Posts by Bob#2

Quote from THHuxleynew

Again, I can't comment directly on the US - where everything seems to be politicised and different parts of the country run waves at different times (though maybe all will get omicron at the same time, I'm not sure).

In the UK we track infection across age groups in the community in great detail. There is very strong evidence that before omicron our high sustained delta infection rate was driven by a very high rate in 5-11 years olds (who in the UK were not vaccinated). The figures are pretty clear. Delta was spreading in schools (the children hardly noticed it) and then a few weeks later spilling over to families with children and from then to the older population.

The quality of this UK data, and the analysis with it, is very high (I don't know better).

And I also can't see how the UK scientists could be highly politicised, even if in the US you can argue they are.

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Sorry, I was not clear and thank you for your response.

I was not intending to say that the youth do not get Covid, just the opposite and I may have painted an inaccurate picture of my point.

I have heard that India has low infection rates because the country is "young". See Jed's above post. My comment was that youth does not stop infection and can spread it according to standard Covid publications and you seem to agree as well. Youth can and do spread Covid.

"our high sustained delta infection rate was driven by a very high rate in 5-11 years olds (who in the UK were not vaccinated). "

Your statement would support that India should see a higher infection rate because they are such a young country......and not vaccinated? Is this not correct according to your UK analogy?

(However, vaccinations do not seem to reduce infection much according to most graphs.)

Thus my argument that India's low infection rate has nothing to do with youth. Young people still spread the infection. Youth could very well reduce death rates... but not infection. India is seeing a low rate in both.

"Worms" would not reduce infection rate either... nor death in my opinion. This is simply grasping at straws.....

So remove youth and "worms" from India and how do you account for such remarkable success??? (Bash the reporting system of course, but certainly do not NEVER entertain the thought that Ivermectin might work!)

My apologies on the misunderstanding. Again, we will see with time how India succeeds or fails. So far, they succeed while most high vaccinated countries are foundering. Youth and worms are not the reason..... at some point we will find out hopefully.

Quote from JedRothwell

You are wrong on both counts:

India's population is younger than most.

Worms and other parasites are widespread in India. It is estimated that 225 million children are infected with them.

https://ciff.org/news/worms-in…ding-deworming-programme/

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???

No one said India was not "young" nor no one had "worms"

I clearly stated that youth does not affect the transmitting of Covid Delta..... if so why is the US pushing so hard to have 5 year old and up vaccinated? The low case rate in India is not due to youth was my statement and this statement is correct per normal Covid transmission statements....

It is likely possible that India has a high rate of parasites. A lot of third world countries do. But that was not my statement. My statement was that worms would not affect the Covid infection rate and that is correct. Now if those people are taking IVERMECTIN for parasite (worm) infection, that well may affect transmission rates! But it has nothing to do with the worms.

Really?

Quote from THHuxleynew

You may not like these facts but you are not a doctor -

Nor are you that I know of....

I do have 2 MD's and 2 RN's in my immediate family. They would strongly disagree with you, both from literature and actual hands on Covid treatment....

Is it proof? Not really, but I respect their judgments any day over your "statistical" posts as we both know you can make statistics say anything if you manipulate the numbers accordingly. Especially if one will only take "mainstream" publications as valid. I do not argue that you post several statistical studies... I just know that "statistics" is wrong 75% of the time!....

I also live in a town that has a medical school. I know several professors and students. Upon informal polls with them, I found about 50 / 50 in the pro / con ivermectin debate. When asking those not in favor, they give CDC and NIH statements as their foundation. For those who lean in favor of implementing Ivermectin, the majority state it is their own data review that led them there. This is not at all surprising and fits well towards your "Most physicians do not support ivermectin use" mainly because they simply take what mainstream says and do not look for themselves.

As far a pharma goes? Are they evil? no. Are they beyond putting dollar above safety... very much so. Why do you really think they are asking for 75 years to have all trial data (withheld) published? Why do you think they demanded lawsuit protection?

History? Recent... opioids. Viox... Paxil... Risperdal... Actos.... and the list is large.

Pharma EVENTUALLY after several lawsuits was found guilty and had to pay out over 14 billion dollars in settlements over the past 10 years alone!

Did big pharma push these or not?

Safety indeed! Profit for sure!

Big Pharma - Drug & Device Companies, Lawsuits & Facts

Big Pharma consists of powerful drug manufacturers that are often accused of unethical marketing practices and promoting dangerous medicines.

www.drugwatch.com

So actual history is that, yes, pharma has and does put sales over safety and often. All the "regs" as you call them... all were there before these billion dollar lawsuits....and mRNA has been pushed through like no other drug in history.... do you think these "regs" now suddenly stopped business as usual? Experts say the industry contributes about two thirds of the FDA’s budget.....

