That is completely illogical. Can you give a reference to what the IH investor said? Can you show that the IH investor invested in IH?
I will do your legwork for you just this one time
I was wrong about Rossi, but what I fear most is that I might be partly right
Ah, ha. The Florida boiler safety division web site is working again. Let me start a new thread with some links to it.
Here is one. You can look for Rossi's equipment here. You will not find it:
You can look for Rossi's equipment here. You will not find it:
should read
You can look for IH's equipment here. You will not find it:
I am at a loss for words that you are having to explain these rudimentary points that we were taught in grade school...on a forum about cold fusion. FACEPALM!!!
All you good old boys are intentionally misallocating responsibility to Rossi when IH was in control and was calling all the shots. Rossi may have help IH out because of their unsurpassed stupidity in order to get himself paid but that does not confer any testing setup responsibility onto him.
You seem to have no grasp of the law or how business is conducted. When an employee in a company defrauds the company, the company is not at fault. The police arrest the person who defrauded the company, not the company president or officers.
For example, when a bank teller embezzles money from the bank, they arrest the teller, not the bank president. (This seldom happens nowadays thanks to computers.)
It was IH's test and IH staffed that test, and IH required that the ERV be employed in the licence agreement, so IH is responsible for the behavior of its contractors.
That is completely illogical. Can you give a reference to what the IH investor said? Can you show that the IH investor invested in IH?
It is the investor that IH got 50 million from.
Someone who can write in PDP-11 assembly language probably has the ability to read the Law. This looks like an attempt at astroturfing. The usual ad hominem attack.
If you have ever written PDP-11 assembly language, you would know calling such a programer an expert speaks to his highest intelligence. Jed is no dummy.
That little jab there would imply YOU are a lawyer Axil...you are just on a roll today man! lol
No, that is just a taste of what Jed usually gives to me. Jed is very good in debates, a verbal jujitsu master; he knows all the tricks, turnarounds, and misdirections.
It is not that secret. Dewey Weaver discussed it here. They looked for heat coming out of the vent, and did not see it. It is very easy to detect 1 MW of heat, in the form of hot air or steam. If you have read his messages, you know as much about this as I do.
(You may doubt what he says, but I am sure it is true. Although I do not know anything more than he said, I do have some independent confirmation.)
If the machine input 20 kW and output 100 kW, that would not be so easy to detect.
Then the ERV must have been a fraud, but the ERV worked for IH, so IH must have also been and is a fraud.
One should be even more wary when the good doctor comes through town selling his new snake oil. It comes in a tiny 1mm vial but cures ALL ailments...true magnificence!
This is true, Rossi makes his living by milking VCs. Rossi said as much in this blog. The VCs know what they are getting into and accept the risk.
Ah! The fallacy of arguing from personal incredulity! How do you know that additional funding was secured by this test? Is it not equally possible that IH, demonstrated a failed test and obtained funding for other programs in recognition of their scrupulous honesty? And how do you know that IH obtained any funding at all? What is your evidence?
I know because the IH investor said they did their due diligence before they invested in the E-Cat.
It does not work that way. The company that rents or owns the property and operates the equipment is responsible. Even when you rent equipment you still have to ensure it is certified for operation. If that were not the case, industrial companies that cause accidents would be able to escape responsibility by pointing the finger at the equipment vendors and places that rent equipment.
I used to work in a factory, where I filed insurance claims for industrial accidents and dealt with state safety regulators. I am 100% sure that is how the law works. There was rented equipment there, but the company was responsible.
Rossi did not rent the property, the shell company created for IH did; A company created solely for the test. IH approved this deal because that is the way that IH likes to play. That company no longer exists as is IH's modus operandi.
Jed: "The law does not work that way."
I thought that you were a PDP-11 assembly language expert and not a lawyer.
I.H. may have been idiotic then but they seem to be doing a pretty good job now. The situation with Rossi is awful but I have heard that some of their other projects are going well. Perhaps they have learned from experience.
Once bitten, twice shy. I would be very wary of IH and their claims.
This has nothing to do with the contract or license agreement between Rossi and I.H. It is a legal requirement for operating equipment in Florida. If Rossi's gadget actually produced 1 MW, both he his pretend company were in violation of the law. However, I am sure it did not produce more than 20 kW, so there is no problem.
