What is the current state of LENR?

Quote from THHuxleynew

Just a note. Of those 3 highlighted in red neutron waves the rightmost two do not exist (eyeballing). They are right down in the noise. I'd like to see a Bayesian analysis of the evidence for neutron waves at those values (rather than some other value). The evidence for hypothesised neutron waves from that graph would appear non-existent: and I would always defer to proper data analysis that would have to be Bayesian choosing hypotheses carefully.

All those spikey things don't seem to be traditional noise. This is a 3-hour spectrum (according to Wyttenbach) and I think that the shot noise is low here compared with the signal. Instead, there is this forest of spikes, a few of which Wyttenbach puts forward as proof of his theories.

My problem here is that there are so many features in the spectrum that almost any theory would seem to find support. Indeed, I have a theory! And here are 5 energy levels (in keV) that I predict should feature in the spectrum ... 105, 141, 169, 197, 238. I think I see them all. Does that mean my theory is right?

At least LENR and CMNS are still evolving with new ideas. What else can we do? Hope for the future and forget the past.

The Past is gone.

The Future but a distant dreamscape painted with hopes and fears.

What is here now is a gift called the Present.

Quote from RobertBryant

Simon Hein..evos...in his hair currently 💥😄👍

Thanks

Excellent explanation of the current state of LENR.

This patent Simon mentions in his video.

Fascinating

Worthy of its own thread.

Aspects relevant...

US9502202B2 - Systems and methods for generating coherent matterwave beams - Google Patents

Quote from RobertBryant

Although disputed at least 10 years after by Kidman

the 2003 Praseodymium nucleosynthesis from Caesium by Iwamura was replicated by two other Japanese labs and is corroborated by the nucleosynthesis results seen with rare earth mixtures by Wyttenbach at el 2021

5.1

Higher Z nucleus syntheses

As our cold fusion experiments do show, potentially all elements of the periodic table can be produced by the basic reaction of adding H*-H* or D*-D* or H*/D* to a nucleus.

The D* fusion reaction – we measured - following the addition of D* do produce different element chains than the well known Nickel reactions with adding H*-H*. H*-H* can add like a di-neutron or neutron/proton pair. D*-D* or just one D* can add as two protons or a neutron/proton combination. This allows for direct horizontal or vertical progress in the periodic table of elements (isotopes).

So the basic rules are as following::

A(z,n) + H*-H* → A(z,n+2) or A(z+1,n+1)...

Display More

Disputed by Kidwell not Kidman. The fusion reaction 7D₂ + O₂ = 2H₂ +2N₂ almost follows the two-nucleon addition rule. The proposed reaction sequence is

D = n + p

O¹⁶ + n = O¹⁷

D = n + p

O¹⁷ + n = O¹⁸

D + O¹⁸ = F²⁰

F²⁰ = Ne²⁰ + beta

Ne²⁰ + D = Na²²

Na²² + D = Mg²⁴

Mg²⁴ +D = Al²⁶

Al²⁶ + D = Si²⁸

Si²⁸ = 2N¹⁴

Because the reaction occurs in a contracted-dilated space intermediates do not usually reach an escape velocity from the cluster of super-magnetic atoms which cluster is the NAE. Although it appears some do in Safire. The initial nuclear effect of phat photon production is photo-disintegration of deuterium. That means the cluster size must get large enough that the high energy tail of Boltzmann distribution of energy of the particles in the cluster reaches a minimum collision energy of 2.26 MeV which energy is required for photo-disintegration. After a couple of neutrons are absorbed to oxygen, the giant resonance activation in giant resonance activated oxygen allows an activated form of deuterium to cross the coulomb barrier. Deuterium continues to cross the coulomb barrier until the giant resonance energy is so large that fission occurs.

Quote from Drgenek

D = n + p

This reaction never happens in any place of the universe as there never are free neutrons....

The first step is n x p --> 3He, 4He 12C etc...

Quote from JedRothwell

You are a nonentity to me

All entities are created equal but some are more entitled than others

Quote from Wyttenbach

there never are free neutrons..

free neutrons are nonentities?

The current state of LENR keeps generating theories w/o expts..

Here is another theory which relies on free neutrons,,

Published recently,,"on the role of nuclear binding energy"

by two entities

Satya Seshavatharam U.V
^* and Lakshminarayana S

https://www.preprints.org/manuscript/202103.0319/v1/download

Quote from RobertBryant

Published recently,,"on the role of nuclear binding energy"

By two entities

Eugene Terry Tatum is another entity.

A co author of the authors...

Thanks for the paper.

On the Role of Nuclear Binding Energy in Understanding

Cold Nuclear Fusion

U.V.S. Seshavatharam

and S. Lakshminarayana

One of E.T.Tatums publications

Introductory Chapter: Black Holes, The Singularity Problem, and The Universe

2020
https://cdn.intechopen.com/pdfs/69874.pdf

Quote from RobertBryant

Satya Seshavatharam U.V

Lives in Hitech,Hyderabad

Much finance is now directed to IT.

