Direct Production Of Electricity - Infinite Energy.

  • An excellent article by Dave Nagel in this month's INFINITE ENERGY: This paper reviews various approaches to the direct production of electrical power by using excitations from Low Energy Nuclear Reactions (LENR). Some of the methods only provide low voltages, currents and powers. Efforts are underway to understand and improve the outputs of those techniques. One recent report by Egely describes a device that magnifies electrical energy by as much as a factor of 10.


    Direct Electrical Production from LENR – Digital Download - $1.00 : Infinite Energy Magazine Store


  • Just been reading this short George Egely collection from IE:


    Forgotten Inventions of LENR, Parts 1-4


    It is mostly about direct electrical energy production, a lot of which I've been familiar with for a while.


    However, I'd missed what George terms a "Dark Horse":  GB763062A_Original_document_20230316224934.pdf


    "The most misleading assumptions are the ones you don't even know you're making" - Douglas Adams

  • Was it this one, referring to a different forum?



    The patent does seem a bit of an outlier. Whether the inventors actually built and tested the device does have to be questioned, since there seems to be little record of it (other than the patent application) anywhere else.


    "LookingForHeat" post on the Wayback Machine

    "The most misleading assumptions are the ones you don't even know you're making" - Douglas Adams

    Edited 2 times, last by Frogfall ().

  • Thank you- that was the one. As you say, there is nothing else (that I could find) on the web. Finding this did inspire a group of Italian independent scientists to attempt replication, but unfortunately their group leader and financier became gravely ill and it never happened.

  • If the idea that the "cell" is some sort of short-lived radioactive battery, that needs hourly RF activation, is taken with a pinch of salt - then what else could it be?


    I guess one possibility is that the cell might act like a semiconductor diode (or old metal rectifier) in one direction and an avalanche diode in the other - relying on some kind of magnetoresistive switch effect. Maybe the initial 300MHz whack creates a whole bunch of ions that remain mobile for around an hour, and when it eventually settles the switch effect stops.

    "The most misleading assumptions are the ones you don't even know you're making" - Douglas Adams

    Edited 2 times, last by Frogfall ().

  • I'm writing a review of David Nagel's entire article, be up in a few days. I am of the opnion that direct production of electricity may be where LENR finally ends up being most useful.

  • David Nagel sat here for a long time, you can’t tell where he got what from.

    The article has a comprehensive list of 76 references. You can see exactly where everything is from.

    "The most misleading assumptions are the ones you don't even know you're making" - Douglas Adams

  • Frank Gordon's experiments are undoubtedly the best way to demonstrate that LENRs exist. (Fusion Diodes are good, but not easy to build)



    Instead of discussing the LECs, it is better to reproduce them, and improve them, as Ampère improved Wollaston's ideas on the stereochemistry of molecules. (I don't know why this example comes to mind tonight, who knows?) William Wollaston was a Platinum specialist, but he also tried to purify palladium, keeping all his processes secret. Did he success ? Who knows? He is also the inventor of the famous "A la Wollaston" electrode used by the experiments of Mizuno and his followers.


    But he had many other interests, crystallography among others. He perfected the goniometer that René-Just Haüy had designed to measure the angles of the faces of a crystal. He published in the Philosophical Transactions in 1809 his conception of a reflective goniometer. He was therefore familiar with the works and ideas of Haüy. Moreover, he had taken a close interest in atomic theory, both criticizing and modifying the ideas of John Dalton.


    Wollaston took as his starting point a remark by Robert Hooke in his Micrographia on the construction of geometric solids like the tetrahedron from spherical particles. Wollaston hesitates: should we choose the tetrahedron or the octahedron as the basic module in crystallography?


    This question is always relevant concerning the places where the deuterium is lodged in the alloys of palladium, isn' it? He showed how one ends up, by assembling spherical objects, at your choice, in a tetrahedron, an octahedron, a rhombohedron, a hexagonal prism, etc.


    These reflections, which date from the Egyptians and Plato, should still guide us today.


    Come on, an easy question: if we join two tetrahedrons by the base, we get a solid that seems regular. All of its faces are identical. Why did the ancients not retain it among the 5 Platonic solids?

  • if we join two tetrahedrons by the base, we get a solid that seems regular. All of its faces are identical. Why did the ancients not retain it among the 5 Platonic solids?

    Because it doesn't comply with all the "rules".


    There are two corners with three faces meeting, and three corners with four faces meeting.


