I was wrong about Rossi, but what I fear most is that I might be partly right

Quote from axil

alpha particle impacts into the plastic having a energy of about 2 MeV.

I haven't read Fisher's paper. Do you have a reference?

One remark I would make is that there are very few nuclear reactions which produce alphas at 2 MeV. This is rather good news as it means we may be able to identify their origin so much better. (For example all known alpha decays are ruled out). I recall that Piantelli also measured low energy alphas in his Wilson Cloud Chamber experiments using a nickel rod which had previously produced anomalous heat in a hydrogen atmosphere. Axil did Fisher propose any explanation for 2 MeV alphas?

Quote from Hermes

I haven't read Fisher's paper. Do you have a reference?

One remark I would make is that there are very few nuclear reactions which produce alphas at 2 MeV. This is rather good news as it means we may be able to identify their origin so much better. (For example all known alpha decays are ruled out). I recall that Piantelli also measured low energy alphas in his Wilson Cloud Chamber experiments using a nickel rod which had previously produced anomalous heat in a hydrogen atmosphere. Axil did Fisher propose any explanation for 2 MeV alphas?

See

http://www.infinite-energy.com…s/pdfs/OrianiObituary.pdf

Quote

Nuclear engineer Mark Hugo describes the work of Dr. Richard A. Oriani in providing validation for cold fusion experiments through the use of CR-39 radiation detectors, which Oriani utilized to measure alpha particle generation inside a cold fusion electrolytic cell. Hugo cites, “Energetic Charged Particles Produced in the Gas Phase by Electrolysis”, published by Dr. Richard A. Oriani and John C. Fisher, which summarizes Oriani’s research in this area.

According to the paper, Oriani used CR-39 polymer samples suspended in the gasses ABOVE the cold-fusion electrolytic cell as a detection apparatus for alpha-particle emission from the cold fusion cell. Hugo stresses the importance of suspending the CR-39 detector above the solution, as he believes that the solution itself may impede either the particle-emitting reaction or detection of the particles. After extensive testing to determine a baseline “control” for radiactivity in the area, Oriani ran the cold fusion cell for 5 weeks, and during this time documented one massive alpha-particle emitting event.

Mark Hugo describes the experimental measurements done on the cold fusion cell, as well as the construction of Oriani’s cold fusion cell and the manner in which the CR-39 sample was experimentally used. He also describes how detailed analysis of the particle tracks from the alpha-emission led Oriani to realize that these came from a single particle event.

According to Mark Hugo, not only has Dr. Richard Oriani confirmed the presence of alpha-emission during cold fusion experiments, but has also captured a single particle event of such incredible magnitude that it may single greater potential from cold fusion than is currently anticipated from traditional nuclear fusion energy.

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See
Mark Hugo: Validating Cold Fusion

Energetic Charged Particles Produced in the Gas Phase by Electrolysis
http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/OrianiRAenergeticc.pdf

Quote from JedRothwell

Someone who knows a lot more nuclear physics than I do informs me that you are correct. I had it wrong.

D+D to 4He is a rare branch of plasma fusion. However, for some reason it seems to be the only branch of cold fusion. If you could somehow force plasma fusion into the D+D => 4He branch only, you would get a certain amount of helium per joule of heat. That is how much you get with cold fusion.

If you don't see tritium and neutons, then its not D D fusion

The nuclear fusion of deuterium has been studied intensively for over 40 years. The reaction between two low energy deuterium nuclei has been observed to proceed in three ways:

(a) D + D -->3He (0.82 MeV) + n (2.45 MeV)

(b) D + D -->T (1.01 MeV) + p (3.02 MeV)

(c) D + D -->4He + gamma (23.85 MeV)

Quote from JedRothwell

Previous experiments with Pd-D cold fusion show that it converts deuterium to helium without significant radiation. So if this is actually cold fusion you would not expect measurable radiation. The laws have not been adjusted to deal with this fact.

Yes, exactly. The laws will have to be changed if there is CF without radiation. But as it is, they forbid nuclear reactions without a license (at least in Sweden, and probably in most countries). Didn't somebody have legal problems when he claimed to produce tritium?

Quote from Wyttenbach

If you like to see a 1 MW boiler go for a swim in a heated basin 50X 20 Meters and afterwards - after a cool down - ask the chief of the bath to show You the heating. They typically use 500kWh units.

Are they replaced when the 500 kWh are used? I think you mean 500 kW or Rossis unit 500 kWh/h.

Quote from Peter Ekstrom

they forbid nuclear reactions without a license (at least in Sweden, and probably in most countries). Didn't somebody have legal problems when he claimed to produce tritium?

As you must know, tritium (unlike deuterium) is beta radioctive and therefore poisonous. So is potassium which is an essential element in our diet. We don't need a licence to eat naturally radio-active vegetables?