Yes, your linked video sounds reasonable, but I feel uninformed about working ivermectin. Dr. Laurie's video is quite thorough, along with Dr. Campbells many, but then I really doubt you have truthfully reviewed them. We can point to videos all day. Neither side proves anything.

India's continued success is really quite hard to argue. Your "youth" argument does not hold water on case counts.... (why is the US pushing for youth to be vaccinated?) Youth certainly effects death rate, but not case rate. Jed's stupid comments about worms simply points out how stupidly biased he is. Worms would not effect case rate either and no, it is not even realistic on death counts. It is simply a grabbing at straws because a 35% vaccination rate country cannot be 10 times better than a highly vaccinated one, so they grasp at worms! Of course the last resort is "you cannot rely on India's reporting".

No, India is difficult to deny even though some try. If it continues while other high vaccinated countries founder with wave after wave, eventually a reckoning will be had. If ivermectin does not really help, then India will surely get hit like everyone else will they not? Time will tell.

Look at these graphs from World o Meter.

Daily cases are no better than when the world had NO mRNA vaccines. Even though there have been literally BILLIONS of doses given.

The death rate is not much better world wide. Actually simply improved medical care can account for a significant decrease. But even then, the decrease is not that dramatic world wide.

And again.... India... with a low vaccination rate is much better off than the vaccinated world...

Youth? no.

Worms? certainly not

Vaccines? unlikely as they have a low rate and are not seeing the multiple waves of other countries.

Ivermectin? The India medical regulatory system has not only approved it but is handing it out. Are you willing to state that India's medical decision makers know less than you do and are completely without ANY evidence to base their decisions?

As for me and my wife, we have used ivermectin, certainly had no adverse effects and know that our Covid event was extremely mild and short lived. Until another medical option is PROVEN safe and effective, we will keep it on hand and ready to use! (and maintenance use of Vit. D, Zinc and Quercetin)

Quote from THHuxleynew

When only 0.5% of people die from COVID it is not easy to know, as a family doctor, whether your prescriptions of "mRNA jabs" for COVID are working or not - the actual number you'd expect to die varies wildly with demographics etc.

Similarly - individuals claiming Ivermectin + mega doses of vitamins "mRNA jabs" have cured them are not science - and experience shows you get such stories about anything including scams. "poor quality pharma trials with no public reporting for 50 years, no long term testing at all and an overt push to discredit anything else".

THH may not like the 60+ trials, tests, analysis that have been done on Ivermectin... but there are MANY very qualified actual medical researchers who DO state these trials ARE EVIDENCE (THH and JED has often stated there is NO evidence) that Ivermectin works. There is MORE trials, tests and analysis done on Ivermectin and the vast majority state it does work, (only a few biased ones do not), by non-biased researchers than done on the Phizer anti-viral drug. Certainly Phizers trials are not unbiased! Yet that does not seem to matter..... WHY?  

TSN is promoting arguments that make no scientific sense. that is its privilege, it is a journalistic site delivering political opinion - so you don't expect it to understand science. It is a shame that it claims to do so - journalists should be more honest than that.

CNN, MSNBC and a plethora of vaccine warrior websites promote arguments and they are not scientific journals.... such as that hospitals in Arkansas are over-run by ivermectin overdoses. Yet you do not hold THEM to the same critique of TSN. TSN does publish some odd reports, but state them as such. MOST of their reports are done by licensed, qualified and noted researches and physicians. Just because THH and JED does not agree, does not make their reports invalid.... and if THH applied the same kinds of critique to Phizer's anti-viral drug as he does Ivermectin trials... he could find just as many "faults" if he really wanted too!

The point is that all these stories about ivermectin will and should convince no scientist that ivermectin works. Whetehr it works or no - you can't tell by counting anecdotes.

You just do not seem to get it. The 60+ studies are not anecdote. They ARE studies. They are not all perfect. But they ARE SIGNIFICANT evidence. More so than Phizer anti-viral drug trial! Yet you refuse to acknowledge the 60+ (which I really doubt you have studied all, when meta analysis experts have) You keep replying from anecdotal stories that ivermectin does not work and there is no evidence. That is simply not true......

The overall large body of evidence... anecdotal, trials, analysis', India, and from many qualified researchers simply should not be ignored....

Truthfully, my opinion is that your (Jed's appears strictly political bias) position is that you cannot allow any competition to mRNA vaccines for some reason. I do not think there is a person on this site that is stating that mRNA vaccines should be completely banned... certainly questioning giving it to the young and why not compliment with ivermecting, but your and Jed's continual "anti-vaxer" comments shout your true agenda. It has become a religion to you both for some odd reason..... strange.

