Covid-19 News

    Quote from Bob#2

    ?? Sometimes it is statements like this that cause such an adverse reaction. Perhaps I have misunderstood?

    You make it sound as if Vit. D is of barely any importance!


    Bob - if that causes an adverse reaction i am sorry, but rather surprised.


    I am positive on Vitamin D. I've been taking it myself.


    I can't see how you get from "vitamin D has a chance of being a good therapy for severe COVID" to "vitamin D is of barely any importance".


    The truth is that it has not been easy to find anything to help severe COVID - a dreadful disease here your whole body starts leaking blood, and then clotting. If Vitamin D did that it would be a game changer. Even if, more likley, it significantly reduces progsresion and death it will be a very big deal.


    Anyway, we do not yet know: we have just that one RCT.


    It is the aspect of therapy that is most exciting because there is the possibility of finding a magic bullet for severe COVID once we have enough handle on exactly how that works. Whereas anti-virals are slow to find and because the virus mutates we will probably need a lot of different ones combined to be effective. It is a pity the testing so far has been so concentrated on just one or two candidates.


    THH

    What we know - and what we don't know - on aerosol transmission


    https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3206


    Since the 2003 SARS outbreak, research in aerobiology, physics, and computational fluid dynamics has advanced our understanding of aerosol generation and the carriage and fate of respiratory particles.146781314 Airborne transmission of covid-19 is now the plausible cause of superspreading events in a call centre in Korea, a choir practice in Skagit County, US, and a restaurant in Guangzhou, China.1214 The pandemic is at a critical juncture, and these strong signals should not be ignored by politicians and public health leaders.

    Urgent research is needed to better understand airborne transmission and measure viral aerosol outputs during respiratory activity and medical procedures. In the meantime, international guidance must acknowledge the weight of evidence supporting airborne transmission of covid-19 and include recommendations to promote effective preventive measures. How should infection control practice be changed if we provisionally accept that aerosols have an important role in viral transmission?

    Inhalational risk may be reduced by social distancing, limiting interaction indoors, avoiding air recirculation, improved natural and artificial ventilation, and innovative engineering solutions which collect and neutralise aerosols to provide clean air in personal and community spaces.14 The infection risk associated with deep breathing, talking, and singing indoors is underappreciated and urgently needs attention.

    Aerosol generating procedure is a misleading term, and its use probably leads to overestimation of risk in stable patients while proved aerosol generating activities such as coughing and talking are neglected.148 The risk associated with individual procedures should instead be classified by measuring aerosol emissions, comparing them with those from other respiratory activities, and placing them in clinical context. In the interim, healthcare workers require access to respirator masks for all high risk encounters, not just during selected clinical procedures.

    Controlling this pandemic is difficult when the fundamental science determining the response is misunderstood. Accepting the importance of airborne transmission may prove a crucial breakthrough and should not be delayed further.

    THHuxleynew I actually agree with most of your analyses and can only encourage you to do more - which you might think is paradoxical since I have always been on the side of researching medicinal biochemicals rather than vaccine or targeted testing and tracing and Ferguson's epidemiological approach that eventually we will all have 'herd immunity'. Ferguson recently admitted on a TV interview that he wished he had been more emphatic with his warnings to the UK government of the dangers of ending the lock-down too early, he is right as we can now see an exponential rise of cases here beginning again. Disaster I am afraid (when profit is put before people's lives, that saving the economy takes precedence over the health on the nation - and I am not a Momentum Marxist either I have always believed in the highest form of democracy, centrist as advocated by Pericles around 500 BC )!



    However, the group strongly feels the urgent need for a well-designed randomized control trial & proposes judicious use of Ivermectin for Covid-19 treatment.


    Basically, they are saying: well, Ivermectin might work, and it is cheap and has low toxicity so let us use it - but also that it would be good urgently to get evidence on whether it works!


    Same principle as Zinc (cheap, non-toxic, might work) and doxycycline (quite cheap, not very toxic, probably does work a bit at least, and antibiotic resistance is a smaller problem right now than COVID).

    Quote from Dr Richard

    Ferguson recently admitted on a TV interview that he wished he had been more emphatic with his warnings to the UK government of the dangers of ending the lock-down too early, he is right as we can now see an exponential rise of cases here beginning again.


    I just remember you the recent BBC story of a British man that has been tested positive. Instead of going home into quarantine he went (as usual) in the pub to drown his frustration. Result: > 50 infections.


    This has nothing to do we early ending a lock down. It's just the inability of most people (politicians) to deal with the situation. As a first reaction the state now can order a (new) penalty of up to 12'000£. Politicians simply have forgotten how to deal with people... So this cure (penalty) will only make things worse.


