Clean Planet Ltd (Japan) updates

Quote from Cydonia

Well, from the Iwamura video i remained he considered the 10 years duration as a still far target to reach for business.

After first listening to Alan's interview with Iwamura I was a little disappointed like you. He said plenty of good things, but that 10 year "maybe" timeline was a bummer. When I watched the interview again yesterday, I realized the 10 years had more to do with overcoming regulatory obstacles -and not necessarily developing the technology, I was a little more optimistic.

Now since Ruby's article is out, maybe CP will have more to say.

No no, I didn't have been disappointed and as said Alan, he was surprised how Iwamura have been "talkative" ( i learn here a new UK/US word, thank you Google). Yes, talkative because probably he relativized, as a former knows, the CP announcements.

Now, i remain convinced their technical way remained the more promising presented at the last ICCF, more promising because close to something i know.

In the same way, my understanding understates the other works presented, that says a lot about the long way to go especially for the others.

Quote from Shane D.

After first listening to Alan's interview with Iwamura I was a little disappointed like you. He said plenty of good things, but that 10 year "maybe" timeline was a bummer. When I watched the interview again yesterday, I realized the 10 years had more to do with overcoming regulatory obstacles -and not necessarily developing the technology, I was a little more optimistic.

Now since Ruby's article is out, maybe CP will have more to say.

I strongly suspect that Iwamura has quite detailed hypotheses, regarding the "anomalous" heat produced by his test devices.

However, having seen how other researchers have been treated, as soon as they posit any particular mechanism - not only by the usual attack-dogs, but by factional supporters within the LENR/CF world - I guess he is just being deliberately circumspect in his assertions.

But he does seem to have left some clues, within his presentations

Precisely no, they are locked into a theoretical model which is not the right one and they know it.

However they no longer know how to move forward on theory side.

I didn't say it was easy but they should read Kervran. Unfortunately these books don't have been translated into English so even less into Japanese

Quote from Frogfall

I strongly suspect that Iwamura has quite detailed hypotheses, regarding the "anomalous" heat produced by his test devices.

However, having seen how other researchers have been treated, as soon as they posit any particular mechanism - not only by the usual attack-dogs, but by factional supporters within the LENR/CF world - I guess he is just being deliberately circumspect in his assertions.

But he does seem to have left some clues, within his presentations

Quote from Cydonia

I didn't say it was easy but they should read Kervran.

I do think Kervran's work represents a major colour in the LENR Kaleidoscope, but he certainly wasn't alone in recognising the importance of anomalous transmutations.

Quote from Cydonia

for example in EU, has been discredited by flower lobbying.

Only a "disruptive strategy " could be the key.

In Japan, it seems, the wind could be turning again towards nuclear, despite the accident of Fukushima.

Moreover, if LENR supporters talk about timelines in the decade range to bring the (their) technology to the market, I don't understand why one should still invest in the risky mainstream nuclear business/technology, despite some innovations. Don't these people talk to each other or is it due to pure lobbyism?

If LENR really works, these mainstream innitiative is a waste of money and the realization timelines coincide.

In Europe, my feeling is that we are again way behind.... like with e-mobility or battery technology.

But as JedRothwell mentioned ... it can change fast, when the competitive advantage of LENR is really becoming obvious.

Right but the more important thing was: he shared some "physic principles" about an experiment analysis linked with CP, Rossi, Mizuno or S Brink.

Quote from Frogfall

I do think Kervran's work represents a major colour in the LENR Kaleidoscope, but he certainly wasn't alone in recognising the importance of anomalous transmutations.

Agree that Japanese government is staying at the good side of things.

Quote from gerold.s

In Japan, it seems, the wind could be turning again towards nuclear, despite the accident of Fukushima.

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Moreover, if LENR supporters talk about timelines in the decade range to bring the (their) technology to the market, I don't understand why one should still invest in the risky mainstream nuclear business/technology, despite some innovations. Don't these people talk to each other or is it due to pure lobbyism?

If LENR really works, these mainstream innitiative is a waste of money and the realization timelines coincide.

In Europe, my feeling is that we are again way behind.... like with e-mobility or battery technology.

But as JedRothwell mentioned ... it can change fast, when the competitive advantage of LENR is really becoming obvious.

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Quote from JedRothwell

Not a chance. The whole annoucement is a travesty. It destroys their credibility. As I wrote in the other thread where Ruby posted this --

You don't go from 350 W to 600 kW, a factor of 1,700 larger. You go to 1000 W at most, and you make and distribute thousands of prototypes.