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Quote from Wyttenbach

The Ziverdo kit will end it within 6 weeks as seen in India....

While tragic, the Omicron variant may very well lend huge support to the India Ivermectin story.

If the rest of the vaccinated world sees huge increases in cases due to Omicron and India does not... then that will be very hard to ignore...

The excuse that India is a "young" country will not hold (and truthfully was never a good argument). Age has less impact on infection rate, yes mortality rate but not infection rate so much. India's infection rate is way down.....

The excuse that herd immunity is the reason will not compute because the vaccinations should still work! As would the previous infections in the rest of the world. Which again was a feeble excuse in India. I really doubt that India has more immune % than other countries when adding vaccinations and infections together.

If the Ivermectin states continue to succeed in spite of Omicron, It will be very difficult for the mRNA warriors to berate the Ivermectin treatment.... but of course they must try!

If India follows and Omicron explodes there as well... it will likewise cast doubt on "Ziverdo" effectiveness and rightly so.... we will have to wait and see.... unfortunately.

Iin the meantime, I still have my Ivermectin available. No risk and better than the "do nothing" alternate.

Quote from Wyttenbach

...and if e.g. V-D3 gets low it will break out again.

An interesting note...

I had my annual blood work up done last week and specifically asked that V-D levels be included.

The result came back that I was curiously very low in VD!

I state curious in that I have been taking 2500 IU's a day for the past 18 months! I guess I will have to bump up to 5000. It was not just low, but very low. (I am traveling at the moment and do not have the exact numbers with me)

I wonder how many people "think" their levels are OK since they eat a fairly healthy diet? I would have sworn my levels would be OK as well since I eat balanced and take supplements as well.... but I was proven wrong... or the tests were inaccurate which I would not think the case.

I have seen multiple articles about the benefits of VD lately and not from this forum. I believe this information is starting to get around some and perhaps might do some good.

Quote from JedRothwell

That is incorrect. The mRNA vaccines are as effective at preventing and transmitting disease as any other type of vaccine. They trigger an immune system reaction. Once that happens, it looks the same to Mother Nature as any other vaccine type, or natural immunity from the disease. (Okay, almost the same, with minor differences.)

It is like the difference between cooking with an electric heater or gas: there isn't any. The final chemical state of the cooked food is the same. A body with a prepared immune system has the same set of antibodies from the mRNA vaccine, a traditional vaccine, or the disease itself.

I am not sure where you are getting your data!

I have received one vaccination for mumps in 50 years. One for whooping cough, only one for polio, etc. etc.

I get a tetanus shout every 10 years, not every 3 months!

Your "same as any other vaccine" is simply incorrect. There is already the third shot within 11 months now! The fourth booster being discussed / planned! Unheard of with "any other type of vaccine". These novel mRNA treatments are NOT as good as attenuated virus vaccines as the effectiveness is reduced to almost nothing in 6 months (thus the the need for short term boosters)

Your "mother nature knows no difference" meme is clearly incorrect as the traditional attenuated virus vaccines last almost a life time, not just a few months! There IS a big difference and mother nature knows it!

Even your ally here THH states :

Quote from THHuxleynew

As I understand it the motivation for the vaccine is primarily to save severe disease and death. it does this, the boosters do this.

NOT to stop infection nor transmission. Which the MMR, Polio and other vaccines do quite well! The proliferation of breakthrough cases and studies showing vaccinated virus loads undeniably show the mRNA vaccines do not stop the spread.

Others agree that the vaccines main goal is not prevention (which the attenuated virus goals indeed are!)

Quote from THHuxleynew

I guess some people in the US have some weird idea that vaccination prevents spread of delta (which it was not designed to do - being tested originally against original COVID - we are very lucky it has any effect against delta).

This is NOT the same as cooking with gas or electric. This is a completely novel triggering function that has not been widely used before and had has shown significant severe side effects in past attempts. No long term safety studies have been conducted at all... except the test tube that is now the world.

We will find out in another couple of years..... remember it took five years to pinpoint thalidomide causing thousands of deformed babies..... I really do hope we find nothing tragic with these vaccines... time will tell and nothing else.

Quote from Alan Smith

I can think of very few pathogenic bacteria or viruses that have become more deadly since mass vaccination was introduced. The programme to produce these has made mistakes (Salk etc) but where deployed at a sufficiently large scale they have almost completely eradicated diseases most people under 50 have never heard of - diptheria, whooping cough, scarlet fever, mumps, rheumatic fever and more.

I think it is erroneous for people to keep lumping mRNA treatment results with traditional attenuated virus vaccines historical results.