    CoV-19 obviously is a serious disease and the first task should be to give people the usual medicaments and to control that they directly go home! Do people have to walk around with a gun in hand that politician understand that they are, may be, a danger for the public?

    Just a quick warning to everyone posting on this site - I now have concrete evidence that artificial intelligence linked to UK and US intelligence agencies are secretly monitoring everything on this site - my son works in AI in machine code systems analysis and has informed me of the truth of this claim, please all be much more careful in making any claims etc, etc.......all mobile phone networks including 5G systems are all also being secretly monitored.......all e-mails thought to be confidential are not.....I now only use the rag and bone land-line telephone to communicate with family and friends. They are welcome to record our ridiculous long-winded telephone calls if they want to waste their time!!!!! This situation is extremely dangerous for information leaks and I am thoroughly fed up with this unnecessary, irritating internet spying that's going on against us all behind our backs.

    Why words from leaders matter.


    ClO2 has always been used by a few crackpots as a cure-all - in spite of the fact that it is thoroughly toxic. Lack of clarity on this matter is unhelpful, when nowadays many things weakly disavowed by Trump are viewed by his supporters being tacitly advocated - because "the establishment" would not like it so he has to say something different. And who is to say they are wrong in that idea?


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/19/bleach-miracle-cure-amazon-covid?utm_source=Tortoise+Members&utm_campaign=4e6ce6111a-SENSEMAKER_DAILY&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_efeb5ec230-4e6ce6111a-138373963&mc_cid=4e6ce6111a&mc_eid=%5bUNIQID%5d


    Several deaths of people drinking bleach marketed as a “miracle cure” have been reported across South America, including in Argentina where a five-year-old boy was reported to have died in August having been given chlorine dioxide as a Covid cure.

    In the past, Amazon has removed from its platform several pro-MMS books, including those by the founder of the movement, Jim Humble. He claimed to have discovered that chlorine dioxide cures malaria while on a gold mining expedition in the Guyana jungle in 1996.

    Amazon in March promised to crack down on product listings that cash-in on false remedies for Covid-19. But third-party sellers are still finding ways to peddle potentially dangerous products on the site.

    Amazon did not immediately respond to Guardian questions about the sale of the bleach on its platform.

    Fiona O’Leary, a campaigner against MMS based in Ireland, said she was “shocked and heartbroken that Amazon is still selling this product. The FDA is prosecuting producers of bleach, but now we have Amazon selling it. How can this be happening?”

    Greed simple as that. Taking advantage of desperate people . Thank the media

    Quote from Dr Richard

    Just a quick warning to everyone posting on this site - I now have concrete evidence that artificial intelligence linked to UK and US intelligence agencies are secretly monitoring everything on this site


    So what if they are? This is open to the public. They are members of the public. I encourage them to monitor it. I wish they would monitor LENR-CANR.org. I doubt they consider cold fusion important enough to keep tabs on, but I wish they would.


    Intelligence agencies are supposed to keep track of what is going on. There is no harm to them compiling information, as long as it isn't personal.


    Generally speaking, I recommend you say nothing on the internet that you would not want everyone on earth to see. Not that your message is likely to go viral, but it might. If it is libelous, unfair or unkind, or it puts you in a very bad light, don't say it. Don't write it on the internet, and don't say it in person. Mind your manners. Think before you blab. That's what people have done since we learned how to speak.

    • Official Post
    Quote from JedRothwell

    Generally speaking, I recommend you say nothing on the internet that you would not want everyone on earth to see. Not that your message is likely to go viral, but it might. If it is libelous, unfair or unkind, or it puts you in a very bad light, don't say it. Don't write it on the internet, and don't say it in person. Mind your manners. Think before you blab. That's what people have done since we learned how to speak.


    Agreed. I hope they enjoy reading Ascoli's foaming posts.

    Quote from Shane D.

    No, not totally. They threw out a few articles about it here and there. Just enough so that when called out on it, they could say exactly what you did: "hey, we reported on the consequences to the lockdowns". . . .


    I read the NYT extensively and I have seen many articles about the economic and social effects of COVID-19. The Times is an establishment newspaper, very concerned about things like the stock market and the economy. They don't underplay any news relating to money, any more than the Wall Street Journal does. New York city is the financial capital of the U.S.


    Quote from Shane D.

    Instead it is has been incredibly one-sided, with the focus almost exclusively on people dying from COVID, how they die, those testing positive, and long term effects. In fact, I am watching CNN now, and they still have the "deaths/cases" stats in real time on the screen.


    For goodness sake! That's like saying World War II reports emphasized the dead and wounded, and under-reported all those people making money in the arms factories. Dying and and the long term effects of the disease are INFINITELY worse than a few months of unemployment!! Ask anyone who has lost a relative whether they would bring him or her back in exchange for 6 months of unemployment.


