I'd like to think that if solar energy was real all sunny countries would use lots of solar panels.
In Spain for example people can't afford them because of the taxation. Instead they purchase cheaper gas and fission energy from the grid.
Jed Rothwell on an Unpublished E-Cat Test Report that “Looks Like it Worked”
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I offer you a nice example; Reifenschweiler is a scientist largely known in the cold fusion world. Instead for IAEA and BNL the "Refeinschweiler effect" doesn't exist at all. Cold fusion and Generally Accepted Science seem to belong to different worlds. Try yourself.
As Italian, I am interested in Italian scientists working in cold fusion, say Celani, Violante, Levi, Rossi. For EXFOR they do not even exist. You can find their names only in Rothwell's collection.
What you've alluded to is that the establishment physicists are ignoring LENR research. One cannot draw more than indirect conclusions about the quality of all LENR research on that basis. And more specifically, this has little to do with whether the conditions for the experiments tabulated in EXFOR are comparable to the conditions that apply to many LENR experiments. Perhaps you are not interested in any of this more than through the connection of some Italian scientists that have gotten caught up in it. That is fine. Other people will look at the LENR experiments themselves and consider them on their merits. -
@Eric Walker
QuoteWhat you've alluded to is that the establishment physicists are ignoring LENR research. One cannot draw more than indirect conclusions about the quality of all LENR research on that basis.
Ignoring? I would say "rejecting". In Pisa I have visited an exhibition entitled "Balle di Scienza", lies of science. Cold fusion was among them. I have been told that in Bologna University students meow at the back of Prof. Levi. He has possibly killed his own career. Italian Universities aren't practising cold fusion since the end of 1989. They were interested only a few months after F&P's outing in March 1989.
Anyway, we can try together to get some GA information about lenr. If you like, you can choose five of them and I can plot here their excitation function. -
In Pisa I have visited an exhibition entitled "Balle di Scienza", lies of science. Cold fusion was among them.
Well then, based on that evidence, cold fusion must be a lie.
I have been told that in Bologna University students meow at the back of Prof. Levi.Meow? I suppose that isn't too bad considering the primitive language skills of most students.
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@Eric Walker
[quote]I have been told that in Bologna University students meow at the back of Prof. Levi. He has possibly killed his own career.If such is in fact the case Prof. Levi is the most noble of selfless heroes who stands with Galileo, Pons, and Fleischman as the paragons of human achievement.
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I have been told that in Bologna University students meow at the back of Prof. Levi.
Meow, as in e-CAT? Oh, that's hilarious. And he never had a career. Last I looked, he was still an assistant professor after >15 years. He was not principal author on any real scientific paper, most papers he co-authored has dozens of authors, and his main work seemed to be in the field of coffee brewing. And he clearly has no idea what a calibrated and controlled experiment is. Controlled as in using control runs (so-called dummy runs) and blanks.
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Well then, based on that evidence, cold fusion must be a lie.
Sponsors of the exhibition "Balle di Scienza" were:
Ministero dell'Istruzione, dell'Università e della Ricerca,
Istituto Nazionale di Fisica Nucleare
Università di Pisa
Scuola Normale Superiore di Pisa
Domus Galileiana
Others
http://www.palazzoblu.it/index.php?id=857&lang=it
At present the exhibition is hosted by the University of Catania. -
I am only trying to give information on the scientific allure of cold fusion on Italian researchers. Perhaps only Celani, Violante and their teams are working on it. Big organisations often keep long lasting activities. Universities have been silent for many years, as far as I know. But it is only a modest opinion of a retired chemist; I don't know very much about Italian cold fusion. Bologna? Catania? Palermo? Who knows. I think that Ascoli65 is much more informed than me.
A member of the Italian parliament launched an interrogation pro cold fusion in 2013; the interrogation is still unanswered! A woman minister from Pisa told me that this is common practice when interrogations are not duly supported. -
Lock at R.Stringhams papers.
Read again, Stringham wrote, "At this time we cannot afford to look for the products of Qxproduction- the expensive analysis of helium". The fact that Stringham may hope that helium is produced, does not prove he produced it. You need to read papers more carefully.
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Mary
Why do we have to continue repeating that if high power LENR were real, a few critics and skeptics on obscure forums couldn't impact it any more than impact with a bee would stop a 747 in flight.
