The Totally Civil Covid Thread. (Closing 31/05)

Here is a recent graph from the CDC.

This is very good news for people over 50. With two primary and two boosters, it is extremely unlikely you will die, or even be hospitalized. Add to that the new bivalent booster, and it will be much less likely you are even infected. For vaccinated people, COVID is now hardly more dangerous than influenza. This is a triumph of 21st century medicine.

For unvaccinated people over 50, COVID is and will remain a dance with death. This graph shows that over 6 per 100,000 unvaccinated people die per week. Around 330 per year, or 1 in 300 people. Because time does not stop after one year, and COVID is not likely to go away, if the infection rate and reinfection rate among unvaccinated people remains at this level, given that a 50 year old person is likely to live another 30 years, unvaccinated people will have about 1 in 10 chances of dying in agony from COVID.

The Republican party, trialsitenews, and other members of the Death Cult are to blame for this carnage, and for tragic long term COVID cases. The patients themselves are also to blame, of course. This is totally avoidable. It is by far the largest number of unnecessary deaths in the history of the U.S.

Quote from JedRothwell

This is very good news for people over 50. With two primary and two boosters, it is extremely unlikely you will die, or even be hospitalized.

JED: CDC/FDA has been hijacked by the FM/R/F mafia. What they publish is total rubbish and only big pharma propaganda. Every booster directly kills about 0.3% of the older age > 75. These directly killed (immediately get Covid and die) are kicked out of the vaccine death/hospital statistics and are put on the Covid side. This is a dirty old trick.

(You find all details in the Pfizer files!)

Swiss data and UK data that are highly reliable show that vaccination is damaging and also boostered have zero advantage over unvaxx.

Currently the excess death rate among vaxxinated is about 15%. It looks like every RNA vaxx shot reduces your live duration by at least 2-3%! This is an average.

Quote from Wyttenbach

JED: CDC/FDA has been hijacked by the FM/R/F mafia.

And it hijacked every other public health agency, hospital, and nearly every doctor on earth. That FM/R/F mafia is powerful!

They all fallow the orders from higher up. just like any job.

Quote

For vaccinated people, COVID is now hardly more dangerous than influenza. This is a triumph of 21st century medicine.

This is BS: Omicron is less dangerous than flu for anyone - especially for people with innate and natural immunity. The excess deaths come just from vaccines now 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 and they're most significant just in heavily vaccinated countries.

Quote from Seatrout

They all fallow the orders from higher up

NO: Common goal money: Origin greed. The average member of FM/R/JF/B finance mafia has low IQ and needs the protection for success.

I just hope the are all boostered...

something to hide???

Pfizer isn’t sharing Covid vaccines with researchers for next-gen studies

Pfizer isn’t sharing Covid vaccines with researchers for next-gen studies

Researchers studying next-gen vaccines to fight an evolving Covid threat are running into problems getting existing vaccines to use in their research.

www.statnews.com

Researchers studying next-generation vaccines to fight an evolving Covid-19 threat are running into problems getting existing vaccines to use in their research.

Because Pfizer and Moderna hold the patents for the current vaccines, researchers would likely have to get the companies’ permission to use them for research into products like nasal or pan-coronavirus vaccines. Right now, Pfizer isn’t sharing its vaccines for research purposes, a spokesperson confirmed to STAT. Moderna didn’t comment when we asked.

Hospital cases for boostered do not go down . in fact have a slight upward trend: https://www.covid19.admin.ch/de/vaccination/status

Still 5 vaxx in hospital for 1 unvaxx....

Unexplained excess deaths in UK still at 1500/week :: https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplep…al/weekending26august2022

In Switzerland its about 200/week inline with UK data. Here the excess deaths are still inside the longtime band. But this will change as for all weeks (6 weeks ago) as the reporting lags behind a bout 2 months in average.

So in Europe we have about 15% excess deaths among people of age > 64 ! The only thing all have in common is the exceptional joy after a dead promotion RNA gene therapy...

Quote from Wyttenbach

NO: Common goal money: Origin greed. The average member of FM/R/JF/B finance mafia has low IQ and needs the protection for success.

I just hope the are all boostered...

That's what I'm talking about,

Back in the day my shop was unknowing working for a 3 letter in south Africa.-container.. that racked up a big bill with us and then the home based 3 letter group just started to take what money we had knowing the overseas outfit did not pay the bills.

we did not know it was just one group playing a game to take money at the time..

cia irs ..

Takes a lot as I'm a quiet person til I'm flustered understanding how all this happened years latter...

Note..

If you think I was referring to God or religion I think god stays out of most everything until enough is enough.

Quote from Seatrout

They all fallow the orders from higher up. just like any job.