    In the U.S. and other first world countries, all of the financial suffering could easily be avoided by handing out money now, and taxing people later. The way we conducted WWII. If we suffer financially from unemployment, and if people are evicted or they go hungry, that is entirely because of political decisions made by elected officials. They alone are to blame. Not one person needs to go hungry or be evicted in the U.S., Europe, Japan or China.


    The third world is in an entirely different situation. Far worse. The suffering in the third world has been reported extensively, in detail. It is horrifying. I wish first world countries would do something to reduce it, but I do not think they will.


    Quote from Shane D.

    I have never seen a screen shot from any news site, showing the misery and suffering of those having the cure rammed down their throats.


    No one in the first world has the cure rammed down their throats. The lockdowns have been voluntary. The one in Japan was more of a polite suggestion than a law. A third of the population ignored it. In Georgia and other GOP states, the government has not enforced anything. Not masks or a lockdown. On the contrary, it is encouraging people to not wear masks, not to worry, and go back to restaurants. The danger is being discounted, not emphasized. The Georgia government is doing all it can to endanger people by keeping them ignorant. Today it was announced that the government plays three-card-monte with the data from schools, so parents have no way of finding out whether their children are in danger. See:

    Some schools withhold COVID-19 infection information from parents, teachers

    https://www.ajc.com/education/…T7PLYFAFBUHCGV3G575HUO4Y/


    The only thing being forced down anyone's throats in Georgia are poor people being forced to go back to dangerous jobs in meat packing plants, restaurants, bowling alleys and so on. The governor did that to avoid paying unemployment benefits. Trump forced workers back into meatpacking plants by declaring them essential. Many of them are illegal immigrants, which is ironic. A few months before the crisis Trump was trying to throw them out of the country. Or, at least, harass them and frighten them enough that they would accept substandard wages. Now he is trying to force them to stay in the factories.


    The economic damage is not being caused by governments imposing lockdowns. It is being caused by people locking themselves down. By people not flying on airplanes, or going to restaurants or stores. This could have been avoided if the government had done what the W.H.O. and other public health organizations suggested. Instead, it ignored these recommendations, and then blamed the W.H.O. for its own reckless incompetence.

    Quote from THHuxleynew

    ClO2 has always been used by a few crackpots as a cure-all - in spite of the fact that it is thoroughly toxic.

    Almost everything in high dose is 'thoroughly toxic'.

    Isn't it amazing that ClO2 is used in detoxifying our drinking water, used on vegetables, fruit and meat to prolong shelf life and used as a dental disinfectant, while at the same time being 'thoroughly toxic'.


    https://www.sciencedirect.com/…abs/pii/S0925521410001365

    https://onlinelibrary.wiley.co….1365-2621.1999.tb12288.x

    https://www.sciencedirect.com/…abs/pii/S0300571208002376

    Quote from Wyttenbach

    CoV-19 obviously is a serious disease and the first task should be to give people the usual medicaments and to control that they directly go home! Do people have to walk around with a gun in hand that politician understand that they are, may be, a danger for the public?

    The way PCR tests are done, someone can test positive and have hardly any live virus, or even no live virus (only viral debris). So the great majority will not be contagious, presuming they show minimal symptoms. The example of the man who tested positive and then went directly to the pub and infected 50 people is a good story for teaching people, but it must not be used to promote more control by the state. On the other hand, he should be fined and perhaps jailed for what he did.


    The Fauci protocol is to have people who test positive to go home and quarantine, and only come back to hospital if they developed breathing trouble.

    Other nations sent people back home with treatment, like hydroxychloroquine. I wonder who has faired better? (Not the US.)


    Which reminds me: I think it was the Swiss who were doing the right thing, sending people home with treatment. But then they banned hydroxychloroquine for two weeks after the scam study in the Lancet, only to restore its use after the scam was found out. Shortly after the ban the Swiss suffered a two week interval of 3 times the normal case fatality rate, then it returned to the normal low rate. Another indication that hydroxychloroquine works.

    In the U.K., Patrick Vallance, the chief scientific adviser announced that "less than 8 percent of the population had some form of immunity to the virus, though that figure could rise to 17 percent in London." I assume that is based on antibody tests.


    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/0…covid-19-coronavirus.html


    The official stats from the UK show 398,625 cases in a population of 67,965,000 people. (https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/uk/) That's ~0.6%. In other words, actual cases are about 13 times higher than confirmed cases. Total actual cases are roughly 5.4 million. I expect that testing has increased and they are now detecting more active cases than they did when the pandemic began. The mortality rate has gone way down. I expect this partly because they now detect many more light cases; because more young people are getting sick; and because treatments have improved.


