JedRothwell : is there any information about the seal material Mizuno-san used?
Rob Woudenberg
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Posts by Rob Woudenberg
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Now the picking question; Dr Mizuno seems to have patented these works with IH, JR doesn't he use potential replicators to give credibility to this patent ?
Good observation!
I have the impression that Industrial Heat is buying the rights on these patent applications from various inventors as a corporate strategy to license them out to interested parties when they become granted and essential. Note that most of them are still in a patent application stage, it could take many years before they become granted or not at all. With the respectable age of some inventors this may be a good deal for them.Some more patents (applications) they (IH) now have in their portfolio:
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General question, I don' t know if already adressed. Is Dr. Mizuno's approach now Open Source since it has been published so openly or is there any patent in the background? Does anyone know?
Here's your answer:
https://patents.google.com/?in…=Tadahiko+Mizuno&sort=newMatching the R20 reactor:
https://patents.google.com/pat…ko+Mizuno&num=50&sort=new
There might be more in the pipeline which are filed but not yet published.
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That M has not experienced meltdown or "saturation" in R20 is a bit surprising and rather goes against the other things he has observed.
Something that has not yet been mentioned here is that absorption of Deuterium by metal lattices is an exothermic process, while releasing of Deuterium by the Pd/Ni lattices is a endothermic process.
I don't have numbers on this process available, but this 'breathing' of Deuterium in a kind of semi-equilibrium may work as a dampening effect towards runaways, in particular where high absorption is never reached. -
He has been replicating this for years. From reactor R16 to R20. Repeatability is excellent. Someone else in Japan already replicated, and reports it is working. Other people need to try this now. People skilled in the art.
I do not think anyone should prepare a reactor, put deuterium into the reactants, and mail the reactor or reactants to anyone. I fear the reactants might self-heat and go out of control. It may be unlikely, but if it happened it could cause a catastrophic accident in an airplane flying from Japan to the U.S. We should not take any chances until this reaction is fully understood. I am confident that the reaction can be made safe and controllable, but that will take billions of dollars of R&D. Right now, mailing prepared and deuterated reactants is like mailing a fully charged battery or a can of gasoline. That's dangerous, and it is against postal regulations.
I'll have a look at Mizuno's previous papers, thanks for pointing out R16 - R20 were replications.
As for transport: one could fill the replicated reactors with Argon during transport and leave the Deuterium loading at the testing site. Debatable, I know.
The big puzzle is how to come to a stage where the outside world can be convinced something serious has been found and that it has been already replicated by several independent sources. If that can be done in a strategic way, professional money will be spend. -
It would probably be useful to have a replica from the Master himself so see how well repeatability is.
Next useful step would be verification by two or more independant labs.
Potential amateur replicators could help sponsoring.
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Does your calculation take into account the twill weave?
Yes!
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That's not a claim it is a fact that a solenoid coil carrying a current creates a magnetic field. You know that to be a given. You also (I hope) know that magnetic field strength drops very rapidly with increasing distance...I advanced the hypothesis based on my own observations that a stronger magnetic field is the cause of the improved cold fusion reaction rate. As you say that can be tested. AC or DC makes no difference to the facts I mentioned, but merely add the frisson of field polarity reversal.
AC or DC makes a difference in case a certain amount of dH/dt (delta electrical magnetic field / delta time) is key as a trigger.
Therefore it may be very relevant whether the heater is AC or DC powered.
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Another observation:
Rubbing the Nickel mesh with Palladium, basically creates a very primitive Ni/Pd alloy with partly Palladium, partly Nickel and partly Nickel-Oxide surface fractions.
I recall a Dutch patent application that was referenced in a patent application of Francisco Celani that deals with optimising Hydrogen absorbing alloys.
Part of this Dutch patent describes that reduction of oxide layer of the less nobel metal surface fractions will hardly reduce if there is a more noble metal fraction present next to such less nobel metal fraction. This mix of nobel metal / oxidised less nobel metal will allow for very easy dissociation of molecular hydrogen by the most nobel metal which then is allowing for large absorption of hydrogen atoms below the surface of the most noble part of the alloy. There might be some similarities here.
(attached the Dutch patent application, unfortunately in Dutch)
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I doubt it has much more surface area than plate, the holes make up for the extra surface of wires I suspect. But you could be right.
