I guess IO's claim is more credible than my flying animals.
seven_of_twenty
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Posts by seven_of_twenty
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Reductio ad absurdum
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But, hey!!! Why are you so surprised? And why so agitated? Just a couple of minutes ago you wrote in another thread that it was actually your prefered strategy to harass (more or less) everyone connected to Rossi!!! So in my opinion you're successfull! Aren't you happy?
It isn't terribly likely to happen but I'd be happy if Rossi were back in prison again, where he belongs. Your point was?
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Well, "wait and see" could be the answer of course.
What was the question it could be the answer to?
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It is, because our Clients like not to be harassed, at least for the time being. Otherwise they would not ask for an NDA.
Same bovine excrement as Rossi pushed out in 2011. One thing the Rossi crowd is good at: recycling garbage. And apparently that sh*t still smells sweet to the Acland and Lewan crowd. Levi, on the other hand, far as is known, has been very quiet as have the "Swedish scientists" who originally tried to reproduce Rossi's hot cat claims.
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I see. On what grounds is he reporting Rossi? Does he have any other indications of possible wrongdoings than "Rossi says"?
Operating a nuclear reactor without inspection, proper zoning and license for starters. Possibly having an illegal and unlicensed source of radioactivity. Claiming a false doctorate. Claiming to be practicing as an engineer when he has no Florida license or certification to do it. Claiming false or irrelevant safety certifications. And the list goes on. Those are just off the top from memory. There are more.
QuoteAnd man... are you suggesting professors talking about Rossi should be somehow be punished?
Who ever said that? But professors should be prevented from "teaching" complete fraudulent bullshit to students. No problem if they want to discuss Rossi. But the individual in question listed Rossi's claims as definitive and real in a course syllabus. That's not OK because he's promoting a fraud and a con to vulnerable students who respect him.
QuoteIt sounds a lot like you advocate a systems of informants used by Stasi in former DDR and in other communist dictatorships? Wow!
Not worthy of a comment.
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Meanwhile, Tom Whipple continues to promote Rossifiction and I suppose, censoring responses as usual.
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I amazed at how some people just don't "get it." Here is the line in question again, slightly changed to show the relevant part:
if you believe that [Rossi might have something] at this point, I think you should be ready to invest in:
(name an implausible invention) like
- gravity cancelling machines
- magnetic motors
- HHO gas powering cars from water
- Noble gas engines
and yes, flying elephants if you don't like pigs. At least the elephants can flap their ears to make overunity energy.
Gullible is what gullible does, to paraphrase a bit.
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So what do you suggest should be done instead of "wait and see"?
What someone else is in fact doing. He's reporting Rossi's claimed activities to the Florida regulatory authorities because those activities, if remotely like what is claimed, are wildly illegal and unsafe. In addition, this person is taking to task with university authorities, one or more professors who apparently "teach" undergraduates what Rossi claims as fact.
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"Both Rossi and R. Mills have the same challenge in converting
XUVpower from the mains into usable energy. Mills is struggling with it big time."TIFIFY
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The point was about how gullible some people have to be so as to still believe Rossi "may have something". It was not, as you state, about flying pigs.
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The post was edited 1 time, last by Shane D.: Post moved for being unoriginal (16 hours ago). — This post has previous versions that are saved.
Shame on me for being unoriginal. I so embarrassed be. BTW, no rational person would say there is a possibility of Rossi producing a working device now or in the future. There has never been such a possibility for any clear thinking individual since October of 2011.
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Assuming the performance was real, he did seem to have problems controlling them. They would not be suitable for commercial use as is. They needed more work. But the (apparent) performance was good enough to attract billions of dollars in funding for R&D.
How in the world would you know that? Rossi certainly never complained of it. And because he had no real customers ever, none of those did either. Rossi was claiming to be selling megawatt plants for nearly a decade. You'd think any control problems would have been settled between his supposed (and fictitious) contracts with National Instruments and Siemens and his fantasmagoric robotic factories!
There would be enough value in a working but not commercially sellable ecat making kilowatts from trivial amounts of fuel to make an army rich for life. Commercial use would be worked out by investors' companies and entrepreneurs. Like with everything else!
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So let me try a little logic here. If the credibility of LENR is damaged by the willingness of some of the internet's people...
A misunderstanding methinks. The credibility of LENR is not damaged by people who believe in it as well as in rectal probes from UFO aliens. But the credibility of those people is damaged by their nonsense beliefs. Joseph Papp, a raving lunatic from decades ago with an impossible story. Approval of Rossi after the initial demos and tests were mostly debunked by Krivit and others also leads to loss of credibility. Same with all the discredited free energy schemes, magnet motors, water fueled cars, etc., as IO pointed out.
LENR is difficult to "believe" because of Coulomb's observations. It is difficult (at least for me and for many others) to follow all the low level heat generation, questionable tritium generation, and wobbly radiation generation reports thus far. The credibility of LENR will not be established by anyone's opinion but by solid, reliable, replicable experiments with strong results. Hopefully, like those you and your team will provide.
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Seven, there is another possibility and that is that AR knew how to make heat early on, then attempted to scale it up, but couldn't. Then he re-designs to make it work again, and then tries to control the reaction as it scales, but can't. The re-design could be the result of trying to engineer by trial-and-error, which pretty much everybody else is doing, too.