    Total deaths are 41,788. That's 0.06% of the population (615 per million). If herd immunity takes 60% of the population, and the mortality rate remains the same, it would take 7.5 times this many deaths to reach it. That would be 313,410 people, or 4613 per million (0.5% of the population). That compares to 384,000 British soldiers killed in WWII, and 70,000 civilians. The population was 48,000,000 then, so that was 0.9% of the population. Most people killed in WWII were young people in the prime of life, whereas most people who die of COVID-19 are old. (Many victims of the 1918 influenza pandemic were young.)


    Anyway, the mortality rate is falling, but if it remained about the same, this indicates overall mortality is about 0.8%. In the U.S. and S. Korea it is around 2%, but that is the percent of confirmed cases.

    Quote from THHuxleynew

    Why words from leaders matter.

    Quote from THHuxleynew

    when nowadays many things weakly disavowed by Trump are viewed by his supporters

    Quote from THHuxleynew

    Several deaths of people drinking bleach marketed as a “miracle cure” have been reported across South America, including in Argentina where a five-year-old boy was reported to have died


    Really?

    It is this kind of political "reporting" that is spreading misinformation!


    #1. Trump has NEVER stated to drink bleach. Please provide source if so.

    #2. Trump has never told anyone to drink anthing! Please provide source if so.

    #3. It was the liberal MEDIA that kept stating over and over that Trump said to drink bleach.... who fault is that? Trumps? NO! Where is your posts slamming media lies?

    #4. You provide a article from the Guardian, (yes, a well respected journal that you would accept OTHER facts from?) stating that someone in a different country than Trump followed HIS advice? That Argentina has Trump supporters?

    #5. Why is Trump responsible for what the media LIES about? I read things that uber conservative channels say Biden said. Do you think Biden should address each and every mis-information about him? That Biden is responsible for lies that conservative rags print? Of course you do not! Why then Trump? He would be doing nothing be dispelling garbage reports from the biased liberal media!

    #6. You really hold Trump accountable for what someone in Argentina did?

    #7. You give the liberal media an absolute FREE PASS on lying and misinformation? I have not seen any posts from you decrying their abhorrent reporting? Perhaps it is OK to lie about Trump because Trump is bad?


    Perhaps I should start posting all the verbal blunders that Biden makes here as you state it is so important what leaders say?


    Perhaps you should state that it is important for MEDIA to quit lying and report only facts!

    Quote from Bob#2

    #1. Trump has NEVER stated to drink bleach. Please provide source if so.


    He suggested injecting disinfectants, which would be even more dangerous than drinking bleach. He was not joking. He was talking to one of his top medical experts. The video and his exact words are here:


    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-52407177


    Quote:


    "And then I see the disinfectant where it knocks it out in a minute. One minute. And is there a way we can do something like that, by injection inside or almost a cleaning?


    "So it'd be interesting to check that."

    Quote from JedRothwell

    In the U.S. and other first world countries, all of the financial suffering could easily be avoided by handing out money now, and taxing people later. The way we conducted WWII.


    This will only work for a year or two. I am assuming that a vaccine will end the pandemic in the first world sometime next year. Then we can raise taxes and start paying back the money, to avoid inflation.


    Yes, he turned and ASKED THE QUESTION. He did not state for anyone to start drinking bleach, the word bleach is not in this at all. He did not state that anyone should drink disinfectants, that is not in the video. As you so often post "You made that up".


    He did not suggest to anyone to inject disinfectants... he asked if it could be developed..... as "it'd be interesting to check that". That is categorically NOT telling people to inject disinfectants.


    Only a moron would take that sentence to mean that.... or someone who simply wants to intentionally spin political rhetoric. Which is it?


    So here is the ENTIRE transcript, not cherry picked as one should read context.

    " And then I see the disinfectant, where it knocks it out in a minute. One minute. And is there a way we can do something like that, by injection inside or almost a cleaning. Because you see it gets in the lungs and it does a tremendous number on the lungs. So it would be interesting to check that. So, that, you’re going to have to use medical doctors with. But it sounds — it sounds interesting to me."


    So he specifically said "can we do something like that" (a question) , "it would be interesting (simply an observational opinion)" AND "your going to have to use medical doctors with" (a completely proper disclaimer). How interesting THAT part is conveniently always left out of these political based quotes! But that would not fit the narrative would it!


    And yes, there are oral disinfectants ....


    https://onlinelibrary.wiley.co…bs/10.1002/anie.201208889


    Not that it is likely one for Covid would be developed, they are not unheard of.


    I have not seen one post from you decrying the medial for twisting and blowing these comments completely out of proportion or context.


    Who is more at fault... one person who makes a misinterpreted statement one time, or the media who prints over and over and over again in inaccurate, down right blatantly and willful, politically motivated malfeasance.


    You want to diss Trump but give the lying media a free pass! Typical political propaganda.

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