Then IH should face the consiqences of the violation, IT WAS THEIR TEST AND THEIR REACTOR.
A Red Herring is a fallacy in which an irrelevant topic is presented in order to divert attention from the original issue. The basic idea is to "win" an argument by leading attention away from the argument and to another topic. This sort of "reasoning" has the following form:
Topic A is under discussion.
Topic B is introduced under the guise of being relevant to topic A (when topic B is actually not relevant to topic A).
Topic A is abandoned.
This test proved the E-cat does not work at all. Multiple reactors were tested, and they were all "inoperable." Meaning they produced no heat. Rossi's own data showed that. Therefore the reactor is no good for a commercial setting, or any other setting.
I realize you do not believe that, but you have no information and therefore no basis to judge. You have pointed to your own intuition. If your intuition is of any use, please tell us what sort of flow meter is being used, and why I.H. and I think it is getting the wrong answer. If your magical ESP intuition cannot tell us anything about the flow meter, it is useless.
I cannot beleive that IH would let the test proceed in silence for an entire year and also use it to secure additional R&D funding claiming... stellar, stellar, stellar.
Jed:
QuoteYes. Various Google searches and checks of the Florida government records make this seem likely. I have not dug deeply, but others who have told me this. For example, there does not appear to be any record of inspection or certification of large industrial equipment. Here is a good place to start a search for Florida corporations:
I don't beleive that this "inspection or certification" was required by the contract or the licence agreement.
If it is illegal, then IH is responsible since it is their reactor.
So that I have this right Axil, I take your comments to mean that....even were the 1MW test proved to be a bust, that you still wish, hope that IH has to pay merely because the contract says: "if the ERV determines the test a success, IH pays the remaining $89 million"?
Sadly, that is the way I read it. Not that it matters, because as MY and Frank mention, the contract would then be invalidated. Still though, it shows your passions lie more with punishing big corporations for some perceived wrongdoing, than with whether or not the Ecat works.
It is not what I like or don't like' it is not what is fair or unfair, it is how the case will be decided under the current indeterminate status of LENR in society. LENR is so weird, complicated, and incomprehensible, the court will fall back on what it knows, the contract and the laws that apply to contracts. At this juncture, the court cannot tell you is the E-Cat works. If you think the court can, you are delusional.
If Rossi can get a LENR reactor on the market over the next 442 days, that validation of the technology will make all the difference.
The term "whether or not the Ecat works" is an oversimplification of a complex situation. One issue that is concerning about the E-Cat's status for commercial use is the reason why Rossi had to live inside those shipping containers for a year. Can the E-Cat run unattended with an ignorant immigrant operator passing by it one a shift on his way to the rest room? How reliable will it be, how available will it be, what is the mean time between failure, what is the time required to repair?
"whether or not the Ecat works" in a commercial setting is a very complicated issue that was not determined by that test, The test just was intended to check over the long term COP => 4 and steam production, that is it.
Rossi used the test to check out other things that interested him in his road to commercialization but had no bearing on payment for assured performance. Your simplified view of what works is affecting your understanding of my motives. I am just interested in the truth and am trying to get to it by using clear thinking and logic.
Penon does appear to be Rossi's lap dog. I have not met him but based on his previous report and this data, I think he is stupid. He is not qualified to do HVAC measurements. The ERV data and configuration show that he and Rossi are either unqualified, or they were trying to foist a crude fraud onto I.H. to collect $89 million.
Looking at only the data, you cannot judge whether they are incompetent or frauds. However, based on the fact that they hid the fake customer site from the I.H. experts, I think they are frauds.
If all this is fact, then IH is outrageously stupid and incompetent. The buck stops at the feet of IH for the results of all this stupidity and in a just world IH must reap the whirlwind of this stupidity.
NONSENSE! As usual, you confuse CLAIMS for FACTS. You're completely incorrigible.
"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."
Jed wrote: "He [Rossi] stole $11 million, and you blame I.H. for getting upset with him!" Last I heard, Rossi is the one suing IH - not the other way around.
Jed lives in a topsy turvy world where reality is discombobulated.
