[00:03] [Nikolova] Then, good evening to all and thanks to Andrea Rossi for having made it available to participate in this conference call and to give me the exclusive opportunity for Italy to realize this event. We know that today, November 24, 2017, at the Royal Swedish Academy of Engineering, the presentation of the Quark X reactor, the third and final evolution of the E-Cat reactor invented by Dr. Andrea Rossi in 2008, took place today. I was able to be present in Stockholm and attend this important event personally, but there are two Italian university attendees who have assisted the demonstration live, and will be able to tell us their impressions and ask questions to Andrea Rossi. I will not go further; while I'm going to present the components of this Web Conference. I start precisely with those who are present there: Professor Neri Accornero of the University of Rome La Sapienza and Professor Giorgio Vassallo of the University of Palermo. In connection with Italy, however, it is with us Mario Menichella, a physicist and science writer.
[01:42] [Nikolova] Start right away with the questions. The first question I want to ask is Andrea - of course - is the following: Andrea, how do you think it has been demonstrated from your point of view, are you satisfied? And what do you expect or expect it to happen after this event?
[Rossi] Yes: I'm satisfied because it seems to me, at least my opinion, that it's okay. We have seen, my team and myself, the QuarkX running, keeping it at a power even prudently low compared to the maximum power, so it does not run any kind of risk. It seemed to me that the quality of the present was very high, that is: there were present, there was a high scientific level present, there were important presences from the industrial point of view and my opinion is positive. I was expecting from this event to show for the first time in action the QuarkX to an extremely selected audience and my purpose I have achieved. I'm happy with what happened. There have also been many encounters after; I have not come back to the hotel where I'm staying and from here I'm talking to you, and that's it. I am very pleased to have met Professor Vassallo, Professor Neri in person, because I have spoken to them many times over the Internet by email, but I did not know them personally; and I'm very pleased with this.
[03:35] [Nikolova] Then, the second question - after that I'll give you a word to you - is this: How much did your business experience in the past have been useful to the E-Cat project?
[Rossi] Well, that is: any person doing a profession accumulates experience and makes it fruitful, so ... any person when doing something exploits the experience he has in memory, even Although this field is very different from the fields I've worked in before, but certainly the experience certainly has its importance. It is difficult now to enter details, then try to find out why; here would be a psychoanalysis.
[04:32] [Nikolova] Thanks. Then let us now go to the questions of conference call participants starting with the professors present in Stockholm. Please, Professor Accornero.
[Accorero] Then tonight in the meantime Andrea, meanwhile, thank you very much for the invitation that was really appreciated. I would say that - from a neurologist, so not physically - but the presentation has been great: to show a COP of 400 out of the lab, in front of the public I think is amazing. The applause that they did in the end, according to my opinion, should have such a prestigious audience as the one you have said, they should partially reward you for all the maladies that unfortunately still circulate on the Net but that will definitely squeeze. Look, we've heard that you probably think about industrial production by 2018. Obviously we're not in the skin. This means, however, that the license you obtained for the old E-Cat system is also valid for the Quark X system and that therefore you can expect that there are no bureaucratic buds for the production of industrial type systems of 200 and more kilowatts? Or is there a problem there too to get a marketing license?
[05:55] [Rossi] Yes. You mean security certification.
[Accelerated] Yes, yes.
[Rossi] Yes. Look; No, no: The certification we have obtained for the industrial E-Cat first also applies to this because they change physical parameters but basically, essentially the machine for the parts that are intended for certification is the same. As a result, the certifications we have obtained from SGS and Bureau Veritas are still valid. Naturally, they only apply in the industrial field, in the field of industrial applications, while in the field of domestic application we are always struggling, although I think there are very good grounds for this problem to be solved.
[ Last ] The last ... then one last consideration: we will certainly wait for the home system, but that's what interests a lot of people. You know that the revolution is made from the bottom, from the people. I think if you were able to sell the first thousands of home systems, nobody stopped you. Strength, go ahead as quickly as possible! Hello.
[Rossi] Thank you, Black, thank you.
[07:19] [Nikolova] Thank you Professor Accornero, would you like to ask another question or ...?
[Accorero] No, we also go to Vassallo who wanted to do ...
[Nikolova] Well then, let's go to Professor Vassallo, please.