Every one of them? Every single public health researcher, hospital, and nearly every doctor follows orders from higher up? I do not think you are acquainted with these people. It happens that I am. Some of my neighbors work at the CDC, and I have known scientists, researchers and doctors all of my life, starting with my late mother. Let me explain something to you --

These people seldom agree about anything. They never follow orders from above. Or below, or sideways. They don't follow orders at all. They ignore them. They are the most ungovernable people on earth. Trying to get them to do anything as a group is like herding cats. You can always find a scientist who disagrees with all the others. There are biologists who believe in creationism. There are doctors who think vaccinations do not work. However, if you examine the data, you will see that vaccinations do work. This data is not fake. It is not dictated from above. Even if it were dictated by nefarious powers in the U.S. to the CDC, those powers would have no way to dictate to the European, Japanese, Korean, Chinese or South American public health agencies. All of the agencies see the same thing. You say "higher up" but there is no single, unified "higher up" above all these different public health agencies and hospitals.

Quote from Zephir_AWT

This is BS: Omicron is less dangerous than flu for anyone - especially for people with innate and natural immunity.

That is not what the data from the CDC and all other public health agencies and hospitals show. It shows that COVID is far more dangerous than influenza for unvaccinated people, even if they survive an infection and have some natural immunity. Your source of information is wrong.

Quote from Fm1

Because Pfizer and Moderna hold the patents for the current vaccines, researchers would likely have to get the companies’ permission to use them for research into products like nasal or pan-coronavirus vaccines.

Patents do not work that way. Anyone can replicate a patent for any purpose other than commercial sales of the product. Researchers are always allowed to replicate. Permission is never needed. That is one of the reasons we have a patent system. Not just to reward the inventor, but also to disseminate the knowledge and bring useful discoveries to society. For that same reason, when an inventor (or corporation) is awarded a patent for something the Patent Office deems important, but the inventor does not sell the product, or license it, or disseminate it some other way, the Patent Office steps in and forces the inventor to disseminate it. You are not allowed to suppress important technology by patenting it. You must take steps to bring it to society.

Stories about companies "buying up the patents" and keeping technology off the market are myths. They are not allowed to do that. They never have been, not since the Constitution established the patent system.

Inconsequential inventions have been kept off the market by sitting on patents.

They are paid to do what they do or no money.. Jed.

unless they talk on the internet about what they see and we all know it gets deleted or worst most of the time.

you know that.

Quote from Seatrout

They are paid to do what they do or no money.. Jed.

Nope. Scientists and researchers are paid to do whatever the hell they want to do. They have tenure. If a high up muckety-muck were to start calling around telling them: "I want to you change the data," 99% of them would hang up, and 97% would go to the press and report that upper management was interfering in scientific research. That would be roughly as acceptable as if someone from upper management at MacDonald's were to go into a store, unzip his pants, and piss on the food and cooking areas. Or if a high official from Delta Airlines were to start pounding on the door to the cockpit on a plane in flight, demanding to be allowed to fly the plane. It is absolutely unthinkable. It would cause an instant brouhaha and denouncements by every professional in the business.

It is inconceivable that any official in charge of the CDC or at any level of government would try to dictate to the scientists there. Even in an imaginary world where that might happen, the official would have no power to dictate to U.S. hospitals, or public health scientists in Japan or China, or hospitals in Chile. There is no reason why every single top official in the world would want to participate in a conspiracy to lie about vaccines. There is no common benefit, or payoff. Furthermore, the conspiracy would have to be airtight. Millions of scientists, doctors and nurses would know about it, but not a single one would go to the press or complain publicly. Most doctors are self-employed, not paid by the CDC, so the CDC has no leverage over them.

Your notion is so far removed from reality, I am amazed you believe it. Apparently, you are extremely gullible and trusting and you believe any damn thing the anti-vaxxers tell you.

Let me add that your notion of how scientists work seems to come from pot-boiler thrillers sold in airports. Such books are the only place anyone would portray a situation in which every single public health official in every country collaborates in a conspiracy to lie about vaccines. I guess Clive Cussler could come up with a reason. Here in the real world there is no motive, and not enough money to bribe every researcher and doctor.

You talk about pressure, or intimidation. All of the fear would be in the other direction. The high officials would be demanding scientists commit a violation of their professional responsibilities. In a government agency, they would probably be breaking laws, subject to criminal penalties. If they were caught -- as they surely would be, because someone would talk -- it would mean the end of their careers. The younger ones would throw away the five years it took them to get a PhD, and the job they have worked for since high school. They would spend the rest of their lives in menial jobs. How many millions would they demand to take that risk? Plus, the unbribed ones would complain!

As I said, if a high exec went into MacDonald's and started pissing on the kitchen counters and food, it would not intimidate anyone. They would not be too scared to report him. On the contrary, they would be scared not to report him. They would call the police. Even if he were the CEO of the company, they would assume he is crazy. He could not bribe them to stop them from calling the police. He could not persuade them to countenance this, look the other way, or join in this pointless, lunatic criminal behavior. A public health official lying about vaccines would be engaged in equally pointless, lunatic criminal behavior.