Your statement is true that several very serious diseases have been reduced or eliminated by vaccines. I think nobody here argues that. But to state that an mRNA treatment (not a traditional vaccine in any way) will result in the same outcomes is not yet clear. Your post implies that point as most "consider" mRNA treatment "vaccines".

The vaccines used for the diseases you mention all stopped the patient from both getting the disease AND from transmitting the disease. The current mRNA treatments do neither, this is absolutely now known. Thus we should not assume that the current mRNA treatments will have anywhere near the same pandemic impact as the ones that have proven successful. This is simply not only unproven but based upon current knowledge very UNLIKELY to do so.

It is the same as some here stating that the current mRNA "Vaccines" are the safest that have EVER been produced. This is simply unfounded. There have been zero mass use of mRNA vaccines in the past. Attempts to do so were halted due to severe negative health effects. There have been zero long term safety studies done. To lump mRNA safety in with traditional attenuated virus vaccines is invalid and NOT "following science". The mRNA treatments function via a completely different mechanism than attenuated virus vaccines . Just because some call them vaccines, does not mean the historic safety record of attenuated virus vaccines can be automatically apply to them. "Just because they say so does not make it true!" I hope and perhaps the long term safety of the current mRNA vaccines will be high, but no one knows yet.

12 months ago, there was no knowledge of heart issues etc. Now we know there are some issues. What will the next 12 months bring? We simply do not know.

This is not an anti-vaccine post by no means. Again, I stress that traditional vaccines have been a god-send.

These mRNA vaccines however are unproven long term safety and to force them upon people is quite wrong. Also it is quite apparent they do not stop the spread of Covid. Therefore, they will not stop the pandemic.

What most here object too is the "the mRNA vaccines are the only way forward agenda", the strongly politicized forced use of these vaccines, the censorship and slandering of anything that might remotely diminish the use of these vaccines, even to the point of criminalizing the personal choice of what to use to fight Covid. It is the liberal elite thinking that is so skewered it is sickening to many here.

Two weeks ago, Aaron Rogers of the Green Bay packers came down with Covid. He elected to not get vaccinated and was taking other courses that he AND HIS doctor had agreed upon. He took ivermectin once tested positive. His case was mild and recovered in a minimal amount of days.

The press absolutely crucified him.

This week, Ben Roethlisberger of the Pittsburg Steelers tested positive for Covid. He missed the game and we will see how long he is out. Hopefully he does very well as Rogers did.

Roethlisberger was double jabbed...... Not a cricket's peep from the press.....

I would LOVE to see days to be cleared of virus and other metrics from the two! But there is not a chance in hell that will happen! Not that two cases would prove anything, but it sure as heck would be interesting to see. (Although, if Rogers would have died or became incapacitated, Jed would have been jumping on the case as "see what happens when you do not get vaccinated!"

Now some here will say "it is not surprising... 95% of ALL Covid cases are mild and or even non-symptomatic. Thus the Ivermectin treatment proves nothing" Yet those same people seem to say that the jabs prevent 95% of people from hospitalizations or sever cases! However, those two 95% figures are certainly NOT the same.

If Roethlisberger has a mild case, I can also say that "95% all of cases are mild" and the vaccine did not prove anything... the exact same as the Ivermectin statement.

Now when we get to the "Real" vaccine 95% and "hospitalizations and severe cases" number.... We cannot really compare the two. The vaccine warriors automatically trash any trials on ivermectin (while at the same time giving major drug companies complete passes on faulty or insignificant results) and state ... I quote " There is NO evidence that ivermectin works". That is pure BS.. There are 60+ studies that ARE evidence. Perhaps not as rock solid as one would like. Not all double blind... Not done by big pharma... but it IS evidence. To state otherwise is pure bias.

The trial evidence of some of the more recent drugs coming up are not only fewer in number of trials but the results not as good as some of the ivermectin trials. Yet NO big push back on those!

Following "the science" is only done from many when it leads you down your predetermined road..

By the way, just as 99 percent of people on this thread, I am NOT an antivaxxer. "Just because two people here keep using that term does not make it true!"

Quote from Alan Smith

I just can't wait for Sunday!

I do not understand this!

The thread was already moved once to a "more hidden" menu.

The Covid thread has mushroomed to 909 pages of posts in just over a year! Surpassing even the "great Rossi hoax" with 700+ pages in 5+ years.

The two most read and posted topics by magnitude are this one (Covid) and Rossi. Moving them to a different menu will not stop anything. Jed states he will quit reading the thread, but we all know that is not true and he will start posting his overt political BS bias again at some point.

If someone does not like this thread, simply do not read it! I do not understand the "cant wait to move it"?