[Rossi] By the way, I still see you in a tie and I do not feel like respect. I came back quite tired, I put on ... I apologize, but I have a virtual tie!
[They turned] I took it off and I could give it to you, but ... so I took it off. Hello!
[07:54] [Nikolova] Professor Vassallo ...?
[Vassallo] Yes yes, no: a question on a point that was particularly impressed to me, that is, the importance in this control reactor, the concept of control, which is virtually absent in literature . Is this electronics also capable of handling a power generated by the reactor, absorbing a power generated by the reactor, or is a literally sofisticated control logic that therefore requires particularly complex circuits? That is, the power dissipated within the control logic is due to this complex electronics or to the power management generated by the E-Cat itself? This is something I'm not very clear yet. Oh, and really if you can answer, be careful, without getting into the details, obviously.
[Rossi] No, no: Well, it's not easy to answer this question because the control system is in any case determined by the needs generated in the context of the reactor's operation. Although it is not the power generated by the reactor to determine dissipations in the control system, however, it is true that dissipations in the control system are determined by the complexity of the control itself. So there is no potentiometric interference, but there is a technological control logic. So how does it solve, how will this solve the problem? By studying, studying control systems. We are on the way to ensure that this heat dissipated by the control system is eliminated. From a point of view ... it is clear from the strictly scientific point of view the heat generated and dissipated in and out of the cooling system of the control system - that is, no: the heat generated by the control system and dissipated by the cooling system is warmth that from the thermal balance point of view theoretically is perfectly recoverable with COP 1 because if I have, if I dissipate 60W consumed 60W, then the same 60W I go to recover with a heat exchanger and is out of It does not have to do anything with what is the thermal balance and therefore the COP of the E-Cat, but it is clear that it is a problem to be solved because if one buys an E-Cat to make electricity, retrieve the It does not matter to him and so, so it's not the point. As a result, it is a problem to be solved, in the sense that ... and this is precisely the point where we are focusing; that is to say the maximum because that big white box that you have seen today, which is now the control system, must be reduced to a packet of cigarettes to govern ... anyway keep in mind that this control system here is able to govern a thousand of E-Cat, so the relationship is quite relevant. But the big problem is to reduce the size, because it is not ... we have a huge energy intensity at the reactor level because we produce, today we produced 20W in one, ... pretty much a tenth of a centimeter cubic. Of course, a remarkable density. Then you can not pierce everything to make a drawer to do checks. We are somewhat in a situation similar to the one of the very first big computers that are now reduced to a microchip.
[12:30] [Vassallo] Yes. By the way, the thing that makes an impression is the size of the active part, which I understand is a few millimeters cubic the active part that produces energy.
[Rossi] Yes, yes.
[Vassallo] It seems ...
[Rossi] Yes, yes it's practically a hair segment.
[Vassallo] Yes, yes, and this is an awesome thing, thinking about the gigantism that experiments like the ITER project are going to do, is not it?
[Rossi] Mah ... the problem, why ITER will never work, so ... I mean ... that thing does not work there, and for 50 years they always say that between 10 years will work; but it will never work.
[Vassal] No, but that "magnet" there lures a lot of money, that magnet. Strange magnet. Because it draws money instead of iron. It draws money from our pockets.
[Rossi] Yes, and it will continue. Why why? The problem is the fields. Well, Professor Vassallo, these things teach her to me. Because the fields, because there are magnetic fields used to limit trajectories of elementary particles - no? - Of the protons in particular, which must go to merge. These are energized at such levels that they reach temperatures in the order of one million degrees, and as everyone knows, a million degrees does not have any material to hold. There is enough contact with a few fractions of second, for milliseconds between something that is one million degrees and any - maybe even tungsten - and tungsten is boiled, vaporized, not melted. It instantly transforms into tungsten vapor. And it is clear that a plant ... and magnetic fields are extremely unstable, because with those dimensions there magnetic fields are leopard skins. At a time when there was a hole - and in these moments it is impossible to imagine that it does not happen several times a day - there it blends everything. So ... so it's a misconception, a concept that will not go anywhere. Let's say he's doing some good places, that's a nice thing. But there are very jobs ... very expensive jobs.
[Vassallo] Very clear.
[Rossi] And then it produces a bit of business, companies provide materials that cost God's wrath - crazy values - and especially what is their greatest fortune? That when we do something we have to demonstrate that it works, they can afford to go on for centuries without having to prove anything, just by flashing the allodoles infinite future energy of the mirror.