So you acknowledge low power LENR, but then I think you always have. You know what they say - the turbulence from a butterflies wings could be the catalyst for large scale atmospheric disturbances the other side of the globe. Well you may be right about many things you say but questions need to be answered not buried under a pile of ad homs.
Best regards
Frank -
Why ? What is your point ? You don't like Sigmund Freud as a person and don't trust psychology or you feel bad that a "shrink" is reading your posts ? BTW by your avatar communicate many things about you. (Note that is the only "negative" avatar in that forum.)
Have you ever thought to ask help for your problem ?
Hello Sigmund,
no, nothing against psychology though it is rather psychoanalysis you are good at. I disliked the part when you said "we know who you are George" because it sounded like a threat, and well illustrated by Freud's severe eyebrow. Why is it "we", do you write on behalf of a group?
If you are associated to the parties involved in the lawsuit I can understand your hostility to MY, but his identity is known to everybody in this small community of aficionados, so no big deal.
Mine is also known or easily found, I just use an abbreviation to avoid being associated to the ecat in google searches. But I am flattered that you read my posts. The avatar is simple self-irony: the donkeycap is what I will wear when Rossi's claims are proven true. -
Read again, Stringham wrote, "At this time we cannot afford to look for the products of Qxproduction- the expensive analysis of helium". The fact that Stringham may hope that helium is produced, does not prove he produced it. You need to read papers more carefully.
Obviously You only read one paper, which I flaged with no helium measure... Keep FUD for You please!
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Mary
Meow, as in e-CAT? Oh, that's hilarious.
And that is relevant because....?
'First they ignore you. Then they laugh at you. Then they attack you. Then you win.' - Mohandas Gandhi
Best regards
Frank -
Frankwtu,
Thanks for your thumbs up, it speaks for your openness to an honest debate. I may have an irritating icon, but I for example dislike those making fun of Levi. I think as a lead author he has made mistakes, and made things worse by dismissing all criticism, but he is far from stupid. I would welcome with interest a paper by him addressing the debated topics and demolishing critiques one by one with the data he has and chose not to share. -
Why would a researcher in a fringe domain publish all data, when they know a thousand Thomas Clarkes and Mary Yugos will spend their sponsored shilling time obfuscating it, drowning discussion with side issues, and using all their sad rhetoric tools to smear their character, reputation, and even mental health?
You cannot debate dishonest trolls who only seek to make you mad and portray you as a fool.As always people seem to forget the elephants in the room when discussing why "fringe" scientists do not try to convince others in debate: those elephants being character assassination through social engineering, and tech suppression by threats or even murder, at the behest of unsavory interests.
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andrea.s
You are welcome. My key concern is the preponderance of ad homs masquerading as legitimate criticism in the absence of verifiable observation and fact. Where proper discovery is proposed absent of the FUD and ad homs I will support it wholeheartedly and have given the thumbs up to Mary, Jed and Thomas Clarke in the past. So for me its all about being honest, honourable and objective in the pursuit of knowledge.
I have no idea whether Rossi's devices or anybody else's devices work or not, but I do not think it is helpful to make fun of people for expressing their views, and particularly unhelpful when reputation traps appear to be constructed by individuals often having the 'appearance' of a concerted approach. Ad homs ad infinitum, I dislike em.
Best regards
Frank -
@Eric Walker
QuoteWhat you've alluded to is that the establishment physicists are ignoring LENR research
Jed Rothwell quotes this article by Reifenschweiler:
Some Experiments on the Decrease of the Radioactivity of Tritium Sorbed by Titanium
I can't find the article in IAEA and other national data bank, so I immediately reject the article as nuclear trash. Do you think I am too demanding? In fact I am demanding, as Jed Rothwell is graduated in Japanese language and literature and can't exhibit the authority of an international or national data bank. Nobody would learn nuclear science mediated by an amateur scientist.
Perhaps it is only my fault if I can't find Reifenschweiler's article. I know my own limits and I'll appreciate the help coming from anyone. -
You only read one paper, which I flaged with no helium measure...
Sorry my mistake!
