Post ICCF24 thread.

  • Dear JedRothwell do you know this history ?

    I have never heard of this. Wow! It is impressive.


    Steam powered cars made more progress than people realize. The final version of the Stanley Steamers were marvelous machines. The early versions took a long time to bring to boil and generate enough steam. The final version had something like a large, shallow boiler. (Something like that . . . I don't recall the details.) Water was injected and flashed into steam quickly, so you could start up in a few minutes. The cars were speedy.


    I wonder if a cold fusion heat source will bring about the revival of steam piston or small steam turbine heat engines. It seems like the best approach. More efficient than a Stirling engine. Efficiency will not matter from an economic point of view, but an inefficient engine would take up a lot of space and generate a lot of waste heat. Ultimately, I hope that low cost thermoelectric heat engines can be developed. They have no moving parts, so they last longer. I think they can be made compact, judging from the size of the ones now used to power things like remote railroad crossings. They cost a lot of money per kilowatt of capacity. I don't know how much money. The manufacturers' web sites are unclear about the actual cost.

  • I doubt everything published will make its way here, but if it does that is a good problem to have, and we can handle it. There are already 319 pages to this thread, and another couple hundred will be easy to swallow. If it gets too cluttered-up we will think up something.

    It is a good kind of problem to have. It has been a long time since there was Too Much Information (TMI) about cold fusion. (Yeah, yeah "TMI" doesn't mean that.)

  • Anthropocene's newsletter out today has this to say:


    ICCF24 Solid-State Energy Summit content release plan

    The ICCF24 Solid-State Energy Summit may be over but the future of S-SAFE (LENR/Cold Fusion) is just beginning. The Energy Summit has a glowing success with over 150 in-person attendees and similar numbers via the online Hop-in platform. Once the videos and presentations are edited and approved, we will post them iccf24.org, YouTube, and other social media platforms over the coming weeks.

    We’re proud of the work we have put into the conference and are thankful for everyone's support and contributions to the conference!

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  • Presenter Theresa Benyo PHD NASA.


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  • “Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.”

    That witticism—I’ll call it “Einstein Insanity”—is usually attributed to Albert Einstein.


    Google tried 400 times to replicate Parkhomov and failed. More generally, people have been trying for decades to produce what Parkhomov or Rossi have done but have failed including Parkhomov and Rossi. Face it. Solid state LENR does not work. The reason is transmutation. The LENR reaction distroys the reactor no matter what you do. Dennis Cravens states this issue at 3:00 into this interview: the reaction will absolutely in all conceivable cases destroy the reactor. It always has and it always will.


    https://www.coldfusionnow.com/podcast/Ruby-Carat-Dennis-Cravens-Cold-Fusion-Now-015.mp3


    Y'all need to move on from solid state LENR into plasma based LENR which does not depend on loading a lattice with hydrogen or finding a nuclear active environment. Y'all are traveling down the same old road to nowhere. You need to think new thoughts and do new things. Look at what what you are doing objectively and change what you are doing.

  • Incorporating any Rossisays in your theories is like randomly re-assembling a cook book in a characture of organization, mixing up all the recipes, and then trying to find an ideal soufflé recipe in there somewhere.

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  • I want to say that I mostly agree with Axil. Plasma based systems which take advantage of self organized structures are the future of LENR/CF. I think it may be possible to build systems which utilize metallic fuel loaded with hydrogen, but they will always have major draw backs. First, unless you develop an advanced fuel prep system -- perhaps eventually even lithography -- you will not be able to precisely construct the thousands or millions of nuclear active environments you will need to produce micro-scale self organization. Secondly, it will be far more challenging to control those thousands or millions of self organized structures than one or a few large ones. Thirdly, like Axil says, sooner or later the self organized structure will destroy the NAE.


    There are many paths to move forward with plasma based systems. One is the path SAFIRE has chosen. In their setup, you allow a self organized plasma to form around a central anode and use low ripple direct current input. It's extremely simple and straightforward. You don't even need deuterium or rare elements. Then there are the systems that produce a free floating plasma ball either between two electrodes (a cathode and an anode) or in a microwave resonance chamber. I think systems where there's no contact between the plasma ball and the reactor are ideal because the closer they are together the more rapidly the system will be damaged.


    I simply cannot express how exciting it would be for an open source or quasi-open source team to build one of these plasma based systems and run tons of experiments.

  • Incorporating any Rossisays in your theories is like randomly re-assembling a cook book in a characture of organization, mixing up all the recipes, and then trying to find an ideal soufflé recipe in there somewhere.