Honorary Professor..Its difficult to buy even one gamma spectrometer on honorary salary?

to get more experimental beauty....which is needed more than theory.

I think Satya has written quite a bit about high end physics... string theory gravity

eg https://vixra.org/pdf/1712.0591v1.pdf

"

Since 50 years, modern scientists are seriously working

on multi dimensional string theory [38]. But, till today

no single experiment had revealed any new dimension

[39]. In addition to that, so far, the intended purpose of

string theory is not being served in unifying the four

basic interactions.

Conceptual point of view, String

theory is one of the best ideas in the entire history of

theoretical physics and one of the greatest

disappointments as it has no single testable prediction.

It may be noted that, string theory is failing in

understanding strong interaction and failing in

estimating the magnitudes of fundamental physical

constants.

Even then, modern scientists are seriously

working on its development and spending millions of

dollars.

Here we would like to emphasize the point that,

‘string theory’ is having conceptual beauty and

‘cold nuclear fusion’ is having experimental beauty.

Quote from RobertBryant

string theory’ is having conceptual beauty and

‘cold nuclear fusion’ is having experimental beauty.

This from the Satya Seshavatharam paper reminds me that any one theory is not sufficient. People can say their theory is the best... which does not help one bit. Each theory misses something. Sifting for commonalities and unifying working concepts is best.

RobertBryant

I think you will enjoy this perspective by an early cold fusioneer...

On a Possible Formulation of Particle Dynamics

in Terms of Thermodynamic Conceptualizations

and the Role of Entropy in it.

Williams, Pharis Edward; Woehler, K. E.

Monterey, California: Naval Postgraduate School

https://calhoun.nps.edu/handle/10945/17882

OR

http://hdl.handle.net/10945/17882

Downloaded from NPS Archive: Calhoun

Quote from Alan Smith

Is there a theory about the mechanism? Quite a few in fact, but gradually the better aspects of these competing hypotheses are self-assembling into something approaching a coherent (no pun intended) explanation that does not involve magic of any kind.

One microscopic detail here I must reveal is that it is often missed that like chemical reactions (according to the Law of mass action) all nuclear reactions also must be reversible. So adding or subtracting n or p to a heavy element (Cu, Ag or Au) should both ways generate LENR energy to form (Ni, Pd or Pt) for example. In practical terms for constructing a LENR reactor or even a U235 fission reactor which synthesises Pu and also other isotopes useful in imaging in medical applications. LENRS are always in a state of dynamic equilibrium.

Quote from RobertBryant

free neutrons are nonentities?

The source of neutrons is dense matter. But you cannot form dense matter form basic matter = Hydrogen with the help of neutrons. This nonsense has once been proposed by "childish quakes physicists" like Bethe.

Quote

But, till today no single experiment had revealed any new dimension

What the physical theorists are doing is both a good joke, both school of life for those, who are paying their jobs from their taxes:

"This story begins in dark ages. A group of theorists seeks for violation of gravitational law at short distances. They indeed find nothing, because their wooden experimental device is not sensitive enough. OK...

The sensitivity of devices improves gradually, until some experimentalist finds the solely unexpected electrostatic force, which no gravity theory considered so far...

Next generation of theorists already knows about it - so they arrange their experiments in such a way, the electrostatic force doesn't interfere their gravitometric measurements. And again, they find no violation of gravitational law at short distances...

The sensitivity of devices improves gradually, until some experimentalist finds the solely unexpected Van DerWaals dipole force, which no gravity theory considered so far.

Next generation of theorists already knows about it - so they arrange their experiments in such a way, neither electrostatic force, neither dipole forces interfere their sensitive gravitometric measurements. As usually, they find no violation of gravitational law at short distances...

The sensitivity of devices improves gradually, until some experimentalist finds the solely unexpected Casimir force, which no gravity theory considered so far.

Next generation of theorists already knows about it - so they arrange their experiments in such a way, neither electrostatic force, neither dipole force, neither Casimir force interferes their extra-sensitive gravitometric measurements. As usually, they find no violation of gravitational law at short distances...

The sensitivity of devices improves gradually, until some experimentalist finds the solely unexpected thermal Casimir force, which no gravity theory considered so far.

Next generation of theorists already knows about it - so they arrange their experiments with single neutrons in such a way, neither electrostatic force, neither dipole force, neither Casimir force, neither thermal Casimir force (..ffffuuuu...!) interferes their ultra-mega-sensitive gravitometric measurements. As usually, they find no violation of gravitational law at short distances..."

And the saga continues: the experiments are becoming increasingly more sensitive - and expensive - but the physicists have stable jobs, they're not forced to correct their theories not least a bit - not to say research more useful things like the cold fusions instead - and everyone remains happy.