Stringham carries out his research at home so I was surprised to know that he managed to measure any helium at all. In fact he collaborated with LANL.It was good to see they was looking for 3He at the same time as 4He. But they assumed, that all 3He was derived from tritium decay - is that right? I wonder what would have been measured with a 50% D:H ratio?
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Ignoring? I would say "rejecting". In Pisa I have visited an exhibition entitled "Balle di Scienza", lies of science. Cold fusion was among them.
Display MoreSponsors of the exhibition "Balle di Scienza" were:
Ministero dell'Istruzione, dell'Università e della Ricerca,
Istituto Nazionale di Fisica Nucleare
Università di Pisa
Scuola Normale Superiore di Pisa
Domus Galileiana
Others
palazzoblu.it/index.php?id=857&lang=it
At present the exhibition is hosted by the University of Catania.
Wow! So, this would be an argument for demonstrating that the Italian political and research establishments reject Cold Fusion. Wouldn't it?At best, it can be used for stating that in Italy the CF is considered a lie in the even years (in 2014 and 2016, local exhibitions in Pisa and Catania), but deserved the highest considerations in the odd ones:
2013 – A well known parliamentary Representative, which is also President of the House Commission on Environment Affairs, presented an inquiry to the Ministry of Education aiming to further promote the research on LENR in Italy, on the basis of the excess heat (EXCESS HEAT, Cam-illo, not nuclear stuff!) detected by Italian scientists working at public institute (1): "è stata rilevata una «produzione» di eccesso di calore con densità di potenza elevatissime, superiori per ordini di grandezza a quelle delle ordinarie reazioni chimiche, esplosive incluse, quindi di grande potenzialità per le applicazioni energetiche; l'elevata densità di potenza faceva proclamare, fin dai primi scopritori, essere quelle che avvenivano nella cella reazioni di fusione a temperatura ambiente, la «fusione fredda» (FF)." (Please, use Google for translation.)
2015 - The ICCF19 Conference was held in Padua under the Patronage of (2):
- Presidenza del Consiglio dei Ministri (Prime Minister)
- Ministero dello Sviluppo Economico (Ministery for Economic Develompment)
- ENEA (Italian National Agency for New Technologies, Energy and Sustainable Economic Development)
- CNR (National Research Council of Italy)
- Others
The INFN (Istituto Nazionale di Fisica Nucleare) was also represented by a work of Celani.This is a quite surreal situation, similar to the one in USA, where the DoE deemed the CF/LENR not suitable to be funded, while the DoD has been its major funder throughout a quarter of century. Guess why.
Or, maybe, do you think that at DoE, they are able to properly consult EXFOR (at least at the same your unusual high level of skill), while at DoD, they are not so familiar with nuclear stuff, so that no one there has ever heard of such an archive or any other nuclear data bank? Do you also believe that in the Italian scientific institutes, the EXFOR archive is accessible only in the odd years?
(1) http://banchedati.camera.it/sindacatoispettivo_17/showXhtml.asp?highLight=0&idAtto=7370
(2) http://www.iccf19.com/home.html -
Jed Rothwell quotes this article by Reifenschweiler:
Some Experiments on the Decrease of the Radioactivity of Tritium Sorbed by Titanium
I can't find the article in IAEA and other national data bank, so I immediately reject the article as nuclear trash. Do you think I am too demanding?
I think it's fine to have high standards. I am not familiar with Reifenschweiler's work, so I can't comment on it. Jed does a service by including a broad range of papers on lenr-canr.org, without weighing in too much on the quality of the papers, as that is something for others to judge. There are many LENR papers written by hobbyists that are poorly written and/or that make the most implausible suggestions. This is something entirely different, by the way, from saying that all LENR papers are like this. I recommend looking at the experimental papers of some of the better experimentalists — McKubre, Miles, Storms, and so on. You might not miss much if you ignored all LENR theory papers entirely. But even among the experimental papers, there are many bad studies as well. This is the state of the field. It is for the person looking into the truth of the matter to sift the wheat from the chaff. Or think of it as panning for gold, looking for a few flecks of gold hiding in a lot of sand.Nobody would learn nuclear science mediated by an amateur scientist.
I would be careful with this assumption! Someone more knowledgeable about the history of science might even be able to provide a list of countexamples. Qualifications are important and helpful, but there's no substitute for looking into the truth of the matter oneself.