[15:21] [Vassallo] One might consider how important it is in research to think out of the most widespread conceptual concepts, do not you? That is, the starting point is to try to reason with your own head, eliminating those mental barriers that prevent you from seeing beyond what is often considered as absolute and consolidated. And so the first step would be to consider the importance of not relying on too rigid schemes, that is, schemes deemed untouchable; so make the first step to try to start over again, sometimes to question concepts and models that have always been considered untouchable.
[Rossi] There's a perfect example of what you're saying. Galileo Galilei had to abduct and say that there is no problem that the sun revolves around the Earth for not being burnt alive.
[Vassallo] Now is the so-called "stabilized science" that makes objections. This is displeased, because dogmas should ...
[Rossi] Eh, but that is another form of religion.
[16:42] [Nikolova] Well, I - the conversation is definitely very interesting - but at this point I would give the floor to Dr. Menichella; You are welcome.
[Menichella] Thank you. Hi Andrea.
[Rossi] Hi, Mario!
[Menichella] First of all congratulations on the new finish. I've obviously been following for so many years, let's say, your research, your results, and since I have not seen the pictures yet, I'm a little general. One thing that came to my mind shortly ago was to figure out whether the technology - the previous version of the reactor then the Hot-Cat - you consider it a technology that we do not have a future, or you may have some niche applications. I do not know, I was thinking maybe where there would be no electromagnetic fields, I do not know: for a large power plant, or do you think it is wiped away by the new QuarkX?
[Rossi] It's obsolete.
[Menichella] It's obsolete. But instead, with the Hot-Cat, I remember talking about the cat and mouse technology blogs. That's where we say, are you wearing behind or even that part of the past?
[Rossi] That one is now seen in the oscilloscope. Because we have an electric field of electrons with particles moving only in one direction, that is polarized in one way with a pulsating rhythm. And in those pulsations there's the game of the cat and the mouse.
[Menichella] And for a while, the theoretical aspect - because I imagine that you have made some progress, without obviously wanting to know the details, but just for curiosity - you've been able to figure out what's going on, or do not you have any details on the subject yet?
[Rossi] No, today the Swedish physicist Carl Oscar Gullstöm, with whom we are working on the theoretical level, has begun to give us directions on what is the address we are taking. And among other things, his report is published on the Journal of Nuclear Physics this week. The full edition, because it is a 44 pages publication. Today he has summed it up in 20 minutes, but we publish the full edition on the Journal of Nuclear Physics. We have not yet found a theory but we have at least got an address.
[19:41] [Menichella] So practically the optimization you made it a bit like a black box, that is, without understanding the details in short. At its own engineering level, a bit like you do ...
[Rossi] No, no, you have to make a distinction between engineering and theoretical, because there are two completely different things. From a engineering point of view ... fire engineering has started thousands of years before you know what fire was, and that there was a valid theory to explain what fire is. The fire, which is the fire, has come to light when alchemy has gone to a chemical developer and oxidation processes are known. But the use of fire in engineering fields is far ahead. Here we are in a similar situation: from an engineering point of view we have developed an apparatus that is extremely reliable, extremely repeatable. Today I went there - just right before Neri - I went there today with a few suitcases, with my team downloaded some luggage on the desk, we mounted this thing, then when the audience came in, I crushed a button and the thing went. So from an engineering point of view it is not that we have been there to say "we hope it goes", "my god," "pulls there," "spring from there," and so on. The only time I've ever had when I wanted to do spectroscopic analysis but, unfortunately, there was the movie screen that emitted a strong light, so spectrometry was not, it was not possible. But this has nothing to do with the E-Cat. But that was a "more" one that had nothing to do with E-Cat's efficiency or reliability.
[21:36] And if I had to - for charity, I do not give you any suggestions - but if I have to do that spectrometry, if you put the spectrometer inside an aluminum tube away, then obscured, and the aluminum tube arrives in the E-Cat, maybe he can read ...
[Rossi] Eh, but I have a problem that if I put an aluminum tube I have problems with the electromagnetic fields that are around.
[They turned] Then darkened glass?
[Rossi] And of an obscured glass, an insulator? Ok. Thanks for your advice.
[Stairs] Figurate!
[Rossi] No, no, I had already done before, so it's a ... no ... that is, I did not consider that with a cinematic screen turned on the light is very strong.
