New article about Etiam Oy in Finnish technology magazine

Quote from Alan Smith

That is why I have ordered two 40kHz Transducer/Amplifier kits. Beat Frequencies (Harmonics) R Us.

So You hope of inference/frequency down breaking to happen? Or just crashing of particles with others ?

Part of Soininen's patent application describes the importance of generating local high static electric fields in order to easily split molecular Hydrogen into atomic Hydrogen. Only atomic Hydrogen is able to penetrate metal lattices. Using piezo electric materials (e.g. SiO) having sufficient grain size will generate these electrostatic fields at nanoscale activated by sound waves which in turn cause pressure waves which in will cause mechanical pressure on the piezo electric grains material.

Quote from Alan Smith

The two transducers will not operate at precisely the same 40kHz

.. just wanted to ask/propose... But the energy that goes into higher order inferences usualy is in the low percent figures. But for a trigger it might be enough.
If you like to work with inference I would propose to use one high frequency transducer and a lower one to cover a narrow band with much higher energies. Just in case energy is important.

Alan Smith,

Are you also prepared against ESD-induced damage to your electronics?
...which makes me recall: did not me356 warn of a strange "field" preventing normal measurements like for example with thermocouples? Electrostatic discharges from the reactor will do exactly this, I think.

In 2014 Rossi claimed the presence of pulsing electrostatic fields outside his reactors, for what it's worth:

http://www.journal-of-nuclear-physics.com/?p=853&cpage=7#comment-985189
http://www.e-catworld.com/2014…tic-force-from-the-e-cat/

Alan Smith,

If you have not already played with ultrasonic transducers or randomly moving small particles in general inside your reactors you may have not seen this effect before. In different circumstances, if your vacuum cleaner has PVC piping you might already have felt it while vaccuming certain kinds of dust. In certain cases it can cause visible static discharges. It can be a serious annoyance in wood working dust collector systems, for example:

A system similar to that of Etiam Oy (to return in-topic) or De Bellis which causes particles to rub against each other (or against other reactor components) will, if composed of materials far from each other in the triboelectric series, cause a crackle effect that may be observed and feeled outside the reactor. This alone may not necessarily be a sign of anomalous reaction, but it could be a a trigger for it.

Piezoelectric materials have a generally low "Curie temperature" above which they stop functioning. I am not aware of such a thing for tribocharging (I could be wrong).

Quote from Alan Smith

Hi gameover. You should try machining Acrylic plastic while wearing a Nylon coverall. It's like being a snow-magnet.

I have often experienced something similar with PVC filings. But I have found more annoying (and painful) the static discharges caused by touching the flexible tube for vacuuming PVC particles. Unfortunately I don't remember what kind of material that tube was made of, but I definitely remember it made me think that the effect could have been useful for LENR.

Apropos: judging by the materials used I wonder if Rossi thought the same here:

The source: minute 4:04 here

Quote from Wyttenbach

I recommend to set the particle size into relation with the ultra sound wave length (lamda/2-4) and the sound speed e.g. in Nickel (4900m/s).

Thus 40kHz should only impact clusters of particles.

The other aspect is, where You put the transducer. Full contact with the target medium or is gas/air an intermediate medium? A "slow" medium like air will reduce the wavelength.

Nicel is magnetostrictive, it can do ultrasound alone with B fields. Your idea maybe usable to heater coil efficient frequency. Maybe someone can calculate ready to use tables for particle size function..?

Quote from gameover

In 2014 Rossi claimed the presence of pulsing electrostatic fields outside his reactors, for what it's worth:

I have them too, it listen to radio like gsm phone, but is diffrent. Effect thermocouple heavilly (or reactor have _very_ odd temperature beahavior)

Quote from Alan Smith

kind of 'static' electrical force -which never-used dog-bones did not.

Oh, it can be "moving" too if load/unload energy from reactor. Can feel head, nervous etc. And too much it can do crazy things..

Quote from axil

A global BEC is formed from a entangled connection of many rydberg matter clusters. Rossi forces these clusters to aggregate together though the application of a high voltage(up to 100,000 volts) DC potential. This is produced by the Tao effect. A bright ball lightning type of EMF ball this formed in this way,

Quote from axil

I beleive that the 100,000 volt electrostatic potential driver is an invention that Rossi has come up with and it is unique to Rossi's patent. Rossi has the IP for this LENR trigger locked up.

(I'm replying here to not produce offtopics in the other thread)

Depending on the materials and dynamics, triboelectric effects can normally build up potentials of thousands-tens of thousands of volts. However, according to the method discussed in this thread these would end up in practice (in an exemplary reactor) into a large number of continuously occurring electrostatic *discharges* inside and also outside the reactor. Would this be ok for your working hypothesis? It may be of interest that Van de Graaff generators work with the same triboelectric principle.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_de_Graaff_generator

Quote from Alan Smith

Not when you get past the Curie temp - about 700C for Ni from memory.

Unfortunately for Nickel it's only 627K (according to Wikipedia). That's 354°C.

Quote from Alan Smith

Not when you get past the Curie temp - about 700C for Ni from memory.

Ni curie 334C?, Fe curie 728C?

Run colder reactor. I run them typicall <300C. I have seen XH even near 130C. Only mouse, but I'll find cat someday..

Quote from Alan Smith

Not when you get past the Curie temp - about 700C for Ni from memory.

http://www.lenr-canr.org/acrobat/StringhamRwhenbubble.pdf

Here a link to a 2009 paper (at that time speculative) describing the collapsing event of D₂ bubbles. BEC, super-conduction and Bose-Einstein statistics are mentioned. You will also find reasons why sono-fusion (piezo effect) works at lower Temperatures.

Quote from gameover

(I'm replying here to not produce offtopics in the other thread)

Depending on the materials and dynamics, triboelectric effects can normally build up potentials of thousands-tens of thousands of volts. However, according to the method discussed in this thread these would end up in practice (in an exemplary reactor) into a large number of continuously occurring electrostatic *discharges* inside and also outside the reactor. Would this be ok for your working hypothesis? It may be of interest that Van de Graaff generators work with the same triboelectric principle.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_de_Graaff_generator

Unfortunately for Nickel it's only 627K (according to Wikipedia). That's 354°C.

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Any nature process has a great disadvantage over a operator controlled process. The triboelectric effect is nature process could induce a out of control condition. Rossi has spent years fighting control problems. Rossi has moved from heat control (heater coils) to electrostatic control which has contributed to a more controllable reactor product.

Axil,

Thanks for your opinion. My idea is that an out of control condition is perfectly what we want. Unless you mean no control = no result.

Alan Smith,

I just recalled that according to the published photos the Lugano reactor maybe did not seem to be grounded. Obviously if you want it to build electrostatic charges then you don't want to ground it, and viceversa (usually the opposite is true, see Ball mills). To be sure and if it's safe for you and your equipment when you will receve your ultrasonic transducers and test the Etiam Oy and De Bellis patents (yay back in-topic) try to see if the grounding makes a difference.