frame (duration of test) is 2-3 days. But don't ask me how effectively they do it in a jar.


    Quote from RobertBryant

    An ivermectin clinical trial will be run by Kowa pharmaceuticals..


    Why??? After the Uttar Pradesh live trial with 200mio sample size we need no more trials. We only need un-bribed politicians that do their job.

    Uttar Pradesh has 1/2 cases/mio. in average since a few weeks.

    The control group was Tamil Nadu with a Gilead bribed minister that after total failure with Gilead crap Remdesivir joined 4 weeks later and reported the same positive effect as the 1'300'000'000 Indians that have been or still are in the trial...

    Quote from THHuxleynew

    mRNA vaccine safety.


    perhaps this overview, and its references, would form a good starting point for discussion?


    https://pssjournal.biomedcentr…0.1186/s13037-021-00291-9

    I have had a chance to read this... some comments :

    "Whereas, mRNA vaccines have been designed and developed for years against other pathogens, such as ebola, zika, rabies, influenza, and cytomegalovirus [22, 23]."


    This is very misleading. yes, they have been worked on for years, but never approved NOR used via FDA approved standards! This statement is leading one uneducated to think mRNA vaccines are "old hat", often and successfully used. This is simply not true. In truth, they were attempted to be developed for the above, but never received FDA approval to my knowledge. Why did they not get approval????


    "The immune cells then display the spike protein on their surface and break down the instructions to build the spike protein that was provided by the mRNA vaccine (Fig. 2). The immune system recognizes that this protein is foreign and instructs the immune system to develop antibodies against COVID-19 [24]."


    This method has the body itself creating foreign matter! The attenuated virus is not subjected, but the body itself is being manipulated to create something it would never do otherwise. These particles are then detected by the bodies immune system and antibodies against it developed. One very serious question is how safe this is! Does the mRNA create ONLY a very limited spike? How well do we know? Also, the body is now creating antibodies for something the very same body created..... autoimmune risks!! Again, long term testing has not been done on this and it was a issue in early mRNA tests.


    "As of publication of this review, there have been no serious side effects identified in the ongoing phase 3 clinical trials for both the Moderna and Pfzier/BioNTech mRNA vaccines "


    We know more now! There are serious side effects starting to show up. Not frequent (and hopefully will stay rare, believe me I do not want these vaccines to fail) Yet there is no long term reliability tests yet.


    ", safety of the vaccine was comparable to that of other viral vaccines"


    This statement is totally unsupported conjecture. Again, zero long term safety trials have been done for a completely unrelated and novel type of vaccine. It is irresponsible to state this.


    "Acute, temporary, unilateral peripheral facial paralysis (Bell’s palsy, an idiopathic palsy of cranial nerve VII) was also reported [34]. "


    I am not a doctor nor really qualified to interpret this. However, it would seem that this side effect would be of significant concern as it is neurological. That means the mRNA is creating some set of circumstances that is either not immune related or is causing an auto-immune response to certain nerve pathways. Either way, this should be most concerning, even if rare. Again, short term issues can increase in frequency with time!

    No long term studies are known.


    "These data raise apprehensions because favorable perinatal outcomes depend a great deal upon amplified helper T cell type 2 and regulatory T cell activity coupled with decreased Th1 responses. Alteration of CD4 + T cell responses during pregnancy is related to unfavorable pregnancy outcomes such as preterm birth and fetal loss [43]. Moreover, some evidence suggests that babies born to mothers with variant CD4 + T cell responses may suffer enduring adverse consequences [44]."


    Self explanatory..


    "Vaccine hesitancy has been described as a “lack of confidence in vaccination and/or complacency about vaccination”"


    Over half the article was centered on arguing against vaccine hesitancy and how to over come it.... not providing actual safety information.... Not bad in itself, but really showed the bias of the article... I would not expect any serious negative issues to be reported here.


    "


    Conclusions

    The current data suggests that the currently approved mRNA-based COVID-19 vaccines are safe and effective for the vast majority of the population.


    The article was informative and I did increase my understanding of some aspects of the mRNA story,

    However, over all it was not very convincing about safety... long term.


    To recap my position, it is quite apparent that Covid vaccines work. Different brands seem to have different efficacy... some questionable such as the Sinopharm and others different levels against variants. (Something all vaccines fight against!) I believe the at risk population should educate themselves about thier condition and the risk of the vaccines, but in most cases, probably wise to take it.


    For the young (especially under 20) I would not encourage them to take it. Long term studies simply are not proven yet. For those who have had Covid, I am not 100% decided. Natural immunity should as good or better than vaccines, until the variants are considered. I have not seen why the an unmodified vaccine would be any better than natural immunity against variants. Future modified ones certainly might have.


    I myself have had Covid. It was extremely mild. I have no known conditional risks. So my stance is unchanged by this article. I will continue vit. D, C, Zn and Quercetin. I have Ivermectin ready. I will personally wait until more long term data is available.


    P.S. I was a bit hesitant to post the following.

    My wife started feeling a bit under the weather. Symptoms very similar to her previous bout of Covid. She asked me about taking ivermectin again. I re-read the IMASK protocol and related articles. I found nothing that worried me to follow it again.

