Flow meter used in 1-MW test


    Most of the Defkalion/AirBus tech is not patentable, it is open source as AirBus will eventually find out.


    It took the US government 25 years to field a nuclear fission reactor that did not melt down. Do you not understand how hard it is to work with and passively control nuclear energy?

    Quote from axil

    [quote='Bob','https://www.lenr-forum.com/forum/index.php/Thread/3569-Flow-meter-used-in-1-MW-test/?postID=32191#post32191'][quote='axil','https://www.lenr-forum.com/forum/index.php/Thread/3569-Flow-meter-used-in-1-MW-test/?postID=32072#post32072'][quote]
    ......


    It took the US government 25 years to field a nuclear fission reactor that did not melt down. Do you not understand how hard it is to work with and passively control nuclear energy?


    I was a physics major in college, but have not worked in the field (rather elected engineering instead) So I have some concept of the requirements of working with thermo-nuclear temperatures, radiation, pressures, etc. ... Oh wait! We were talking about LENR! Let's see, temperatures of 1500 C or below. Pressures of a few atmosphere's. No ionizing radiation (to speak of.) Uh. Parkomov did it on his living room couch! (At least the experiment!) =O


    The lack of understanding LENR / CF appears to make it very hard to replicate or initiate on demand. However, comparing it to thermo-nuclear fission would show a lack of understanding of the operating conditions required. The apparent equipment required for LENR is miniscule compared to fission.


    I do not agree with your counter point that Defkalion dropped off the radar because it would take many years to develop the Hyperion. Perhaps I misunderstood your point? My apologies if I did.

    Quote from Bob

    I was a physics major in college, but have not worked in the field (rather elected engineering instead) So I have some concept of the requirements of working with thermo-nuclear temperatures, radiation, pressures, etc. ... Oh wait! We were talking about LENR! Let's see, temperatures of 1500 C or below. Pressures of a few atmosphere's. No ionizing radiation (to speak of.) Uh. Parkomov did it on his living room couch! (At least the experiment!) =O


    The lack of understanding LENR / CF appears to make it very hard to replicate or initiate on demand. However, comparing it to thermo-nuclear fission would show a lack of understanding of the operating conditions required. The apparent equipment required for LENR is miniscule compared to fission.


    I do not agree with your counter point that Defkalion dropped off the radar because it would take many years to develop the Hyperion. Perhaps I misunderstood your point? My apologies if I did.

    Quote

    I do not agree with your counter point that Defkalion dropped off the radar because it would take many years to develop the Hyperion. Perhaps I misunderstood your point? My apologies if I did.


    I heard that there were major health issues among the principles and their families. I don't know if any deaths resulted and then there was a lack of R&D funding.

    Quote from stephenrenzz

    JedRothwell wrote:
    Flow rate: 36,000 kg (same every day)



    JED: According to IH Penon, for many days, reported 0.75 MW equal 27m3 steam. Was he lieing about this 27m3 steam flow... Or is IH lieing about this? Or are You lieing...


    Rossi and I.H. both said the flow rate was 36,000 kg, and this is what is shown in Rossi's data. Where did Penon report 27 m^3?

    • Official Post
    Quote from axil

    I heard that there were major health issues among the principles and their families. I don't know if any deaths resulted and then there was a lack of R&D funding.


    Alex the boss had heart trouble that flared up while they were in Canada and went back to Greece for surgery. Around about the same time (from memory) first one then another key staff member bailed claiming stress. Not surprising, since the company had a novel way of motivating staff, which boiled down to initially offering splendid terms of engagement and then not paying them any salaries. The promise of 'jam tomorrow' was what sustained them and motivated them to seek a way of making the 50% of Rossi know-how they managed to incorporate actually work. And, they were promised, then you will get paid.


    Which they never did. Or get paid.


    This information came direct from a former employee btw, who wishes to remain anonymous. Because he feels it makes him look stupid.

    I just played a round of "historic Rossi photo find-the-water-meter".
    Not pretty. I don't know that there are any photos with the meter in the recommended position.
    It doesn't explain the >COP 1 ones without water.
    But adding water does seem to make multiples of the normally lower non-water COPs.
    Sigh....

    Quote from Alan Smith

    .....


    Alex the boss had heart trouble that flared up while they were in Canada and went back to Greece for surgery. Around about the same time (from memory) first one then another key staff member bailed claiming stress.
    ........


    This information came direct from a former employee btw, who wishes to remain anonymous. Because he feels it makes him look stupid.


    I would not wish anyone ill health. Heart problems are common and stress can be bad. I must ask though, any rumor of "unusual sickness" that might have resulted from testing? I am not attempting to imply anything here, just an honest, curious question.


    Your post indicates other than the heart issue, most left because of non-payment which is entirely understandable. Did they give you any indication of what they thought of the technology?
    It worked / was interesting but not proven / complete BS? I find it very interesting that you have a direct source of info. I would like to have heard some of the conversations you might have had! When I followed Defkalion some, they seemed to have more going for them than Rossi. An actual team, not a one man show. Some of their drawings and schematics seemed more logical or "likely" to be real. Prof. Kim from Purdue seemed to support them. Not that Defkalion had no red flags, they indeed did. But early on, seemed less so than Rossi.