    What's interesting is that if you produce a self organized plasma structure, many different recipes will work to some degree or another because the coherent matter layers will transmute a wide range of elements.

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  • Everyone pointed out the incredible level of organization, everything was perfect.

    On the other hand, I would say fortunately, in the land of Google, Microsoft, we should normally know how to manage microphones, even videoconferencing across the world.

    What counter-publicity it would have been if it hadn't been the case..

    Good job.


    The counterexamples exist, at home in France, we are made to believe that we are also the best in almost everything.

    We had the famous "Pasteur Institute"for example to save us from all illness and they weren't even able to release a vaccine against Covid.. What a shame..


    Congratulations again to the organizers of this ICCF.

  • Further References

    “DTRA: Investigation of Nano-Nuclear Reactions in Condensed Matter Final Report” June 2016 Affiliation: US Navy SPAWAR-PAC, Global Energy Corporation, University of New Mexico, University of Austin


    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/307594560_DTRA_INVESTIGATION_OF_NANO-NUCLEAR_REACTIONS_IN_CONDENSED_MATTER_FINAL_REPORT

    From Table 5-2. (page 88) List of presentations to admirals and heads of government agencies.


    Date / Meeting Place / Person(s) Briefed


    • Aug. 2, 2006 NDIA Naval S&T Partnership Conference in Washington DC: RADM William E. Landay III (head of ONR), Dr. Mike McGrath (head of S&T at ASN, RDA), Lt. Gen. Lawrence P. Farrell Jr. (USAF, retired)
    • Sept. 28, 2006 Capt. S. Black (Navy Liaison to the Vice President) in the Vice Presidents’ ceremonial office in the old executive office building in Washington DC.
    • May 2007 NDIA Joint Services Environmental Management Conference in Columbus, OH: Len Gollobin (Head of NDIA Energy Security Panel), Jim Woolsey (former head of CIA)
    • Nov. 7, 2007 SSC-Pacific: RADM Charles (Grunt) Smith (Vice CDR of SPAWAR)
    • May 2008 SSC-Pacific: James Colvard (retired SES, on special assignment to the Secretary of the Navy)
    • Apr. 2009 SSC-Pacific: ADM James Hogg (four star admiral, retired)
    • Apr. 14, 2009 SSC-Pacific: Brief given to congressional staffers
    • Apr. 27, 2009 SSC-Pacific: RADM Nevin P. Carr Jr. (Head of ONR)
    • May 14, 2009 AFCEA C4ISR at the San Diego Convention Center
    • June 26, 2009 SSC-Pacific: Dr. Richard L. Garwin (JASON Defense Advisory Group)
    • Aug. 2009 SSC-Pacific: B.J. Penn (ASN)
    • Sept. 24, 2009 SSC-Pacific: RADM Joe Rixey (Vice CDR of SPAWAR)
    • Oct. 27, 2009 SSC-Pacific: Mr. Zachary Lemnios (DDR&E)
    • Dec. 9, 2009 Chief of Naval Operations/Strategic Studies Group
    • May 13, 2010 MITRE Corp., VA, EMIS
    • June 29, 2010 Army Research Labs, Adelphi MD: RDECOM Power and Energy TFT LENR Workshop
    • Oct. 14, 2010 SSC-Pacific: Congressman Darrell Issa
    • Aug. 30, 2011 SSC-Pacific: Dr. Richard Carlin (ONR)
    • Others: RADM Kenneth Slaght (SPAWAR HQ); RADM Tim Flynn (when Captain of SSC-San Diego); Dr. John Fisher (DDR&E); Dr. Fred Saalfeld (senior civilian at ONR); VADM G. Peter Nanos (retired, Associate Director R&D at DTRA); Congresswoman Susan Davis; Senatora Diane Feinstein
  • Posted in its entirety as historical reference.
    Source
    newenergytimes.com was first indexed by Google more than 10 years ago ·https://www.newenergytimes.com/v2/conferences/2010/ARL/ARL-Agenda.shtml ·
    Your connection to this site is secure


    Army Research Labs LENR Workshop

    POWER AND ENERGY TFT LOW ENERGY NUCLEAR REACTIONS WORKSHOP ARL

    June 29, 2010


    [Originally Scheduled for Feb. 11, 2010], Army Research Labs, Adelphi, MD


    Slide Presentations

    Kim

    Widom

    Hagelstein

    McKubre

    Mosier-Boss

    Miley1

    Miley2

    Tanzella

    Miles

    Pereira

    Grabowski

    Kim2

    Miley3

    Nagel

    [Updated July 12: Final Workshop Agenda Available. Also, slide presentations available.]