What a lucky world, isn't it?

Quote from Gregory Byron Goble

cyoung Thanks

This thread's topic gets to the heart of the matter. I am continually amazed by what I learn from the many discussions on the forum. Big Thanks.

...the current

state of LENR.

The most important works to study are from the most recent few years...

As stated by others, gas/electrolysis and hydrates/metamaterial solid state systems... CMNS energy technology development is advancing along those lines.

Wet cell CMNS reactor environments were given up by many of the old guard long ago. I see none being developed now.

Understanding the 'arena' of science that LENR currently finds itself in.

Study the skill sets of the scientists listed as inventors and authors of the most recent works found here and elsewhere.

Reading these folks biographies establishes the scope of this arena, the broad range of skills and age of those involved (surprisingly young).

Many many new and complex arts of science support advanced CMNS energy development.

The advanced test reactor engineering and fabrication methods are cutting edge.

Currently LLNL is calling for labs to use their supercomputers and AI to sort out data and find commonalities in many theories. I figure most every decent theory has something to add.

Team Google has opened the door of the US DoE for this field to join in these LLNL efforts.

Basically this LLNL program will assist us in figuring these types of things out, optimize research, develop working theories and speed market entry.

I see a symbiosis developing between high energy fusion/fission science and low energy fusion/fission science. Each have important elements to consider together... hot and cold fusion.

When asking about the early patents, a high level Google team member told me I would be surprised where this leads them. I've been wondering ever since.

Display More

I agree mostly.

As a skeptic: it is clear that metal-hydrate systems have many interesting properties. They are not fully understood chemically let alone anything more. They offer opportunities for electron shielding which is tantalisingly close to what is needed for LENR - but with some real gaps. They offer opportunities for high Q plasmons that again tantalisingly seem close to what might trigger nuclear reactions - again with real gaps.

The big problem with any "best fit" it could be some nuclear reaction solution here is that lack of high energy particles from unstable products. It is very difficult to find mechanisms where reactions are forbidden except for stable products, since stability of products is not something that enters into the reaction kinematics according to normal experi4ence or theory.

LENR has always had two sides: overcoming the Coulomb barrier (relatively easy to posit mechanisms) and ALL reactions going ONLY (not just a bit - but 99%) to stable products (and also, maybe easier to get, reactions only allowed that emit no high energy particles).

The second bit is of course evidence for the null hypothesis because it is expected in that case. To make it expected in any LENR theory is a stretch and while Widom Larson valiantly positied a mechanism that one does not seem to wash.

THH

Quote from Wyttenbach

This reaction never happens in any place of the universe as there never are free neutrons....

The first step is n x p --> 3He, 4He 12C etc...

The reaction I listed is not the reaction above from you. Photodisintegration does happen. See Photodisintegration - Wikipedia . Also see specifically the sub-topic photodisintegration of Deuterium. What is different is that the gamma is generated by the phat photon mechanism. The gamma energy is transferred by collision not by radiation. Finally, the cluster (NAE) is a gravity well which is not mass dependent. Rather it is energy dependent. The energy dependent comes from quantum states defined by the phat photon equation.

The basis effect is not so different than NASA Lattice Confinement Fusion [2020] - YouTube. Except the lattice is created by the attraction of UDH where the UDH is created from hydrogen clusters which are able to emit phat photons. Phat photon are created from an exchange of photons in a collective of atoms near the energy required for ionization.

Quote from THHuxleynew

I agree mostly.

As a skeptic: it is clear that metal-hydrate systems have many interesting properties. They are not fully understood chemically let alone anything more. They offer opportunities for electron shielding which is tantalisingly close to what is needed for LENR - but with some real gaps. They offer opportunities for high Q plasmons that again tantalisingly seem close to what might trigger nuclear reactions - again with real gaps.

The big problem with any "best fit" it could be some nuclear reaction solution here is that lack of high energy particles from unstable products. It is very difficult to find mechanisms where reactions are forbidden except for stable products, since stability of products is not something that enters into the reaction kinematics according to normal experi4ence or theory.

See NASA Lattice Confinement Fusion [2020] - YouTube But rather than activate with a gamma bove 2.2 MeV, let the system produce it via the phat photon mechanism.

Quote from THHuxleynew

and while Widom Larson valiantly positied a mechanism that one does not seem to wash.

I see parts of this theory/mechanism becoming integrated in developing a working theory and in other theoretical explanations of experimental results. Do you think none of it (WL theory) has relevance? Or do you think some of these concepts in WL theory are useful when constructing new explanation theories and predictive theories?

Quote from Drgenek

Photodisintegration does happen.

You clearly wrote :: D = n + p..... No disintegration.....For the later you need 2.25MeV quite normal temperature...