Posts by seven_of_twenty

Quote from oldguy

We already know but

Vitamin D Linked to Low Virus Death Rate Says New Study

https://www.newsmax.com/health…-19/2020/05/07/id/966554/

Vitamin D has been shown to protect against acute respiratory infections, and older adults, the group most deficient in vitamin D, are also the ones most seriously affected by the virus

scientists have found people in countries that have the highest mortality rates from COVID-19 like Italy and Spain, also had the lowest levels of vitamin D. Conversely, the highest levels of vitamin D were found in northern European countries, like Scandinavia, which was among the countries with the lowest mortality rates

Well, I am not sure we already know it. The link you cited is a correlation. Correlation is not causation. It could be that people who eat more vitamin D or get out in the sun more are the healthy ones. Then what? As always, what is needed is a prospective, randomized, placebo controlled trial. I have looked for some but didn't find them. I've read of claimed success for treating bad influenza cases with vitamin D but there are conflicting data about that. Caveat emptor. Vitamin D is pretty harmless but not entirely so in very large quantities. One thing it may cause is calcifications where you don't want them. That evidence is wobbly too. It's difficult to know.

Quote from Roseland67

Kinda like Dr. Richard has been saying for a few months, no?

Good call doc.

Yeah but is there any correlation with clinical improvement in properly done randomized placebo-controlled or multi-armed studies? That's the only real issue.

Quote from Wyttenbach

Heparin blocks corona from entering cell. (stop spreading) So it's of double use! (See old post)

Do you mind repeating the cite/link for that. I never heard of it and if you posted it before, I may have missed it. Classical heparin, given IV, is an extremely dangerous drug which has to be used under continuous control of blood clotting measurements. It pains me to remember and I doubt it was my fault but way back when I was doing internal medicine internship, a patient of mine with blood clots in the legs was treated with heparin and shortly thereafter developed a CVA (stroke). She survived but was seriously impaired. Low molecular weight heparin (Lovenox), given by shallow subcutaneously injection, is safer than the older variety but still quite difficult to manage in some patients.

I think heparin works (only in very sick COVID-19 patients) by preventing/mitigating DIC (disseminated intravascular coagulation). If you have a paper showing it interferes with COVID-19, i'd like to see it. If you don't have one, please stop saying it. Thanks.

The article you linked above (PDF preprint) is excellent about coagulation issues but says nothing I could find about preventing entry of virus into cells. Did I miss something?

One of the recent contributors who has no qualifications, except negative ones, to contribute anything to a discussion of COVID-19 prevention and treatment, reminded me of the old story about the streetwalker who had a treatable STD and refused to take the prescribed drugs. She was, of course, arrested. The charge was "practicing license without a medicine."

Quote from MarkGoldes

The pioneering work of Irwin Stone & Linus Pauling has resulted in a worldwide movement by orthomolecular physicians to fight viral disease that is clearly relevant at this moment. See COVID-19 & VITAMIN C at aesopinstitute.org for an introduction and a prevention protocol as well as treatments they have developed which might save a great many lives as events move in the direction we now observe.

There we have it from genius who made billions from his magnetic motor and room temperature semiconductors. ... Oh! He didn't?

It was all a (word I can't put here)? If not, where did it go? Just what we neeeded.

This probably doesn't say too much except that HCQ (alone) is certainly not a magic bullet for very sick patients. Also, it's an observational study- apparently the best people can do for now. That will change, hopefully soon so we get a good answer, both for very sick and for mildly to moderately sick patients.

Quote

In the main analysis, there was no significant association between hydroxychloroquine use and intubation or death (hazard ratio, 1.04, 95% confidence interval, 0.82 to 1.32). Results were similar in multiple sensitivity analyses.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2012410?query=RP

Quote from axil

The new sweden like strategy now in place to forgo remediation to reopen the USA to normal bisiness activity will produce a death toll in the USA of up to 250,000. If the Covid-19 epidemic is compared to snowstorm, a whiteout is coming.