    [Updated Feb 9: Message from the organizers: Due to weather conditions in the D.C. area, we have been forced to postpone the 11 February LENR workshop. We will keep you updated once a re-scheduled date has been established.]

    [Updated Feb. 1: Message from the organizers: “The LENR Workshop will be held on February 11, NOT February 10th. There was a typo on two of the attached documents distributed with my previous email. “

    Also added to the schedule: Peter Hagelstein, representing the Hagelstein Theory and Allan Widom, representing the Widom-Larsen Theory ]


    Draft Agenda as of Jan. 20, 2010

    RDECOM Power & Energy TFT

    LENR Workshop

    11 February 2010

    Army Research Labs (ARL), Adelphi, MD

    The pressing need for new alternative sources of power for both installation and tactical needs should be of no surprise. This Workshop has generated considerable interest at both Army OSD and DOE. The Workshop’s goal is to supply the Army P&E Leadership Team (and subsequently the Army leadership) with information on the LENR process, to detail the state of the art, to identify feasibility of research efforts to validate or mature the LENR technologies, and to guide possible investments by the Army in this area. Subject matter experts in the fields such as reproducibility, calorimetry, materials, and triggering reactions will discuss their research and findings. After the presentations, we will hold a discussion forum which will probe questions about the current state of LENR and what role the Army's research labs may play in this area.


    Workshop Agenda [DRAFT]
    0830Opening Remarks/Workshop GoalsDr. Ed Shaffer, ARL15 min
    0845Workshop ProcessDr. Cynthia Lundgren, ARL15 min
    0900Reproducibility of LENR ReactionsMike McKubre, SRI45 min
    1000Evidence of Nuclear ParticlesPam Boss, Spawar45 min
    1045TransmutationGeorge Miley, University of Illinois45 min
    1130Bose-Einstein CondensatesYeong Kim, Purdue University45 min
    1315Triggering LENR ReactionsFran Tanzella, SRI( to be given by Mike McKubre, SRI)45 min
    1400CalorimetryMel Miles, Dixie State College(to be given by Pam Boss, SpaWar)45 min
    1500Discussion Session· State of the Art in Materials· Consensus on Reproducibility· With Available Funding, How Can Army Best Contribute · What Basic Science Experiments are LackingDr. Cynthia Lundgren
  • Dr. Cynthia Lundgren

    Source

    ResearchGate is a European commercial social networking site for scientists and researchers to share papers, ask and answer questions, and find collaborators.

    https://www.researchgate.net/scientific-contributions/Cynthia-A-Lundgren-2133204711



    Reproducibility· With Available Funding, How Can Army Best Contribute · What Basic Science Experiments are Lacking

  • Good article written by an investor who attended all 4 days of the ICCF:


    How Hot is Cold Fusion? - Atomic Insights


    The 24th International Conference on Cold Fusion (ICCF24) was held at the lovely and spacious Computer History Museum in Mountain View, CA over four days in late July. As a venture investor looking at evaluating and investing in a wide range of advanced nuclear ventures, I was invited to participate and/or sponsor the event. While I wasn’t initially convinced that cold fusion was the best use of four days, the appeal of sharing my perspective on investing in next-gen nuclear as well as having the opportunity to talk wtih attendees about the work Rod and I are doing building advanced nuclear portfolios for investors with Nucleation Capital, our non-traditional venture fund, was more than I could resist.


    To our delight, ICCF24 was a surprisingly fun, well-organized and interesting event, hosted by the Anthropocene Institute. Four full days of expert sessions were capped with a hosted outdoor banquet with comic food-prep performance, gifts and dinner prepared by television celebrity Chef Martin Yan; the inspiring award of a lifetime-achievement gold medal; musical and multimedia entertainment with original rap performances about cold fusion derived from conference sessions by science impresario Baba Brinkman and much more. For those curious about where things stand with what is no longer being called “cold fusion,” I am pleased to share the following report.

    First, some background

    The concept of cold fusion was announced 1/3 century ago by Martin Fleischmann and Stanley Pons.1 Their sensational revelation? The release of excess heat in a lab setting explainable only as a type of nuclear event occurring in the presence of certain metals and gases. Their claims engendered tremendous scientific interest and initial fanfare but lack of replicability or an acceptable theory to explain the effect undermined confidence and the concept quickly went from hotly debated to thoroughly debunked.


    The onerous stigma of discredited science has since followed work on cold fusion yet a number of scientists had become intrigued and begun to explore the phenomenon. Researchers began to meet up periodically to discuss their work and results, forming the ICCF (International Conference on Cold Fusion) in 1990. Despite a serious lack of funding, many independent researchers and labs persisted in testing materials and produced yet more suggestive data using different combinations of metals, configurations, temperatures and pressure conditions.