600 kW is more than enough to kill someone from a steam explosion. \

I believe we do not have a typo, and that is exactly the plan. How they get to higher heat I don't know. It will not be jumping orders of magnitude straight away. That is ridiculous. Currently, they are working on an increased surface area to up the power output. No doubt they will be creeping up as they can. These are not ridiculous people!

We also do not know the boiler design that Miura/Mitsubishi/Toyota will work on. Clean Planet is ambitious, and they have become more so since their success. Perhaps there are sights on power plants as an intermediary step to distributed power? We just don't know.

I do not see where Iwamura expressed concerns. I see where he honestly told his thoughts. I have a problem with anyone who would say Yasuhiro is mistaken.

This piece I put together was so I myself could see "what was the proof of Clean Planet claims?". I like to research the topic, try to figure the gist, and lay it down in as linear a way as possible, so I can understand it. The proof that makes me accept Clean Planet's claims are;

1. a TEAM of experienced, talented LENR researchers with decades of increasingly successful results.

2. full participation of academic, industry and agency and the entire country of Japan.

3. no more public reports of their ever-climbing excess heat power; only little heat reports and science results.

4. a confirmation of certain facts at the IWAHLM15

It is for these reasons that I stand my claim: Clean Power will make it happen, whatever the power level. It will be low first, and then they will be on a roll.

There are other labs doing it too. Can you name the other labs that are in the race for a technology? There are three at least on the North American continent. Around the world, a handful of labs may get the resources they need now that Clean Planet has jumped to the lead.

This article was derived from the ICCF24 x Solid State Energy presentation videos, Alan's chat with Yasuhiro, and a private communication when I gave a heads up that I'm publishing this article.

That's all I really have to say about this topic. There is little that could change my mind about my conclusion here, i.e., that we should believe Clean Planet when they say something. Unless new information comes to light, of course.

Quote from orsova

The characterisation of the 'ideal' reference experiment seems to be an open question, but Righes et al.'s work (if it pans out)

Are you referring to this ICCF24 presentation?

Evidence of reproducible Tritium production in a pulsed electrolytic cell

I find it strangely reminiscent of this guy's device:

Quote from Frogfall

Are you referring to this ICCF24 presentation?

Evidence of reproducible Tritium production in a pulsed electrolytic cell

I find it strangely reminiscent of this guy's device:

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That’s the one.

Quote from rubycarat

I believe we do not have a typo, and that is exactly the plan.

I am sure it is. I am not suggesting you misreported this. I am saying that I think the plan is unwise.

Still say my interp is right on the money and I have seen nothing to the contrary

Quote from rubycarat

and the entire country of Japan.

well

I am not sure about the entire country..my wife knows zero about it..

but Hachi the shibainu has a paw in it.

10 kW by 2023. 13 months.? 'best laid schemes of mice and men' and Hachi

to add to .Robbie Burns

but 1 kw should be enough to sort out most of the problems..

anyway..

Quote from RobertBryant

but 1 kw should be enough to sort out most of the problems.

even 750w should be enough

https://www.lenr-canr.org/acrobat/MizunoTsupplement.pdf

Quote from RobertBryant

even 750w should be enough

A standard simple air-fluid heat-pump has at least a COP of 3. This is what you8 hang in front of each room in Japan.

750W with a COP of 2 is a no deal.

Quote from Wyttenbach

A standard simple air-fluid heat-pump has at least a COP of 3. This is what you8 hang in front of each room in Japan.

750W with a COP of 2 is a no deal.

That graph above is supposed to be a COP of about 1.3

A real COP of 2 will get you a Nobel and enough cash to be set for life.

Get on it.

Quote from Wyttenbach

A standard simple air-fluid heat-pump has at least a COP of 3. This is what you8 hang in front of each room in Japan.

750W with a COP of 2 is a no deal.

I agree it has no practical significance, but a reliable 750 W reaction would make R&D easier.

Actually, I think 10 to 100 W would be just as good. Below 1 W things become more challenging to measure, although J. P. Joule could have done it. I think below 0.1 W you get a lot of noise with ordinary instruments.

As I said in my paper, if input power is very low, or if there is no input power with something like the LEC, then even a milliwatt reaction can be commercially useful. Even microwatts. That would be great for something like a wristwatch or a pacemaker. Assuming you can make the device small, like a button battery.

https://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/RothwellJmoreaboutw.pdf

Clean Planet has a new really nice looking website that also has a bit of new content:

CLEANPLANET Inc.

New Energy, New Future – Inventing an alternative to fire.

www.cleanplanet.co.jp

Quote from teppo

Clean Planet has a new really nice looking website that also has a bit of new content:

https://www.cleanplanet.co.jp/