That assumes adequate social isolation, mask wearing, hand washing and protection of the elderly and immunocompromised as well as adequate treatment facilities. Much or all of that is improbable for the current thinking many USA citizens seem to have so, absent a vaccine or an effective treatment, the death toll could be much worse.

Quote from Alan Smith

In fact Aspirin,Southern Comfort, strong tea and tobacco are my standby medication.

Please exercise a bit of caution about the combination. Your stomach may disagree with you. Also, in doses exceeding 80 - 100 mg per day, aspirin can cause GI bleeding and even perforation. It's very unusual but it can happen without warning, in people over 65 especially. It can also make hemorrhagic strokes much worse and harder to deal with. I guess you pays you money and makes your choices.

Quote from fabrice DAVID

It would be interesting to see if the many patients treated with anticoagulants (such as warfarin) are protected against these complications. (Coumadin, Sintrom, Previscan, and even aspirin : Aspegic, Kardegic) I suggest to prefer aspirin against paracetamol, because 3 g of paracetamol kills you, but 3 g of aspirin makes just little stomach burn and little blood when saving.

Actually the max allowed dose of paracetamol/Tylenol/acetaminophen is 4 grams per day. I wouldn't recommend more than half that much inasmuch as most people don't know the state of their liver function. But no, three grams won't kill the typical person. For the details: https://www.uspharmacist.com/a…-pharmacists-need-to-know

Lethality for aspirin starts around 300 mg/kg. So for a 50 kg person, around 15 grams. But long before you get to that dose, there can be adverse effects, most especially GI hemorrhage which can lead to death, especially in older persons.

All NSAID's have some risk even in recommended doses.

Quote from Navid

News flash: there is a civil war going on between normal Americans and the deep-state (front-men like Soros, Gates etc).

You left out the Illuminati, the Freemasons, and the Knights Templar. Also the grey and green aliens, their UFO's and kidnappings and secret implants and anal probes. You need to study more so your thesis can be complete. You can watch Alex Jones for reliable information about conspiracies against the American people.

Speaking of horror shows: https://www.foxnews.com/politi…-positive-for-coronavirus

Quote

“We were recently notified by the White House Medical Unit that a member of the United States Military, who works on the White House campus, has tested positive for Coronavirus,” Trump aide Hogan Gidley said in a statement Thursday.

Typical Fox underplay of news. This is a White house valet (!) --someone who personally brought and served Trump food among other things. No masks are worn by anyone within the West Wing of the White House where the president hangs out most of the time (watching TV and eating Big Mac's and Kentucky Fried Chicken). As we speak, the President could be incubating COVID-19. Among other things he incubates.

ETA: Oh... I didn't know he had a good reason: a mask makes him look ridiculous is what he says is his reason for never wearing one. And it would send "the wrong message."Oh... OK then. Whaaaaat?

https://www.nbcnews.com/politi…nd-wrong-message-n1202001

THHuxleynew

Quote

Protect the old, weak and sick, quarantine and isolate them, administer medical attention to them. Get the younger generation out working and building immunity for the next generatio

Nice theory. In practice, completely impossible. Are you really going to move every person over 55 (that's the age morbidity and mortality begin to increase) to some quarantine "institution"? What about their homes and families? It's a dumb idea. Because young people have lots of morbidity even if less mortality, letting everyone loose under a certain age would be a major disaster for humanity, not that the present situation isn't one. It's a problem without a solution. As the quote from the movie "Master and Commander: Far Side of the World" says, you have to choose the lesser of two weevils.

This and other studies like it is how we will know if HCQ+AZI works. Note: 25-30 sites nationwide in the US and many outside the US. The answer will be in but it still will take months and I think at the moment we don't know jacksh*t. I really hope similar studies will be done with Pepcid (famotidine) and ivermectin but there probably will be fewer of those.