    Fast forward

    In 2015, with the threat of climate change helping to convince Google to leave no energy stone unturned, a group of scientists, academics and technologists secured Google funding for a multi-year investigation into cold fusion. After three years and an investigation that tested dozens of approaches, the team published their findings in the journal Nature, acknowledging their failure to observe any transformative excess heat yet also an inability to either confirm or disprove cold fusion from their efforts. They found that better test techniques and measurement calorimetry would be helpful to go further and encouraged others to keep exploring. They concluded:

    A reasonable criticism of our effort may be ‘Why pursue cold fusion when it has not been proven to exist?’. One response is that evaluating cold fusion led our programme to study materials and phenomena that we otherwise might not have considered. We set out looking for cold fusion, and instead benefited contemporary research topics in unexpected ways.

    A more direct response to this question, and the underlying motivation of our effort, is that our society is in urgent need of a clean energy breakthrough. Finding breakthroughs requires risk taking, and we contend that revisiting cold fusion is a risk worth taking.

    We hope our journey will inspire others to produce and contribute data in this intriguing parameter space. This is not an all-or-nothing endeavour. Even if we do not find a transformative energy source, this exploration of matter far from equilibrium is likely to have a substantial impact on future energy technologies. It is our perspective that the search for a reference experiment for cold fusion remains a worthy pursuit because the quest to understand and control unusual states of matter is both interesting and important.Screen-Shot-2022-08-11-at-6.21.57-PM.png


    Back to the present

    The ICCF held its 24th session in northern California last week, following a three year hiatus. Those representing current ongoing research projects largely sported grey, white or no hair. The community engaged in lively debates on a whole range of issues, including what to call this type of energy. With “cold fusion” being tainted, “LENR” (Low Energy Nuclear Reactions) and “Solid-State Fusion Energy” were broadly used interchangeably, even as certain organizers urged caution about selecting any name before the underlying physics were actually fully understood.


    Continued poor repeatability underpinned by the lack of a supportive predictive atomic theory that explained the heat generation effect was acknowledged. Nevertheless, there was definite progress being made in a range of areas, not least of which was a far broader appreciation of the complexity of the dynamics underlying the atomic transmutations, particularly with respect to the numbers of affected and active bodies. Unlike fusion and fission, which are nuclear events that happen as a result of direct interactions of two distinct bodies (such as between deuterium and tritium for fusion, and between uranium and a neutron in fission), research had shown that LENR involved complex mult-body interactions, which could occur with a variety of metals such as nickel, steel, or palladium in the presence of deuterium or tritium but which may also include quarks, photons, protons, neutrons or pomerons. To further complicate the matter, it is clear that those dynamics were impacted by conditions such as temperature and pressure affecting the energy of the bonds within the metallic lattices.


    While the exact set of phenomena that unfold to release energy remains unclear, what was not debated at all was whether the potential to release heat was real. It clearly is, despite the extended difficulty scientists have had pinning down theory and practice. This issue seems entirely settled. Decades of work by hundreds of researchers reporting on their experiments and experiences of heat release “anomalies” have begun to provide a far more nuanced picture of the dynamics and the parametric guideposts that will eventually enable those studying them to narrow in on the controlling aspects.


    According to Dr. Florian Metzler of MIT, the revelation of data points around these phenomena closely mirrors the progression of reporting around anomalies for other deeply complex physical effects, such as the work that preceded the development of the transistor, the solid state amplifier or that which is continuing on superconductors. At some point, the data generated will provide sufficient guidance to enable patterns to emerge that may result in a profound shift in our understandings as well as tranformative technologies, just as Bell Labs did, despite widespread skepticism, to finally figure out how to make reliable transistors, which innovation revolutionized electronics.


    In the meantime, there are researchers pursuing the bigger picture on the theoretical side, and making strides towards creating a true “proof of principle” design, starting with known mechanisms which include a better understanding of how host lattice metals absorb energy, get excited and emit an alpha particle. Increasingly, those seeking to deploy LENR systems will move from uncontrolled behaviors to deliberately engineered systems that produce useful amounts of energy. Once that happens, LENR may well emerge as a readily deployable type of consumer-facing nuclear, where a wide range of low-cost materials could be combined at nearly any size or configuration to generate electrons or heat for use in homes, schools, stores, boats, planes and other places where both electricity and heat are used but in smaller amounts.