So again, I do not understand. If the owner of the site does not want to be derailed from LENR, then the only way is to totally remove Rossi and Covid. Moving them to another menu is not going to reduce the posts nor cause LENR posts to increase. The 900 pages of posts show it is what readers are most active in. The 700 pages of Rossi drama shows that it is the second most popular and commented subject on the site.

It is not the "menu placement" of the threads, it is the subject matter (or lack of discussable subject matter in the LENR threads) that drives the posts, not the menu placement.

So I am puzzled. Is the real motive to try to bury the subject matter down the menu tree so that new visitors will not see Rossi and Covid as fast and make the site "look" more credible...... BUT..... at the same time keep the website hits / visits up coming by continuing to host the two most popular thread subjects?

Seems to me there must be a connection! If the only concern was LENR, then Rossi and Covid would be completely dropped or at least archived with no new posts allowed. Yet being probably 90% of total hits on the site, one does not want to lose that now do they?

Quote from THHuxleynew

Not however a mystery to those who have been discussing the adverse effects of even mild COVID:

I am interested in your logic of the following:

You have in the recent past stated that the vaccines primary purpose "now" is to reduce hospitalizations / deaths from Covid19 infections. I believe you generally agree that the vaccines are now shown not prevent infection (nor spreading) of the Covid19 virus but that they provide protection from serious cases. I believe this is an accurate portrayal of the current status myself.

I believe your stance further posits that if unvaccinated, even mild cases pose danger to health due to "long covid", myocarditis and other adverse effects and that these risks out weigh any vaccination risks.

If this stance is correct (and I may be incorrect in understanding your position) I would ask your logic and supporting data on this thought.

What is the difference (both medical theory and any real life data) that would show an unvaccinated "mild case" of Covid19 would be any different that a "mild case" contracted by a double vaxxed individual? Does not the "mild case" argument become moot if both vaccinated and unvaccinated have "mild cases" and thus both are still suspect to these "adverse effects"?

You have stated that some observational examples might be invalid because 99% of Covid cases are mild or even non-symptomatic anyway. Thus the vaccinations are only helping 1% (rough percentages here, not meant to be exact) of people from serious cases anyway.

So then the remaining 99% are subject to damage even though the cases are mild, whether vaccinated or not.

Or are you stating that "mild vaccinated cases" are not subject to the adverse effects and "unvaccinated mild cases" are. If so, what facts are you basing this on?

Thank you.

I am not trying to diss either view! I am just collecting data to base my decisions on.

Bad planning?

Bad intentions? (Knowing about issues but proceeding anyway to get the money?)

Plain stupidity?

Missouri's largest windfarm shuts down at night...due to two bat fatalities!

Missouri's largest wind farm is shut off at night to protect bats – is this overkill?

A wind farm has been switching off at night since April to avoid killing endangered bats. Is this throwing out the baby with the bathwater?

electrek.co

Quote from sam12

it gets Safety Certification

Sam12,

As stated often here before. Certification is a daily occurrence and there is no mystery about it. There is NO "safety" certification. There are certifications to industry or government standards for specific functions., which can include "safety". These standards are normally drawn up by industry organizations and then CERTIFIED by an agency such as UL. These standards take a long time to develop and require review and approval from bodies such as SAE (automotive) or NFPA (National Fire Protection Association) to name just two.

So what is Rossi getting certified too? A novel nuclear device? Hardly... there are no standards for such. An LED light? Should be no problem and certainly not a secret. What would the "IF' be concerned here? Except that if it is to a standard LED certification, then the SKLED is NOT a novel LENR or "other" powered device as the standard would not apply to it!

So once again, I must ask you.. what standard is Rossi getting his device certified too? "Safety" is meaningless in certification terms. Surely you can ask him this! Providing the certification standard will not disclose any IP and these standards are MEANT to be published, so no agency is going to "complain".

On the other hand, if you are afraid to ask him, that shows you acknowledge that he is deceptive in this. If he does not answer the question, it shows he is deceptive. If he is deceptive in something as open and honest as a certification, it is a big flag that he is a liar and cheat.

Your logic is completely in error here. There is NOTHING hinging on a "Safety" certificate. There never has been. Just like his previous "certificates", they turned out to be 1) deceptive and 2) certainly did not prove Rossi had anything.

Please provide any logic as to why the above reasoning is not sound and refutes the certificate argument. If you cannot, then I suggest you should really evaluate your continued support for such a scam...... not that I care anything about Rossi anymore... it is just that he scammed $10,000,000 that could have went to legitimate LENR research, CONTINUES to give LENR a very bad name and I dislike seeing such obvious and blatant scam artists openly and publicly prance around while some people openly praise him and certain people refuse to call him out.....especially those who have personally seen his crap presentations.....