    So she started the prophylactic phase of the IMASK protocol, which includes 5 day, single dose of ivermectin. By day two she reported feeling 100% better. She is a firm believer. (No, we did not test for Covid again however, if ivermectin works against viral Covid, it could work with other viral bugs!)


    While I realize this is not proof, my wife is intelligent and not a hypochondriac. I am quite confident she really did feel better. I admit I cannot prove it was ivermectin, but it sure did not hurt the situation.... and has now done so twice. ........ All for $3.99 ...... no, other than asprin/ibuprofen, we do not self medicate..... well maybe a glass of red wine once in a great while. :)

    It's impossible for me to know all what my company does as its huge but my area is programming container cranes. I also have helped and help on my free time in smaller research projects in medicin amongst friends.


    Now you defined some information about a subgroup, death just hours after jab and younger cohorts. Strange that those groups are not monitored becase I get the impression that the magnitude is quite large from what you claim and hence the effect should be obvious. Just to do a quick check, So how many did you find in this group?

    • Official Post

    Official Australian government document refers to Vaccines for SARS CoV2 as “poison”.



    Link:

    https://www.wa.gov.au/governme…an-defence-force-no2-2021




    link: https://www.wa.gov.au/sites/de…No2-Aus-Defence-Force.pdf


    Unless there’s an alternate meaning for the word “poison” that I am not aware of, this seems rather puzzling.

    I checked with archive.org to see if the site may have been hacked to change the word, the first snapshot is from April 24th 2021, and it has the word poison in all snapshots since then, so the word was used intentionally and originally in this Australian Army Healthcare document.


    Any thoughts?

    I did check the VAERS database. On a first glance, printing per age group and onset reveal a glaring pattern with high numbers the first days of onset. For age 50-59 we have around 30 dead at 0 day. Now assume 20 million in this age group and 10000-20000 dead per year and million, we are talking about 200 000 - 400 000 dead a year, divide by 400 and you get 500-1000 dead a day, divide by 25 and about 20-40 dead an hour. Clearly the 30 dead in VAERS is not all dead that happened in less than one day after the jab, but just, it looks, a tiny fraction of it. So it looks like VAERS is a result of unknown selection rules and I would be very cautious to use this database. Also the pattern is very obvious. If you get a similar pattern in a more complete statistic, like in Sweden, experts here analyzing the data would have hit the break a long time ago if the pattern in VAERS is reproduced. It's that obvious of a statistic. Now VAERS is not a systematic database but depends on willingness to report. It is not unlikely that a doctor that has a case one hour after a jab has a higher tendency to report then after 5 days. Also comparing different years with different vaccines is problematic, as habits of reporting can change and may not be consistent.


    So: vaccination programs do not alter R number until you have vaccinated a LOT of people, and whatever change they make, it is slow until you have almost everyone vaccinated.


    The "steep increase in cases" in many countries comes from more infectious variants: alpha (now everywhere and dominant) and more recently delta (now everywhere, will be dominant everywhere soon). The Israeli increase was down to delta:

    https://www.ft.com/content/8c3…87-4daf-9442-e73065aa2649


    Non-lockdown R started of at an estimated 2.7. It is now (from delta) an estimated 6-8.


    Alpha transmissability vs original COVID: https://science.sciencemag.org/content/372/6538/eabg3055

    Alpha + Delta (pop overview): https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57431420


    COVID (thank God) started of a lot less infectious than flu, and controllable with lockdown. With delta now that no longer works unless you have very very tight lockdown - I don't notice many people doing this - or very low incidence, local lockdowns, well funded and efficient track-and trace. Australia is an example of this. i hope they manage to keep delta outbreaks under control but am not sure they will be able to. They are certainly pulling out all the stops to try since they are basically COVID-free, and super-vulnerable with very little vaccination.


    As for other countries with steep increases long after lockdown, try the UK? That was from alpha the first time, and delta the second.


    it is funny - the big arguments we had a year ago about to lockdown or no have been modulated by availability of vaccines. With the most vulnerable 50% of the population vaccinated the "let it rip" strategy looks much more reasonable. It is what the UK is now doing - the UK government has wanted to do it from day 1 but been restrained by bad PR from overflowing hospitals and burnt out doctors.


    I suspect - whether we like it or not - this is the best we will get. In many countries without access to population-wide vaccination delta or future variants will inevitably spread and very many will die. In the UK it will still be a private tragedy for the few people who are immunosuppressed etc. Those places (like parts of the US) that have very large-scale vaccine hesitancy in spite of availability will see many people die. That is an avoidable tragedy - but freedom + typical human stupidity = avoidable tragedy. All societies manage this balance and reduce freedom a bit to reduce the avoidable tragedies a bit. Parts of the US have in my view got this balance wrong - and as the result, in part, of poisonous anti-vax propaganda.


    I'm not talking here about whether you choose to vaccinate children - I agree the personal risk/reward there is uncertain. But that an environment suspicious of experts, science, causes many older and vulnerable people (say in their 50s and 60s) to avoid vaccines. A few % of these will be unlucky in the COVID-severity genetic lottery.

    What annoys me is how the internet propagates linguistic or regulatory anomalies like this and uses them to feed virulent anti-vax conspiracy theories without the context provided above on this thread.

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