Jed

I check my own BP for what I need each day to keep it on track/ the system dictate what I can have each month to stay alive if they short me I.m in the ER @ 10.000

Odd that the only test I ever did that changed the way I think was of butter vs- taste like butter.. My wife was a nut about adding stick of this stuff in everything. So.. I did 6 months with the fake butter on all the food , and got my blood work done.. everything was off the chart= high cholesterol ect .... then 6 more months will real butter.. just changing to real- butter only "Same food" and I even added more to meany things and went back to get my blood work again. my number changed so much my cholesterol - good and bad fell so low they attempted to add pills to get up to what they say are good numbers.. "made me sick"

from that point on....that long ago, I know the system was hacked.

Seems trust in the system was gone long ago..

Don't waist your time on me. My revenge is close at hand.

Quote from JedRothwell

Patents do not work that way. Anyone can replicate a patent for any purpose other than commercial sales of the product. Researchers are always allowed to replicate. Permission is never needed. That is one of the reasons we have a patent system. Not just to reward the inventor, but also to disseminate the knowledge and bring useful discoveries to society. For that same reason, when an inventor (or corporation) is awarded a patent for something the Patent Office deems important, but the inventor does not sell the product, or license it, or disseminate it some other way, the Patent Office steps in and forces the inventor to disseminate it. You are not allowed to suppress important technology by patenting it. You must take steps to bring it to society.

Stories about companies "buying up the patents" and keeping technology off the market are myths. They are not allowed to do that. They never have been, not since the Constitution established the patent system.

Inconsequential inventions have been kept off the market by sitting on patents.

I don't think you understand the gist of the article. Pfizer and moderns are not sharing samples with researchers.

No one is asking to replicate but to compare. Pfizer and moderns are hiding something!

"In order for us to develop a better vaccine, we need a comparator. For that reason, everyone who’s doing research in this area is in the same boat, we don’t have access to do a comparison,” Iwasaki said.

Antioxidants and clinical outcomes of patients with coronavirus disease 2019: A systematic review of observational and interventional studies

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/fsn3.3034

Abstract

Coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) is a newly emerging viral infection caused by severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2). Oxidative stress appears to be a prominent contributor to the pathogenicity of SARS-CoV-2. Therefore, we carried out a systematic review of human observational and interventional studies to investigate the role of some antioxidants such as vitamins A, E, D, and C, selenium, zinc, and α-lipoic acid in the main clinical outcomes of subjects with COVID-19. Google Scholar, Cochrane Library, Web of Science, Scopus, and Medline were searched using Medical Subject Headings (MeSH) and non-MeSH terms without restrictions. Finally, 36 studies for vitamins C and D, selenium, and zinc were included in this systematic review; however, no eligible studies were found for vitamins A and E as well as α-lipoic acid. The results showed the promising role of vitamin C in inflammation, Horowitz index, and mortality; vitamin D in disease manifestations and severity, inflammatory markers, lung involvement, ventilation requirement, hospitalization, intensive care unit (ICU) admission, and mortality; selenium in cure rate and mortality; and zinc in ventilation requirement, hospitalization, ICU admission, biomarkers of inflammation and bacterial infection, and disease complications. In conclusion, it seems that antioxidants, especially vitamins C and D, selenium, and zinc, can improve multiple COVID-19 clinical outcomes. Nevertheless, more studies are necessary to affirm these results.

Quote from Fm1

I don't think you understand the gist of the article. Pfizer and moderns are not sharing samples with researchers.

No one is asking to replicate but to compare. Pfizer and moderns are hiding something!

I believe they published the entire sequence of their mRNA on the net. I read that somewhere. Perhaps it would be easier to test or compare sequences if they handed out samples, but any lab in that line of work can recreate a sequence from the data. That's what they do.

I doubt they are hiding anything. I don't think they would be allowed to hide anything. Uncle Sam, who paid Moderna, would not allow that. However, they can make it easier or harder for competitors.

During the manufacturing process, after the vaccines are complete, they remove some vaccines from the boxes and test the entire RNA sequence to be sure there are no transcription errors. That is part of their quality control. It was described in the New York Times. If Pfizer and Moderna can do that from a finished vaccine, I suppose their competitors can too.

During the development, there were detailed discussions among researchers in the open literature about exactly what sequence to use, and why. So I guess they had access to the data and supercomputer simulations. They discovered that an isolated spike protein, not attached to the rest of the virus, acts differently from a spike that is part of the virus. I gather it kind of leans over. It is floppy. It lacks rigidity, which someone described in . . . sexual terms. As I recall. But maybe that's my imagination . . . The kind of thing I would imagine. Anyway, they tweaked the RNA and made it stand up straight, which meant the antibodies recognized the spikes on full blown viruses.

Quote from Wyttenbach

Unexplained excess deaths in UK still at 1500/week :: https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplep…al/weekending26august2022

So in Europe we have about 15% excess deaths among people of age > 64 ! The only thing all have in common is the exceptional joy after a dead promotion RNA gene therapy...

In UK many of the excess deaths are in <65 as in 2020/21 most dry tinder removed and many old deaths brought forward

NHS & Ambulance overload is due to the ~30% increase in Cat. 1 heart attacks and strokes --- Vaxx damage