    Two Big Announcements

    $10 Million from ARPA-e. Though there were no technological breakthroughs announced, there were some very exciting funding announcements. During his presentation, ARPA-e fusion program director, Scott Hsu, announced a new $10 million funding solicitation round that will select a number of LENR project teams to fund. This funding decision came out of ARPA-e’s Low-Energy Nuclear Reactions Workshop, held in October of 2021, which solicited input from experts on the best approach for breaking the stalemate that has long existed between lack of funding and lack of results in cold fusion. In anticipation, most likely, of the urgency with which any breakthrough will need to be commercialized, this program requires that applicants form into full business teams that bring a variety and balance of skills, blending technical with marketing and finance.


    Eyeing a $100M XPrize. Although organizers were not ready to announce the competition or the specific requirements, work has begun to raise the capital necessary to offer a $100 million XPrize to the first team to produce a replicable, accepted, on-demand LENR system. Peter Diamandis, founder of the XPrize, addressed the assembled group and revealed info about the behind-the-scenes efforts, decisions and negotiations that must be completed in order for the XPrize organization to officially offer the prize and start the competition. The news and prospect of there being a very large XPrize that might be offered was very well received. It was also clear that, much like with other XPrizes, news of a prize being in the works can shake loose investment capital for promising ventures sooner rather than later. XPrize-Quote.png

    LENR Lessons and Learning

    According to the Anthropocene Institute, there may be 150 or more initiatives or ventures currently working on LENR research or development. ICCF24 organizers opted not to host a huge expo but instead invited the community to submit posters or abstracts for the conference. One had to become a sponsor in order to secure space to showcase one’s efforts at the event. As a result, only a few LENR ventures displayed LENR demos and, of those on display, only one actually demonstrated an effect. Nevertheless, there were a few ventures in attendance claiming to have working systems that generate excess energy and endeavoring to raise venture funding to get to the next stage.


    For those of us interested in the investment opportunities, ICCF24 provided ample opportunities for mingling with and meeting those gathered at ICCF24. People were happy to share their opinions on the state-of-the-art and these conversations provided a gauge on community sentiments. Not surprisingly, many were wary of existing energy production claims. Such caution is prudent for anyone prone to giving credence to any claim until repeatable energy production is demonstrated without question. This has yet to be achieved. But, to complicate matters, lack of demonstrable evidence but doesn’t fully refute claims either. There are, in fact, few good means of measuring small amounts of incremental heat produced in a system that is already hot or has another source of energy adding power. There are tabulation methods that have been proposed but lack of suitable measurement equipment or agreed upon verification methods is yet another challenge for the successful emergence of this technology. Thus, the race to the finish line for understanding and controlling these reactions continues both on the theoretical side as well as on the practical application side with no clear winner or timeline in sight, making early-stage investment decisions little more than a bet on a team and a dream.


    Whichever group manages to overcome these obstacles and develop a securely working system—whether or not they have figured out the underlying theoretic basis—would, however, have a significant strategic and financial advantage. Not only would they find capital resources, they would have a clear lead in getting a viable product to market in what would clearly be a huge market. Sadly, given cold fusion’s still lingering stigma, LENR developers face extra jeopardy in any overstatements that could reverberate to set back the entire field. For now, this makes fundraising a particular challenge for all developers, even among those investors quite aware that LENR may one day compete in the vast energy market.


    Given the potential value of this technology, it is no wonder that dozens of cash-strapped researchers and venture teams have soldiered on for decades. Now that ARPA-e has chosen to continue the work initiated by Google to identify a proof-of-concept design, there is new-found scientific integrity and rebranding to be done. There is also a greater awareness that what set cold fusion back and derailed early efforts was not scientific fraud but rather its far more complex sub-atomic transmutations, its multibody interactions combined with environmental factors such as temperature, pressure and light that varied by selection of component materials. These complexities still need to be sorted out but could potentially provide many viable options for sourcing and construction of systems and thus help to reduce manufacturing costs.


    Not surprising then, was the participation at ICCF24 of several of the most respected and active venture funders in the nuclear space, including Matt Trevithick, who recently left Google and joined the venture fund, DCVC; Carly Anderson from Prime Movers Lab; Kota Fuchigami from Mitsubishi; and Shally Shanker of Aiim Partners. How and where these firms choose to invest in LENR will not be known for some time. Still, if nothing else, this conference established that informed investors do recognize that LENR exists and they are watching its progress. If the work progresses as anticipated by the community, LENR will eventually become a ubiquitous source of safe, low-cost, readily-manufacturable, clean, popular and broadly applicable commercial nuclear energy that provides abundant energy. For those still pondering “how hot is cold fusion?,” there is discernable warming, so it may be time to start paying attention.

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