"Today, researchers at The Lundquist Institute began a randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled clinical trial designed to find out whether hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin reduce hospitalization and/or death in individuals suffering from COVID-19, the disease caused by the novel coronavirus, SARS-CoV-2. This trial, sponsored by the National Institutes for Health, will include 2,000 adults with symptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infections. Under the direction of Dr. Eric Daar, The Lundquist Institute will be one of 25 to 30 sites nationwide, each looking to enroll about 100 patients over the next six weeks."

https://finance.yahoo.com/news…9-clinical-140000628.html

Mark U Navid

AND: BTW WTF is CBN PLS? (I am practicing my acronyms)

Quote from Navid

He tried melatonin. I heard CBN is the best. Have you tried either?

CBN? If you meant the Christian Broadcasting Network, it puts me to sleep too.

Quote from Wyttenbach

Heparin for me is the most surprising find as it was never meant as an antiviral! (like the famous blue pill...)

I'm pretty sure it isn't an antiviral. Heparin is an anticoagulant and might prevent some of the disastrous damage caused by disseminated intravascular coagulation (DIC) caused by the COVID-19 virus.

Quote from Shane D.

Thanks SOT, but I am just not interested in watching that. BTW, I did a search and we did talk about AJ in 2017 after he interviewed one of the players in the field.

You mean you don't want to cannibalize your neighbors if the beef plants shut down?

Shane D.

This is some of the more sane Alex Jones stuff:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfZcKCIcug8

"I will eat my neighbors!"

And a dead-on hilarious Steven Colbert parody of Jones:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebhNRF5r4Ts

Wyttenbach

Quote

But is double blind really the thing you like to do with severely ill patients..

Excellent question. I saw Dr. Fauci asked it. His response was you have to do a "multi-armed" study which compares one or more drugs believed to have effect to the drug you are testing. Patients must be matched and assigned at random. For example, you can ethically test HCQ+AZI against Remdesivir for safety and effectiveness and against the combination of Remdesivir and HCQ+AZI. These are difficult studies which use lots of patients and cost more than placebo controlled studies. Trials are always stopped if one method is obviously superior to another or to placebo from early or ongoing data analysis.

If you're gonna try HCQ and AZI, this is how to do it safely.

Inpatient use of mobile continuous telemetry for COVID-19 patients treated with hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin

https://www.heartrhythmcaserep…-0271(20)30058-0/abstract (note PDF linked for full paper)

A methodical and careful critique of the original study from Marseilles known, I have no idea why, as the Raoult study (he was one a dozen or so authors and last listed).

https://www.redactionmedicale.…w_20_03_20_001%5B1%5D.pdf

Further in vitro study supporting use of HCQ and Azi against COVID-19 -- that's "nice" but what we need is a good clinical RCT type study.

Preprint scheduled for Aug 2020 publication

https://www.sciencedirect.com/…cle/pii/S0882401020305155

Once again, strong evidence that EKG monitoring is absolutely required when HCQ and AZI are given together:

https://www.medrxiv.org/conten…101/2020.04.22.20075671v1

oldguy Sorry if I misunderstood. It is unconscionable for a governor to dictate the practice of medicine and to question with legal action the decisions of front line practitioners.

Quote from RobertBryant

So does SOT still prefer the balm of Gilead to the malarial poison?

Nonsense. I do not know of a single, proven effective substance with which to treat or prevent COVID-19 unless you include youth, health and genetics. Malarial poison? Ask an internist who used HCQ to treat lupus for twenty years in hundreds of patients with no cardiac deaths and only a very few patients who stopped the treatment due to QTc prolongation without arrhythmia. I posted it before. HCQ with or without AZI is safe but does require EKG monitoring for essentially absolute safety. HCQ has essentially no other short term toxicity except rare hypersentivity (allergy) and transient stomach (GI) irritation. Problem is, it's not proven to work.