However, if you look at the presentations from Frank and Harper about the history of how the LEC came to be, you will see they were looking to ionize gas to allow for electrolysis in gas phase, and they used Americium for that, and it did not work.
Curbina are you asking me to delete the link?
Not at all.
Actually I also spotted this on the 'double triode' website you mentioned a few days ago and sent it to Frank and co.
@Curbiba is not strictly correct to say that Frank and Harper's Americium tests did not work at all, they calcumated after a couple of tests that they yould need a very large amount of americium to get results equivalent to those they were seeing with a simple co-dep LEC.
to get results equivalent to those they were seeing with a simple co-dep LEC.
So how much excess energy could they produce so far? Or in AA battery equivalents ?
Curbina are you asking me to delete the link?
Oh, please, not at all. I was just pointing out that this is a starting point of the suspicion that there is some sort of radiation ionizing the gas.
Not at all.
Actually I also spotted this on the 'double triode' website you mentioned a few days ago and sent it to Frank and co.
@Curbiba is not strictly correct to say that Frank and Harper's Americium tests did not work at all, they calcumated after a couple of tests that they yould need a very large amount of americium to get results equivalent to those they were seeing with a simple co-dep LEC.
Well Alan Smith , you got me there, my statement is very imprecise. Albeit actually in their patent they mention failure to get the same effect with Americium, the proper way to say it is that they failed to get a voltage with a small amount of Americium they thought would be enough.
So how much excess energy could they produce so far? Or in AA battery equivalents ?
Jürg, you don’t need to be snarky. You know this is still at the nanowatt stage.
You know this is still at the nanowatt stage.
Microwatt, I think. (1000 times more than nano-blah.)
Microwatt, I think. (1000 times more than nano-blah.)
Well, again I was imprecise, I think the devices are producing energy at the milli volt x nano amp levels which would give micro watts, but taken on a per square cm the power level is in the nanowatts scale.
Display MoreThe following document might be interesting, and relevant to this thread:
RB-3 RCA Labs 1955 "The Direct Conversion of Radiation into Electrical Energy"
(I don't think I've seen it on LF before.)
One of the good ideas that may arise from reading this RCA document is to work at higher pressures, which is one of the mechanisms mentioned there to improve the direct radiation to electricity conversion efficiency. We know that the LEC doesn’t work in vaccuum, but how about working at Higher pressure, 3 Bar as an example? Has this been tried?
Actually I also spotted this on the 'double triode' website you mentioned a few days ago and sent it to Frank and co.
The archive section of the "one-electron" website has quite a collection of old documents. Well worth looking through, if you are a fan of thermionic technology.
(Some of my earliest memories are of watching my dad soldering valve radio components. He lost interest in the hobby once semiconductors became the norm, but I still liked messing about with valve circuits as a kid.)
ome of my earliest memories are of watching my dad soldering valve radio components. He lost interest in the hobby once semiconductors became the norm, but I still liked messing about with valve circuits as a kid.
Mine too, just the same pattern. When I was a little kid we went to Petticoat Lanr in London and he bought a Mk19 (?) aircraft radar set which he turned into a TV we watched the coronation on.
This comment via email from Ed Storms.
When the source of current reported by Gordon is evaluated, several facts need to be considered. He is measuring the net transfer of a negative charge. This eliminates He, TSC, D, or H as the major charge carrier. Frank measures a current near 500 micro amp, which is about 10^14 carriers/sec. If these charge carriers were a nuclear product, such as helium, he would be producing at lease 500 watts of power. This amount of power would be hard to ignore.
The only logical explanation is that each fusion reaction produces a large number of relatively low-energy electrons as one of the means by which the nuclear energy is dissipated. I showed that only a fraction of the energy is carried by the nuclear product itself. Apparently, Frank has identified where the rest of the nuclear energy is going and has provided the key to solving the mystery of the nuclear process. I suggest this observation be discussed and used to properly evaluate the various theories.
Jürg, you don’t need to be snarky. You know this is still at the nanowatt stage.
As said there have been positive results with LENR (CF) electric cells :: https://brilliantlightpower.co…ions/Permeation082714.pdf
Cumulative gain 1.76. Together measured with the H* spectrum and binding energy as a verification.
So I simply expect one irrefutable measurement of a LENR reaction. The simplest one is to just produce excess current and let it run for a long time. If it stops then the experiment is inconclusive.
I propose to use Sm/Gd coatings which can be made by acetates. These coatings produce a gamma signature if something happens but only with Deuterium its given.
Yes, i'm agree with him.
The nuclear energy from Lenr reactions is thermalized by the surrounding lattice.
So electrons from the nuclei of this lattice sometimes have enough energy to leave the lattice generating a current as in the LEC case.
However most of the time these electrons are moving to an upper level before coming down, this generating rather UV light.
This is also the way that used Rossi to produce direct current, by playing with electron variation of excitation.
This comment via email from Ed Storms.
The only logical explanation is that each fusion reaction produces a large number of relatively low-energy electrons as one of the means by which the nuclear energy is dissipated. I showed that only a fraction of the energy is carried by the nuclear product itself.
So I simply expect one irrefutable measurement of a LENR reaction. The simplest one is to just produce excess current and let it run for a long time. If it stops then the experiment is inconclusive.
The problem is, with a gadget the size of a LEC in its present form, you would have to let it run for years or even decades before it exceeds the limits of chemistry. It only produces about as much power as a wristwatch button battery, which runs for 2 years. It must be a hundred times larger, although the active material is not that much larger than a button battery.
It must be a hundred times larger
I am trying to get on with scaling up- a million distractions (ie paid work) at the minute. Saving the planet takes second place to paying the bills, as every politician knows.
@Alan There may be no more bills post scale-up. 
I found this patent today, interesting in that the USPTO now lists Frank Gordon's patent under 'similar devices. This is a type of LEC where the electrodes are charged using ionised plasma. I have not yet had a chance to study it in detail, but I notice thei inventor says that the voltage generated has little or no relationship to the work function differences between electrode materials. He claims a new effect.
I found this patent today, interesting in that the USPTO now lists Frank Gordon's patent under 'similar devices. This is a type of LEC where the electrodes are charged using ionised plasma. I have not yet had a chance to study it in detail, but I notice thei inventor says that the voltage generated has little or no relationship to the work function differences between electrode materials. He claims a new effect.
Great discovery Alan Smith , I just read carefully the first text page after all the figures and was enough to see the direct relationship to the LEC and also to realize this effect had been seen before and was already found interesting and potentially useful. It is also reinforcing the inventive character of the LEC.
Thanks for the update! Good news
