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What Pancake detector you have? I can't find anything about LN7317.It's a LND7317. US-made, new manufacture rather than surplus like most of the Russian ones available here.
https://www.lndinc.com/products/geiger-mueller-tubes/7317/
Here's the spectral sensitivity chart:
Background at my location is usually 40-50 CPM. For this experiment, it's mounted between two substantial lead shields, so the background is reduced to around 25 CPM.
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As expected, the U-tube live stream shut down after 4 hours. Restarted now - here's the new link:
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Zhigalov et al claim that DVDs could be used as strange radiation detectors. I'm wondering if a blank, carefully checked scratch-free DVD could be placed face down on top of the piece of paper to check if after a predetermined period of operation scratches of any sort will unexpectedly appear, if this doesn't disturb the experiment.
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can Yes, Bob Greenyer mentioned the same idea in a chat earlier. I have lots of blanks and set one suspended about 5 cm above the paper. I don't want a tight seal on the cell top. In the background you can see the He3 Neutron Detector, with its tube visible through a slot in the white HDPE moderator.
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According to their presentation a distance < 20 cm works best, but who knows if in this case this would count from the paper or the Ti sponge. However from the photo it looks as if the DVD is about 18-20 cm away from the sponge, so it might be ok after all.
QuoteDependence on distance
In the near zone (< 20 cm from the reactor) the intensity of the tracks exceeds the intensity in the far zone (> 20 cm).
For what it's worth, from a test today I found (I believe) that pre-existing tiny scratches can go initially unnoticed and play mind tricks later on, so it's important that the starting conditions of the sample are very carefully checked.
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pre-existing tiny scratches can go initially unnoticed and play mind tricks later on, so it's important that the starting conditions of the sample are very carefully checked
Yes, I picked through a stack of CD-R's for the cleanest one, then marked about 6 visible blemishes with a fine-tip pen.
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Does anyone have a theory as to why a DVD would be a "strange radiation" detector? Is one to use a Write Once or Re-Writeable Disc?
Re-Writeable discs apparently are made from:
" the areas between the coils of the groove (land pre-pits) and a DVD-RAM disc also inside the groove itself (land and groove). Next comes a dielectric layer (zinc sulfide and silicon dioxide), followed by a phase-change alloy recording layer (either indium, silver, tellurium and antimony or germanium, tellurium and antimony), another dielectric layer and a metal reflective layer (silver, silver alloy, aluminum)."
while write once DVDS are :
"Added to this substrate is an organic dye recording layer (azo, cyanine, dipyrromethene or others) followed by a metal reflective layer (silver, silver alloy, gold)."
So there is a significant difference in the two. However, I am unsure as to why either would react to low energy radiation in the way some recent photos are proposed. However, I am not very familiar with several of the recording materials, especially tellurium. I would not think the zinc sulfide or silicon dioxide would be be a good candidate.
So, any thoughts and are you using the Write once or the Re-Writeable type of DVD?
Thanks.
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Zohar used CD/DVD for radon alpha..2016
WO or RW? no answer here
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@Bob
I don't think the exact disk type matters. The tracks are supposed to occur on the surface of the clear polymer/polycarbonate layer. The underlying reflecting layer makes such tracks/pits on the surface evident.
In the case of Zhigalov et al blank DVD-Rs were likely what they had more readily available. Probably paper DVD/CD cases work too if you put something reflective below the clear layer.
Actually in the test I was mentioning earlier I was using one of these, with a pre-recorded (non-writable), new/unused DVD inside facing up, exposed to a presumably active material (I haven't got yet any radiation counter to properly verify if it is. Note that it doesn't have much to do with J5's experiment). The rationale for this was that it would act as some sort of [actual] scratch protection for the DVD. Over time I kept noticing new scratches on the paper-plastic case that I didn't notice earlier, but with no control and no other way to confirm otherwise, In the end I had to conclude that they were already there. I should repeat the same test using a carefully checked bare disk without paper casing.
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Do the CD/DVDs work well with normal radiation/particles?
I have some nasty strong radioactive stuff available (nothing too outrageous, NORM stuff, but hot, like 2 billion year old pitchbende) to try them with, and a stack of DVD discs.
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Can, Magic, Bocjin, Bruce, Bob, and especially Johnny5, or anyone with the skill set for that matter...could you provide some layman commentary of what we are seeing? If so, it would be appreciated.
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Shane, I think the EU contingent are all asleep by now. Did you want a tour of the data set, or a summary of what the data has shown so far?
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Shane, I think the EU contingent are all asleep by now. Did you want a tour of the data set, or a summary of what the data has shown so far?
A long running joke I, Alan, my other LF team members...and Paradigmnoia (separately), have going on, is I constantly remind them they never sleep. Even at odd local hours they answer. I can not figure it out. We Americans need our sleep, and have set hours.
That said, it would be much appreciated if you, or anyone gave a running summary. We have LF members in all time zones.
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I have very odd sleeping hours. Actually, I'm expecting to be up VERY late tonight.
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That said, it would be much appreciated if you, or anyone gave a running summary. We have LF members in all time zones.
JohnyFive's guidance is that nothing is expected for several days. The data so far appears to be null, meaning no evidence above background of Alpha particles, Beta or Gamma radiation, or Neutrons. Detection of Strange Radiation is not yet a well-defined art, and the use of a plastic CD disc as discussed above is therefore a shot in the dark.
As far as the experimental procedure, I've been steadily updating my online lab notes, and that is where you can find the latest technical details.
AlanG
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One idea that Shoulder's suggested is to tune a radio to the AM band between stations. When EVOs hit a target and destroy themselves they will release RF and/or x-rays (depending upon the electric properties of the target). If you happen to hear sudden crackles or pops on the radio, you might be producing strange radiation.
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Paradigmnoia,
Depending on what exactly you are doing, that sounds like a pretty interesting job!
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Do the CD/DVDs work well with normal radiation/particles?
I have some nasty strong radioactive stuff available (nothing too outrageous, NORM stuff, but hot, like 2 billion year old pitchbende) to try them with, and a stack of DVD discs.
I think in principle the mode of operation shouldn't be too different than that of CR-39 polymer plates (or similar) sometimes used for radiation measurements. However the tracks look much different. Ordinarily they should appear like dots or ellipsoids (images from the web):
https://www.slideshare.net/sabmomo75/automatic-reading-cr39
In the case of these strange radiation tracks it looks instead as if the particles are marching along the surface of the polymer samples, and carve visible long pits into it. Also, no surface etching seemingly necessary to see them.