Alan, just for the fun of it, I made a surface area calculation based on Jed/Mizuno-san's Nickel mesh specification:
The used mesh:
- wire diameter 0.055 mm -> surface length = Pi * 0.055 mm = 0.1727 mm
- pitch 24.5 / 180 (wires per inch) mm = 0.141111 mm
which gives around 22 % x 22% more surface area compared with a plain sheet.
In total therefore approx. 1.5 times more surface than a sheet.
(under the assumption that wire diameter is given in mm, which seems common looking at some comparable specification sheets)
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I was asked elsewhere about the reason for using mesh instead of plate. This was my answer, which may be of general interest..
'I can think only that the mesh is better for mechanical reasons - the wires make it more abrasive than a smooth plate for a start, with an obvious increase in the ease of burnishing with Pd. The other thing is that the wire is relatively fragile compared to a plate - so the burnishing action with the Pd, as well as stresses cause by the wire-drawing and weaving process might well result in creating a very large number of stress-cracks in the surface.
A matter of more surface
spacearea.
This is why nickel powder was used by some, but nickel powder sinters above 200-300 degree C. -
JedRothwell : Do you know whether Mizuno monitored radiation around this R20 setup?
Likely he did. Would be good to make a remark in the paper to trigger naive replicators. -
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Nickel 200 twill wire mesh, 0.055 x 180 mesh size, size 200 mm x 300 mm, 5 sheets
5 sheets cost $72. Not bad.
Will be difficult for non-Japanese replicators to find out exactly what product to order at that website.
Can you ask Mizuno-san whether he can tell what the purity of this nickel mesh is?
Should probably be 99.5% or so.
Let's hope the fabrication methods of the Nickel wire of these kind of mesh sheets are not too critical. -
I checked my notes, e-mail conversations with Mizuno, and data on this. I do not think he wants deuterium gas added in these steps. I was wrong about that. He pumps down to 10^-2 with the turbomolecular pump. That takes a long time. Still, even at that pressure, there is enough gas coming out to make an accurate measurement with the mass spec. He sometimes waits for a day to if there is more outgassing, and then heats and pumps some more. He keeps checking for H2O.
I think he also adds D2 and then purges it. Ed Storms and others have done this. But that is a separate procedure. I will ask him if he recommends doing that. It should be at a low pressure if it is done.
Ok. This may be a consideration for replicators 'skilled in the art' :).
I agree, the paper should reflect exactly what Mizuno-san's current procedures are. -
I made some minor changes to the paper and uploaded a new version. Biggest change, p. 12:
Rubbing is done with a palladium rod, 100 mm long, diameter 5.0 mm, 99.95% purity. Before rubbing the mesh, weight it with a precision scale. Then vigorously rub the entire surface, left and right and up and down. Turn the mesh over and rub the other side. Weigh the mesh again. Continue until the weight increases by ~50 mg.
Some people say the images are blurry. I will check the Acrobat settings.pag. 17, after cleaning, between bullets (1) and (2) still requires mentioning insertion of Deuterium gas, preferably indicating at what gas pressure.
Sorry for nagging Jed, but this helps the paper to be student proof. -
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People are asking good questions. Here's one:
Q: How long should I rub the mesh?
A: Until the weight increases by ~50 mg.
I will add this and some other stuff to the paper soon.
Jed, I assume this is related to rubbing with Palladium. It might be good to emphasise that.
Rubbing for cleaning wil decrease the weight, so this might be confusing. -
Oops. We should have made it clear that deuterium gas is the only thing that goes into the cell after it is pumped out the first time.
Ah, ok, that is missing information, so patching up the paper with that detail will mature it. Thanks!
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Yes. As noted it is very important to purge oxygen before beginning the tests. See steps 1 - 7 where it says "After cleaning."
Jed, steps 1 - 6 (after cleaning) do not include the presence of Deuterium gas which is required to reduce any remaining nickel oxide into pure Nickel and D2O at raised temperature.
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Great news and remarkable simple method.
Even with the current described nickel mesh preparation I would expect that with the first run with Deuterium gas at 100 - 300 degree C some remaining surface Nickel oxide will be reduced while forming small amount of D2O which preferably needs to be evacuated as well. Just a minor thing I guess, but maybe this is why a bigger reactor vessel performs better.
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I am quite pleased to see Sindre Zeiner-Gundersen is replicating and proceeding with the works of Leif Holmlid.
Behind the scenes there may be also be quite some activities in this area by others (even at confidential government levels).