Nevertheless you raise a very imortant point. The state must license any nuclear technology. And no authority would risk doing so unless the underlying nuclear science were solid. It follows that all the would be engineers attempting to create ever greater COPs without attempting to understand the science are on the wrong path. And we may also suppose, that those who eventually elucidate the science will have much more success than those who limit themselves to unsubstantiated conjecture. (These very points were made in 2007 at ICCF13 panel discussion).

Quote from JedRothwell

Someone who knows a lot more nuclear physics than I do informs me that you are correct. I had it wrong.

That's the reason why I repeat it again and again that JET, ITER etc. is the work of a bunch of typing monkeys, which suck the most research money ever, spoiled for a ridicoulus approach.
We should focus on bringing this spoiled money into LENR.

Quote from JedRothwell

yet they do see helium commensurate with the heat.

This is extremely weak evidence. There are thousands of conceivable nuclear reactions which could produce helium. But proponents of d-d fusion never consider any alternatives to their preconceived hopes. There are major reasons for supposing that the so called heat / helium ratio as measured is exagerated. Firstly it is NOT clear that there are no other nuclear reactions taking place simultaneously. Secondly it is not clear that all the helium is detected. All we can conclude is that helium is correlated with heat but we have little hint to suppose that any deuterium is involved.

Quote

you are correct. I had it wrong.

Thanks Jed. You have restored your credibility. A major source of misinformation is the continual confusion of conjecture with fact. If we are to escape from this error we need the humility to accept we may be wrong. Well done!

Hermes are You the messengers of ABD ??

Your spin - wrong citing .. surpass all the others.

I can feel Your pains (ITER going down..) as you must see that JED Rothwells position is a disaster for your master...

Quote from JedRothwell

Hermes wrote:

I thought plasma fusion produced 50% 3He, 50% 3H and only 0.00001% 4He. The heat to 4He ratio is about 37000 GeV.

Someone who knows a lot more nuclear physics than I do informs me that you are correct. I had it wrong.

D+D to 4He is a rare branch of plasma fusion. However, for some reason it seems to be the only branch of cold fusion. If you could somehow force plasma fusion into the D+D => 4He branch only, you would get a certain amount of helium per joule of heat. That is how much you get with cold fusion.

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No, the Q-value for d+d-->4He is 23846 keV. For GeV energies you need annihilation with anti-nucleons.
The branch to 4He is indeed very small (it involves the weaker electromagnetic interaction). The deviating branching ratio is still one of the mysteries of CF.

Quote from Wyttenbach

That's the reason why I repeat it again and again that JET, ITER etc. is the work of a bunch of typing monkeys, which suck the most research money ever, spoiled for a ridicoulus approach.
We should focus on bringing this spoiled money into LENR.

Are you the German twin of Siffertroll? This was his main message in the Swedish energikatalysatorn.se!

Quote from Alan Smith

One of Peter Hagelstein's colleagues told me that since they were making Tritium in the lab at SRI they applied for a Tritium License. The official response was along the lines of 'no, you can't have one, you ain't making tritium, it's impossible'.

There are two kinds of LENR, one that produces radiation and tritium and one that does not. What is the difference?

There is a mismatch between the activity level driven by the coupling constant of the strong force as opposed to that of the weak force. As the EMF level increases, the strong force kicks in first before the weak force does. The LENR strong force based reaction begins and produces gamma radiation, neutrons, and tritium, but the weak force LENR reaction is still too enfeebled to thermalize the tritium and suppress the gamma and neutron radiation. As the EMF power density increases through a more vigorous dipole driving mechanism, a sufficiently high activity level is reached in which the weak force begins its radiation normalization function. When this critical transition level is reached, gamma is suppressed, neutrons go away, and tritium is instantaneously thermalized to He3. The x-ray spike that MFMP is seeing is the point were the strong force becomes strong enough to begin nuclear activity, but the weak force is not yet strong enough to mitigate the nuclear radiation being produced by the strong force.

This mismatch between the strong and weak force coupling constant activity levels is evident in cold LENR systems...those systems that are not being driven hard enough to produce sufficient EMF density to activate the full LENR activity levels of both the strong and the weak force.

Quote from Peter Ekstrom

Are you the German twin of Siffertroll? This was his main message in the Swedish energikatalysatorn.se!

Nop!

Everybody (idependet of research money) with a clear mind and in-depth knowledge of the hot-fusion process will come to the same conclusion.

The whole current hot-fusion research is communicated (cheated) to the public, based on the false assumption, that the same (ITER) process is happening in the Sun!

It would be up to You to explain to the public how You would construct the neutron shield (of a production reactor of course) needed to protect the environment. And further on, explain us, how You would build the needed Isotope clean material...(needed for the shield...)
(May be an 'new' LENR reaction may deliver the needed shield material...)