    What is your take on them since you have some inside sources? Real Deal? Possible device but ran out of money? Did some talk but could not walk the walk? Complete BS?


    Thank you.

    @Bob


    Quote

    I find it very interesting that you have a direct source of info.


    Some unpublished info


    DGT: "To save some of your searching on the last (ABs metal hydrides)
    LaNiH5 and LiAlH6, 30/70 usually.
    Starts H2 1st (out of 3) production reaction at 150C with rather good reverse performance.
    Less is more!"


    "LaNiH5 and LiAlH6, 30/70 " This is the secret sauce that DGT might have used in the R6 reactor.



    Quote

    DGT: ... (see also our ICCF18 paper, future work).
    Light knots are the result of such productive chaos. They are created by the strong magnetic fields created (not external) after Rydberg clusters collapse. Equilibrium is an exception in nature.


    These light Knots are the same that Fabiani has commented on that he saw melt down Rossi's computer.


    IMHO, it is unlikely that two independent scam scenarios would be invented by two independent inventors observing such a weird common reaction mechanism. ERGO, both the Rossi and DGT systems have/had a similar or identical LENR reaction mechanism going.

    Jed:

    Quote

    I guess he knows how to con people.


    Better than that, he knows how to choose which people to con. That is his greatest strength, in my opinion.


    Quote

    It is even possible at times he knew how to make excess heat. I cannot rule that out.


    Exquisitely unlikely at best. But of course one can't rule it out unless one saw every experiment, took data, etc. etc. and even then, there could be something you didn't see. But that's not how people make decisions about scientific matters. It's on the "preponderance" of the evidence and that says Rossi has nothing and never had anything. If he ever did, then his actions since then are an unholy combination of folly and insanity.

    Quote

    I heard that there were major health issues among the principles and their families. I don't know if any deaths resulted and then there was a lack of R&D funding.


    Of course there was lack of funding. All Hadjichristos did was lie! Or do really think that seven of the world's largest companies successfully tested Hyperion reactors? (April 2012 if memory serves -- anyway it's in the forum archives which are preserved by several people). Only Xanthoulis, I believe, became ill. There was nothing wrong, far as I know, with that arrogant, unpleasant and consistent liar, Hadjichristos.


    Talking about funding... Dick Smith, the billionaire, was ready to give Defkalion a million dollars for some reasonable number of shares. But he required an independent test by some suitable test lab chosen and paid for by him. And of course, Defkalion refused. Instead, they wanted Smith to go to them to witness THEIR tests. Smith was smart enough (with good advice from several people) to withdraw. That is the sort of event which caused their funds shortage. They had nothing, proved nothing, and lied to everyone.


    They claimed multiple times in the forum and at various open presentations that they had multi kW reactors working at will on desktops, stable and ready for production. And then, we all know how they tried to fool their distributor and prevent him from doing his own proper tests. If indeed they had had kW reactors as they said, there would never have been a problem with funding. It was all lined up. All they had to was produce what they claimed and they never could. That is why I call them liars. And they were duplicitous and heinous liars.


    That last part is about the supposed "test" they offered to have me do with some associates I assembled. (that whole discussion is on Peter Gluck's blog... somehow Peter never seems to write about it) Hadjichristos lied. He never meant for the test to take place. He was such a liar, he would never meet a Canadian physics professor I sent him to plan for tests, nor would he meet with Henning Dekant in their offices in Toronto. Liar liar liar. Pant on fire. I was ready to meet every condition he had placed on the test and he knew that. I made it abundantly clear. Flippin' jackass!

    Quote from Wyttenbach

    Where did Penon report 27 m^3?



    Exhibit 18! It went into the command to bill...


    You are confused. First, that was Johnson, not Penon. Second, he is reporting megawatt-hours, not the flow rate. The flow rate might remain at 36,000 kg/day while megawatt-hours change. If megawatt hours increase, the temperature goes up.


    Anyway, the information from Johnson was bogus. It was made up. There were no megawatt hours delivered to the pretend customer site, because no heat was detected coming out of it. There was no machine there. It was an idiotic attempt at fraud, which fooled no one.

    Quote from Mary Yugo

    It's on the "preponderance" of the evidence and that says Rossi has nothing and never had anything.


    Ah, but other people tested his device when he was not there, using their own instruments. It seems they detected excess heat. I cannot be sure, but it might be true. So even if Rossi's own tests were all failures or invalid, it might still be real.


    If scientists always dismissed claims with the preponderance of evidence against them, a large fraction of discoveries and breakthroughs in history would have been rejected. Many were rejected at first, some for years. So what you say is factually wrong, unscientific, and it would impede progress. Your mantra here is, in fact, the opposite of how science is supposed to work. When evidence conflicts, we do not hold a popularity contest. We look for new evidence, or we reserve judgement. We make no decision either way. You seem to be constitutionally incapable of doing that. You have some built-in urge to rush to judgement and jump to the first conclusion you can, especially a negative conclusion. You are the opposite of a skeptic in the true sense of the word "skeptic." You are desperate to believe.

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