Oh well... P.T. Barnum was certainly correct about some people.

Quote from Alan Smith

LONDON, July 21 (Reuters) - Two doses of Pfizer (PFE.N) or AstraZeneca's (AZN.L) COVID-19 vaccine are nearly as effective against the highly transmissible Delta coronavirus variant as they are against the previously dominant Alpha variant, a study published on Wednesday showed.

Officials say vaccines are highly effective against the Delta variant, now the dominant variant worldwide, though the study reiterated that one shot of the vaccines is not enough for high protection.

The study, published in the New England Journal of Medicine, confirms headline findings given by Public Health England in May about the efficacy of COVID-19 vaccines made by Pfizer-BioNTech and Oxford-AstraZeneca (AZN.L), based on real-world data.

Wednesday's study found that two doses of Pfizer's shot was 88% effective at preventing symptomatic disease from the Delta variant, compared to 93.7% against the Alpha variant, broadly the same as previously reported.

https://www.reuters.com/busine…t-study-finds-2021-07-21/

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I am not sure I understand your response. Both Israel actual data and World o Meter indicate completely otherwise... current vaccine efficacy is greatly reduced by Delta. That is the problem with "studies". They can show whatever the investigators want... whether it be vaccine efficacy or ivermectin effectiveness....

Yet the real world shows quite differently... the current vaccines / vaccine implementation are not winning the battle.

Quote from THHuxleynew

The true promise from the vaccines is they would allow us to get on with our lives with minimal precautions and without the health service collapsing. That is what they do at the moment in the UK, and the difference between now and last year.

To the world at large, the vaccines have not made much of a difference in how we live. It is simply government mandate. If governments followed the same logic, we would be in lock down again. Significant increase in cases / deaths warranted lock downs last year but not this year????

The reason lockdowns are not as wide spread now is not because the vaccines have quelled the pandemic, it is because governments know that they 1) would cause a revolt or 2) simply do not work long term. Some lockdowns are still in place but not publicized much.

For instance, "Follow the science" Biden still has a travel ban between Canada and the US while he lets tens of thousands of untested illegal immigrants in at the southern border. The vaccine has made no difference there.

No, I do not see the vaccines allowing us to "get on with our lives" at all. That is ALL government politics and only government politics in play there. We will see.

Quote from JedRothwell

The new mRNA vaccines can be changed rapidly. Within weeks, if necessary, and they will not need FDA approval.

As often stated here, the mRNA vaccines are supposedly "fast" (a relative term I understand) to re-engineer for mutated variants.

However, I hear a lot about boosters and Israel has even started. Yet they are using the same, unmodified vaccine.

The Delta variant has been around now for months... why has not the vaccines been modified... or are they / have they and I missed it somewhere? I have not even seen any articles stating they were working on a revised version. So what is the deal here?

Is it that "not vaccinating during a pandemic" is even less problematic than "changing the vaccine during a pandemic"? I am not stating this, simply asking the question. If a mRNA strength was it's fast and easy modification, why has this not been done for Delta? Or was this trait simply exaggerated?

It is clear this pandemic is not being won and cases are increasing dramatically again, in spite of the the heralded vaccine roll out. However, the facts are, the world wide cases are not much different than last year when no vaccines were available. They are not making the world impact some here trumpet. I am not saying this, World O Meter is. Yes, there will be many excuses given, but the fact is shown below. Last year versus this year is not much different. Vaccines or no, lock downs or no, the cases are very similar. 5.52 BILLION doses have been given world wide and yet the stats show little effect. 2.9 BILLION people have been fully vaccinated and yet World o Meter shows little effect. Yes, I understand what some will say...and Israel data would disagree with them. India data will disagree with them. UK and US data will disagree with them.

We can spin it however we like... however, world wide, the pandemic is not being impacted much. More cases and more deaths now. Unless a different approach is taken, I do not see it changing much. Booster shots of the same vaccine is certainly not the answer if 5.52 billion doses (40% of the world population is fully vaccinated) did not make much of an impact.

how many covid vaccines have been given world wide - Google Suche

World wide

World wide

USA

Quote from Fm1

Hospitals in Oklahoma have been so backed up with ivermectin overdoses that gunshot victims are unable to receive treatment quickly.

Just a note on this as some here are quick to point out "fake news" by "anti- vaxers". It seems the vaccine warriors are just as guilty.

This report is almost certainly false. When I first read about it, I was curious as to if it were true. If so, it would certainly be big news and more importantly important information as Ivermectin is a proven safe drug. For ER's to be filled with Ivermectin overdoses would be quite incredibile.

So I did some research and this story is completely unsubstantiated.