[22:18] [Menichella] Yes, I wanted to know something else, that is, you think that development has come to the maximum attainable or there are still potentials - I do not know - novelties or other things, and consider it more a goal, so now or a starting point? Because I think many would consider it a milestone.
[Rossi] No, Mario: It's neither a milestone nor a starting point, it's a stop. The stages will never end.
[Menichella] But for the development then give us an idea, say from the point of view ...
[Rossi] For industrial development now I would say that we are at the most ...
[Menichella] No, just like a reactor, right? I see three generations, right? I thought...
[Rossi] For the moment I'm at the maximum of that ... we are at the maximum of what we are capable of doing now. But I'm not too convinced that one month will still be so. Up to now a maximum has never been. Because good or bad are out of the question, then you are studying development. From a production point of view at some point, however, one has to stop, at some point research and development must go away, go on one side, and production begins.
[Menichella] Of course, once stability is achieved ...
[Rossi] I would say that the stability that we have achieved now that today everyone has been able to see, now we have come to: press the button and turn on, press the button and turn off. Several times today I had to turn on and off when we passed from one phase of the test to another, when we moved from calorimetry to spectrometry, spectrometry to dummy; we had to continue to turn it on and off, that will light up and turn off as a light bulb.
[23:42] [Menichella] And this is why I ask you why we say, you have a privileged position to answer this question, in recent years with the latest version, in recent months, you saw a change of attitudes by the media, by other scientists? You mentioned it a bit at the beginning, but I just wanted to understand what you felt in normal life.
[Rossi] Today, well, today there were people who two years ago would never come. The professors who are there - I can not tell who was there - but there were people who two years would not come. Even in the industrial field there were people who would not have come two years and were very careful. That is, they were not there to have fun. So yes: an evolution has been at least high-level.
[24:48] [Nikolova] Yes, I would just say that we are going to the conclusion, considering the fact that for Andrea today was a very busy day and I suppose dense emotions. And just about the emotions, Andrea, I would like to ask you the last question. Over the years, you have been talking about yourself as the inventor of an unlikely device, if not impossible, to put in question not only its functioning, but also the person, the man who invented it. So it comes to me to ask you: seeing what has happened today, which seems to resentfully deny the people who have doubts, what are the emotions that have crossed you in this last period, and what you are experiencing when, despite the difficulties, the sufferings, some defeats, do you manage to see your dream come true?
[Rossi] Look ... looks: a man can do what he really wants to do, and this fact is absolutely independent ... it is when one really wants to do something, in my opinion, must be able to isolate himself from emotions and from all these things here. Because if you're influenced by all the jokes you say about you, or by ... you have to react to obstacles simply because if they put a stone in front of the car that does not let me go, I have to move the rock. But that is not an emotion. But if one gets influenced by emotions, he or she may not get where he wants to go, especially if it is a difficult journey. Very frankly, I know what they say about me and I'm always blurry. I've had this problem more or less, maybe I'm still. (??). but, for me, it's like water flowing through the granite when ... that is, it does not matter to me. I'm just interested in one thing: if I'm doing an experiment, I have to succeed, I do not care about what they say ... then when I can do the product and sell it. If the product is good and they buy it, no one cares about it, and anyone who buys if it suffers what they said about that product. It is something that interests him. One thing you're interested in buying a television is that you put it there, light it up and watch the game. If it is Italy-Sweden, do not miss it. I'm all chiaccherons that do not serve anything.
[27:45] [Nikolova] So good control of emotions. Well, is there anyone you would like to dedicate to this day?
[Rossi] Professor Sven Kullander. I also told you during the experiment. Professor Sven Kullander because ... Sven Kullander on me has exerted a remarkable stimulus. Yes, I would say, since I am in Sweden ... if I was in Italy I would have told Professor Focardi. We are in Sweden, I say to Professor Kullander.
[Nikolova] Thanks for sharing, Andrea, and for ...
[Rossi] Thanks to you, it made me a great pleasure to see you.
[Nikolova] ... and to have given me a bit of your time, at this very important moment for future developments. Finally, I would like to thank you again, with the hope that this invention can be industrialized in a short time so as to contribute, together with other means, to the containment of CO2 emissions, which emerge from the so-called climatic changes that are under the eyes of all. Thanks again.