If you have carefully followed the claims and what Rossi passed off as demos, that's impossible. His early ecats had extremely high performance. There was no need to scale them up. They would have been dynamite space and process heaters as they were claimed to be -- 10-20kW out from a tennis ball sized reactor chamber and dry steam temperatures. Supposedly, Dr. Levi measured up to 135kW peak which "scared Rossi." But then,
Quote“Minimum power was 15 kilowatts, and that’s a conservative value. I calculated it several times. At night we did a measurement and the device then worked very stable and produced 20 kilowatts.” ... It then worked for 18 hours with the bottle closed. Quite impressive.”
https://www.nyteknik.se/energi…cludes-combustion-6421304
It's world-shaking without scaling up. It's worth billions without scaling up. You have to consider history! It's what Rossi and Levi said. Had they said, yes, we can make a few milliwatts or Watts but we can't scale it up, then I would think you have a point. But how can you say there is a scaling problem when Rossi said in 2011 that he sold multiple megawatt "plants" to military "customers?" Nor did Rossi ever claim a control problem. I am afraid you are putting (very lame) excuses in his mouth. So to speak.
QuoteYes, the key is "experts making their own measurements".
OK, so why has not Rossi done this? With world-renown testing institutes like UL or Sandia Labs or even as suggested many times in 2011, Puthoff's and Little's Earthtech which is very friendly to new technology ideas? Some say there would be a risk to Rossi's IP but that would not be true if Rossi monitored the tests in person and provided only a black boxed ecat with input wires and an output steam hose. No risk at all. All the rationalization for why Rossi has behaved as he has makes no sense at all and has not made sense from the start in 2011.
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Are you implying that Rossi's money back guarantee for a customer will not be valid?
I'm not implying it. I'm telling it to you straight out. Rossi did give a few distributors refunds when he decide to take away their licenses. But when Industrial Heat demonstrated, by accident but definitively, that the reactors Rossi had provided them for an $11.5 million up front fee didn't work, Rossi didn't refund their money. He sued them which cost them milions in settlement and legal costs (an estimated $15 million altogether).
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No, seriously, while I do still hold open the possibility Rossi has something,
Really, Shane D. , if you believe that at this point, I think you should be ready to invest in my flying pigs and since you already know a lot about flying, maybe you could be an officer of the company.
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mmckubre wrote:
QuoteThere is no upside to asserting "Rossi is wrong"
Oh but there is! The upside of listing and refreshing the evidence that Rossi has nothing and lies constantly is that it decreases the possibility that in the future, another hapless individual like Tom Darden will entangle his company into a multi-million deal with the man. Obviously, any decrease in Rossi's marketing appeal can help prevent the loss of millions of dollars which could be better spent on legitimate LENR research instead of being used to enrich a con man.
QuoteWhat am I missing here?
That Rossi has received more than $12 million for his LENR/fusion scam and cost Industrial Heat many millions more. He also cost the DOD some $9 million that they spent because of his claim to high efficiency thermoelectric converters. And that came after the Petroldragon debacle which cost an Italian province 41 million Euros as of 2004. https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petroldragon
I would think most good people, especially those familiar with LENR work, the subject matter that Rossi abuses currently, would want this sort of waste and feeding of an unpleasant sociopath to stop.
Quote... the experiment is about to happen and it may turn out that you are very wrong and lose credibility also terminally.
What experiment? Rossi doesn't really do experiments. He does deceptive misleading demonstrations and refuses to accept the concept of calibration, blank controls, and independent verification by credible organizations. If you are referring to his latest caper, that happened already and was nothing comprehensible or meaningful, as expected by most Rossi observers, excepting only the hardest core believers.
As I pointed out to Jed Rothwell, when it comes to weird claims purported to be LENR manifestations and other free energy scams involving things like magnet motors and noble gas engines, the skeptics have never been wrong. The possibility that after seven years of lying and cheating investors, Rossi suddenly found something worth billions or trillions is vanishingly small. To hold otherwise makes no sense. Of course, this does not apply to legitimate research done with consistent use of scientific method.
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Most researchers hate him [Rossi].
You mean like McKubre, Focardi, Levi and Josephson and others I'd have to search out and won't. Or were you thinking of scientists who did not attend to Rossi at some point or other like so many proponents of LENR did? Many favorable articles were written about Rossi in lay journals and none of those illustrious scientists you are thinking of seemed to respond to those. That was left to internet skeptics who were then roundly insulted and in a few cases threatened for it. Other skeptics were banned from the forums some of those scientists contributed to. Geez, where were you between 2011 and 2013?
QuoteGood question - perhaps the lack of a customer who can verify the device within a year or so.
So seven years of claiming a customer without showing one doesn't bother you but one additional year will? Please explain how that works!
QuoteWe'll see Deleo - it will be interesting. This does seem to be the first time he's publicly advertising the ability to make sales with 2 week delivery
You're not counting the incidents in which he claimed to have already delivered devices to customers. And for years he claimed a one to a few months delivery for a megawatt "plant" as he was fond of calling it. That wasn't true (none of it) and nothing he says or promises now will be true either. What in the world is it you Rossi-ites don't get about how con men operate?