1) I could find no supportive articles... only a rehash of the same one. A certain Dr. Jason McElyea, was the cited source. No confirming reports I could find.

2) The report and republished reprints had NO data. Simply claims...without any supportive evidence... such as to which hospital the ER was "filled" with. No numbers, no dates, no facts... just "ER filled".

3)The "report" being republished by main stream is now stating "Oklahoma ER's", note the plural, giving the impression that all or at least several ER's are full! The reports now even state that "gunshot victims", note again plural...are being kept from the ER. Again, this would be quite the news if true.... Oklahoma has a quite low gun violence rate... now if this were left wing Chicago...... This propaganda method is the often used technique to make an issue seem larger,,, even when the story is not true to begin with.

4) I tried to find the hospital name so I could give them a call... I could not find any reference in any story,

5) The side effects of Ivermectin would never pre-empt a gun shot wound. The published effects are diarrhea, dizziness and nausea. Hardly life threatening.

In spite of this story being false, mainstream has been quick to jump on board and widely report it... all without facts.

hmmmm..... as stated before... anything that may compete with vaccines MUST be buried quickly and completely.

Edited update....

Below is a retraction from "The Rolling Stone" who had earlier published the same repeated story.... at least they had the integrity of printing a retraction.... note the hospital stated there had been ZERO ivermectin overdoses at their facility, much less ER's full. Talk about outright disinformation campaign by mass media!

UPDATE: Northeastern Hospital System Sequoyah issued a statement: Although Dr. Jason McElyea is not an employee of NHS Sequoyah, he is affiliated with a medical staffing group that provides coverage for our emergency room. With that said, Dr. McElyea has not worked at our Sallisaw location in over 2 months. NHS Sequoyah has not treated any patients due to complications related to taking ivermectin. This includes not treating any patients for ivermectin overdose. All patients who have visited our emergency room have received medical attention as appropriate. Our hospital has not had to turn away any patients seeking emergency care. We want to reassure our community that our staff is working hard to provide quality healthcare to all patients. We appreciate the opportunity to clarify this issue and as always, we value our community’s support.”

Gunshot Victims Wait as Horse Dewormer Overdoses Overwhelm Hospitals - Rolling Stone

Quote from THHuxleynew

(but of low prevision, unlike the high precision remdesivir evidence of the same)

Come now...this is exactly why many here take exception to such posts.

Remdesivir is even dismissed by the WHO. If it had "high precision" evidence, surely they would endorse it. Yet they officially removed it from the approved list.

And as W would say (probably)... the one unsubstaniated case you site above overrides the millions of successful cases in India? Really? You deny India success yet believe one completely factless (no medical facts provided) case of a self nedicated person?

If so I can then ascribe that I personally took Ivernectin after a positive test. Within 24 hours all symptoms where gone. Therefore Ivermectin works.

It is true in my case. I did take it. But I do not say it is proof. Your fact void report of a death is no more meaningful than my above "assertion".

This is truly a tribal argument for most here and more so for the "vaccine warriors". Most pro-ivermectin posters here have been vaccinated. They simply state the vaccines are failing and other tactics should be employed in conjunction. (Perhaps not vaccinating the young with an untested mRNA for long term effects)

Vaccine warriors however are absolutely enamored. There is no other solution other than vaccines and anything "better" than vaccines must be dismissed. That is why renedisivir us not dismissed. Not because it works, but because it's horrible price and ineffectiveness poses no threat to vaccines.

Ivernectin and other low cost alternatives pose a threat and that cannot be tolerated...... as has been stated here..... ivermectin may convince many not to get the shot. That is why you dismiss it, not because of faulty studies.

There is zero long term safety studies for the vaccine, yet you repeatedly state it is very likely long term safe. Yet you have no scientific basis for that claim. You strongly dismiss Ivermectin even though there is evidence it works. CERTAINLY more evidence than mRNA long term safety.

This is evidence of strong bias clouding reason.

Quote from JedRothwell

Gov. DeSantis and other members of the GOP Death Cult have recently claimed the Delta COVID surge was caused by Biden. They say he is allowing hoards of sick illegal immigrants in from Mexico, putting them on buses, and sending them to Florida and other states. Most unvaccinated people are Republicans, and most of them believe this, as shown in this public opinion poll:

More pure political bull shit from Rothwell. He is so politically motivated he cannot even see it, as most liberal elites seem to be. "Liberal elite syndrome" it is called.

Biden IS letting THOUSANDS of infected migrants in and sending them across the country.. ...without quarantine requirements. Yet do you deny this?

Do you think that is OK and not causing any issues? I doubt you will address this because you cannot and keep Biden in a good light.