    This would cause mental discomfort to anyone obsessed with inventing arbitrary rules, who then tries to force everyone else to abide by them.

    "The most misleading assumptions are the ones you don't even know you're making" - Douglas Adams

  • Excellent answer! Yes, faces are equivalent, but there are two classes of vertices.


    It's like a Bose-Einstein condensate with deuterium. The deuterium nucleus is a boson. (spin 1) The deuterium atom is also a boson. (two spin ½ electrons and a spin 1 nucleus)

    But then the deuterium molecule should also be a boson, and it should be able to form a BEC.


    And yet, the deuterium molecule (D2) does not form a condensate. For what ?



    The answer is topological. In a gas, in a liquid or even in a crystal, the vector connecting the two deuterium atoms points in different directions AND THEREFORE THE MOLECULES ARE NOT EQUIVALENT.


    This is why to obtain a diafluid phase, the molecules must break and the nuclei must enter the crystalline phase of our alloys which form NAEs.

  • From 2012; the paper outlined here supposedly claimed that extra power was coming from endothermic lattice vibrations (phonons).


    Ultra-efficient LED puts out more power than is pumped in
    MIT physicists have been testing a light-emitting diode that has an electrical efficiency of more than 100 percent. You may ask, "Wouldn't that mean it breaks…
    www.wired.co.uk

    "The most misleading assumptions are the ones you don't even know you're making" - Douglas Adams

  • If our new theoretical team’s theories are correct, then our prediction is that direct current flow will never be more than a by product of heat production in practical quantities. But this work most definitely adds to the body of data that must be considered in any new LENR theory.


    Mizuno has also found current flow in many of his experiments as well.

  • If our new theoretical team’s theories are correct, then our prediction is that direct current flow will never be more than a by product of heat production in practical quantities

    Tell your team that the balance between direct electrical production and heat depends on experimental conditions and sysyem design.

  • 69 picowatts! Sign me up

    The tiny claimed excess power would be funny, if it wasn't a symptom of something quite problematic, as far as scientific publishing goes.


    This graph from the "over-unity LED" paper shows that the relevant measurements were probably at the far end of their instruments' capabilities. The idea of getting accurate results at either end of the massive range shown is laughable, and yet the researchers have been able to publish without being knocked-back through peer review. Not only that, but they have been able to get away with claiming an over-unity effect, whilst proffering an explanation that is not supported by experimental results. Nowhere in the paper do they show that they have been able to measure the supposed temperature drop that they claim is the source of the extra power.


    Note that many popular (and serious) science websites reported the results of the paper - using the over-unity claim as clickbait - whilst saying nothing about the feasibility of getting accurate results at these low powers. They also accepted the claim about the source of the supposed extra power without question. The slant of the stories were all similar, effectively saying: "Oh no! Someone has claimed over-unity in a test! But don't worry, everyone, we have a comforting explanation, so you can rest easy".



    So why was this paper given such an easy ride? Compare it with the number of LENR papers that have been rejected because reviewers questioned the accuracy of the instrumentation - even though the measurements were within a sensible capability range of the instruments used. And how many LENR papers have been rejected simply on the grounds that any proffered hypotheses for the measured effects are unfeasible, in the minds of the reviewers?


    Edit: p.s. And before someone says that a Peltier heat pump device can also operate in Seebeck generator mode; Yes - it can do that - but not at the same time...

    "The most misleading assumptions are the ones you don't even know you're making" - Douglas Adams

    Edited 2 times, last by Frogfall ().

  • The above paper has at least spawned a number of research projects, pursuing the same goal. This is good, and what would be expected from the successful publication of an, albeit flawed, experiment. e.g.


    Electroluminescent cooling using light-emitting diodes
    Light-emitting diodes with above-unity wall-plug efficiency offer lightweight, vibrationless, gravity-agnostic, and small-footprint cooling solutions for space.
    www.esa.int


    Quote

    Although the theoretical potential of ELC has been known for a long time [6], it was only recently that ELC was demonstrated in the laboratory - although for extremely low cooling powers [5]. With the increase in the efficiencies of LEDs in general, several groups have started looking into the use of ELC for practical purposes

    also see:


    Electroluminescent refrigeration by ultra-efficient GaAs light-emitting diodes
    Electroluminescence—the conversion of electrons to photons in a light-emitting diode (LED)—can be used as a mechanism for refrigeration, provided that the LED h
    pubs.aip.org

    "The most misleading assumptions are the ones you don't even know you're making" - Douglas Adams

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