You completely dodge the real question by trying to throw BS and call names, which are mostly spinned lies anyway.

How about Obama's big maskless birthday bash? (Posts and videos from party goers were demanded to be deleted so the "crime" would not be seen. Really?)

How about Chicago's Lolapolooza's huge crowds ? Where the insane Democratic mayor attended. The mayor who recently had her own police force physically turn their backs on her as she tries to abolish the police.... as the liberal democrats are doing in all their cities...and record murder rates now in all of them..

(PS.. record marijuanna sales was made at Lolalopooza, I am sure smoking all those joints in crowds was really controlling the spread! )

Wait.. those don't count cause those were Democratic Socialist events... the virus stays away from those Democrat socialist events...just like the migrants crossing the border are immune to spreading it.

Yes, every time I see this "GOP death cult" crap, I will simply respond with "Liberal Democratic anarchists calling for police abolishment while the murder rate soars to record highs in Democratic lead cities) meme.

i guess we can call Rothwell the "anti-police murder cultist" since he is connected to that party and he seems to throw everyone into prejudiced collections, we can do the same to him!

So as you can see, we can throw political BS right back at you as well!

Absolute political blindness indeed! You have lost all credibility. By the way... how is your "a leader that should be followed" thoughts turning out?

Quote from JedRothwell

Gov. Cuomo -- who I now designate a world-class expert on this subject

Really!?? Ask all the New York nursing home families about this who lost thousands of loved ones... talk about who caused deaths! But Cuomo is a liberal and must not be criticized! But a GOP will be called a death cultist simply because they are a republican.

Quote from JedRothwell

Here is a SUPERB presentation by Gov. Cuomo of New York. This is one of the best analyses of the situation I have seen. It is one of the best examples of good leadership since FDR.

Hmmm. good leadership indeed..... Let's see... who is getting impeached lately??? Yes, good leadership indeed!

Oh well... this just goes to show how a person's view is so clouded by political affiliation....

CDC says unvaccinated is twice as likely to get re-infected as vaccinated.

Coronavirus Disease 2019

CDC provides credible COVID-19 health information to the U.S.

www.cdc.gov

THH will certainly like this article posted on the official CDC. Since he criticizes TSN for being biased and not providing links or qualified sources!

So this report has several links proving the assertation.... wait... no links?

This report has detailed content of an RCT.... wait.... no RCT? Certainly some here will then tag this as untrustworthy and one should not pay attention to it.....

The report was on a large number of subject, thus proving it's accuracy.... wait...NO? A small, non-randomized nor control group study? While making the CERTAIN assertation that unvaccinated people are 2.31 times more likely? Yes, THH will surely trash this study as being completely unscientific without control, without double blind, without taking age groups into account.... etc. etc..

Surely this report will irritate THH as it clearly shows bias and lacks any supporting evidence while maintaining a CERTAINTY of scientific fact!

OR

are there a different set of scales used for TSN versus the official CDC website? Good for the goose?

Sorry, I simply could not help. (May not sorry?) TSN is a news site (as in it's name) making public service announcements. It is not Nature or the CDC. I do not see some here bashing CNN for there biased, unsourced and non-qualified reporters....... nor the CDC for making unsupported claims either.

TSN may not link to the exact studies, but they do give their sources and the sources are qualified... at least as much as others.

Quote from JedRothwell

If everyone would do what the Biden administration asks them to do, the pandemic would end in a month.

Pure BS and rhetoric!

How about Israel? Pandemic ending in a month there? (Only the highest per capita vaccinated)

How about Japan? No spectators at the Olympics.... pandemic ending in a month there? (One of the most regimented societies.) So what is Biden asking that Japan is not?

How about S. Korea? Your "they are doing it right" model. Yes, they do have much lower cases but the pandemic certainly is not over in a month there either! So what is Biden asking that S. Korea is not?

Again, what is Biden asking that will end the pandemic? Do not wear masks (just 2 months ago)... oh wait... wear masks now!.... Exactly WHAT is he asking that was not done before? Other than vaccines being totally available now when none was available before. So please inform me what is Biden asking that will stop the pandemic in one month! Pure BS.

If this was the prior administration, you would be posting daily about how every bit of this surge is 100% Trump's fault and the administration is intentionally killing people. Yet, a different administration with just as bad results is blameless. Typical Cuomo / CNN logic!

So the above statement is pure rhetoric, baseless and political.

Yes, the virus is mutating. The current vaccines are not going to stop it. (see Israel, see everywhere) The vaccines will keep mutating. BS about administration's ability to stop it is simply political rhetoric. NO country is stopping it Science will need to implement another strategy if this pandemic is ever going to be over.... possibly a combination of early treatment and vaccine.