Mat Lewan Meets Rossi in Sweden, Rossi Bidding on Factory For QuarkX Production

Thomas Clarke wrote: "I think you'd better question that. COP < 1 is a physical impossibility without some (presumably nuclear, given the large accumulated energy deficit) endothermic reaction in Rossi's reactor..."

As I made clear previously, I mean the COP in the fluid. In HVAC applications they measure the COP of the hot water or steam, not the entire system. Heat losses from the boiler walls are not included.

A scientist with a calorimeter might try to estimate losses. That is, heat not captured by the flow of cooling fluid in a mass-flow calorimeter.

Rossi's device is a suboptimal electric boiler.

Thomas talks about Fukushima like it's over.

But it's not over. Far from it. And they don't know how to decommision the reactors. Can't go inside. Even robots stop working after short time. So they don't know the extreme final costs of Fukushima that will haunt the Japanese for centuries to Come.

And they don't know where core went, that is how far into the ground it's now located. Many experts believe the three reactor cores have melted even through the concrete basement floor. Which means the ground water will be contaminated even more.

And the Industry talk about Cheap fission nuclear power, not counting in the imense costs of Chernobyl and Fukushima, and the future accidents to come.

Because there will be future accidents, can't be avoided. The next may occur in New York City or outside Paris, who knows. it's just a matter of probability, and probability will never be zero, so accidents will occur. But it's not Worth it, so better find another energy source ... .fast.

Actually If you look at the economics of the new Nuclear projects in UK (like Hinkley Point) or in Finland or in USA, you find they are the most expensive energy source there is. But it's sold as the opposite. What an irony.

Hank Mills wrote: "Here is one of your posts. I remember others being more severe in which you stated that for safety reasons the technology should be put into a government research lab for a period of five years to be thoroughly tested."

For crying out loud! What makes you think I meant it should ONLY be put in a government lab? Or that it should be kept secret?

You completely misunderstand. I had no such thought. I meant that all major technology has to be tested by the government, and also by Underwriter's Laboratory to ensure safety. It also has to be tested for safety and efficiency by industrial corporations, universities and so on. Organizations such as ASME have to set standards and publish guides so that engineers know how to work with the machinery. Federal and state governments have to set standards, safety and inspection laws to ensure the technology used safely. Accidents have to be simulated. All of this has to be done for all new technology, including prosaic, incremental improvements to conventional technology, such a hybrid automobiles and solar panel inverters. Naturally, it will have to be done for cold fusion. It will cost billions, but in the end it will save far more money than it costs, just as crash-testing of automobiles saves money. It may add some time to the development, but not much. It will take years before mass production can begin in any case. It took about 10 years to develop the Prius, as I recall, and about $1 billion. No doubt it will cost a lot more than that to develop cold fusion.

"I'm trying to find the posts now. If I'm wrong or my memory is off, I'll apologize openly."

You need not apologize, but it would help if you would read what I wrote, use some common sense, and not go off on some crazy conspiracy theory about the government seizing technology and magically hiding it.

Jed - Thank you for stepping up to do battle with fibmongers of Team Rossi. Please don't wear yourself out on the haters and fog generators. Their goal is to get you sucked into a circular argument with the objective of trying to trip you up. They do the same on Vortex and CMNS. You've masterfully manhandled all of the pajama boys, put them all to bed and proven that none of them can hang with you anyway - pretty work!

Quote from Hank Mills

I agree he does not look healthy. But I don't agree with the implication that this is from radiation. Most of what I see is easily caused by a poor diet, bad sleeping pattern, lack of exercise, and stress.

Oh I agree with you there Hank. I have seen no evidence to believe that Rossi has sustained any poisoning of any kind, I was just pointing out that his dramatic change in appearance over just a few months appears to show a serious downturn in health.

Hank Mills quotes me: "In my opinion, if the NRC and equivalent European regulators do not step
in and insist that the Rossi devices be turned off immediately, they will be grossly negligent. Criminally negligent."

I was assuming this actually is a cold fusion reactor. Sometime later I learned that it is nothing but an electric water heater.

If it actually was a cold fusion reactor, running such a large machine in a high population area of Florida would be criminal negligence. And insane. At least 6 cold fusion reactors have gone out of control and exploded for reasons no one understands. They caused little damage because they were small. The worst damage I know of was to Mizuno. The explosion drove a glass shard about 1 cm into his neck. Fortunately it missed an artery. It was so loud he had difficulty hearing for the rest of the day.

http://lenr-canr.org/?page_id=187#PhotosAccidents

Until the nature of cold fusion is better understood, and the reaction can be controlled with confidence, I think it is unwise to scale up the reaction even to 1 kW.

Hank Mills wrote: "We know the great lengths the military industrial complex went to in order to develop the bombs that were dropped on Japan. There was a huge amount of secrecy, departmentalization, etc."

Yes. That is because it was a war. All weapons development during war is kept secret. Other technology developed mainly by the government, or exclusively by the the government, such as computers, lasers, the Internet, the human genome project, space craft, weather forecasting and the GPS have not been kept secret.

LENR calendar wrote: "I think it is still likely that the 100.1C value is wrong, given that it came from IH."

I think it almost certainly wrong, given that it came from Rossi. I do not trust him, and I don't trust his instruments, because he does not calibrate or cross check. Also, he tends to lie, and he uses suspiciously round numbers, such as what he told Lewan: 36 tons of mass flow water a day. Exactly 36 tons.

Based on various factors I think this temperature is 2 or 3 deg C too high.

Quote from oystla

Thomas talks about Fukushima like it's over.

But it's not over. Far from it. And they don't know how to decommision the reactors. Can't go inside. Even robots stop working after short time. So they don't know the extreme final costs of Fukushima that will haunt the Japanese for centuries to Come.

Until yesterday I had a solid impression of Thomas way to handle this formus topics.

But after his today's posting's (mostly, just repeating old stuff..) , we know it for sure. He posts what he is supposed to post.

His silly confession that he is not academic... had to learn .. is just a nice try to convince a grand mam but not an educated professional.

Just be aware: The wolfs are in ! Don't listen to them. Don't even notice them! The arn't worth it.

Quote from Kei

Did you really just produce a wall of text trying to dismiss Fukushima as an anecdotal incident with no severe consequences? : D

No I did not do that.

My post

I'm wondering if you are confused about this: if your summary above refers to my post it shows bad errors!

So once again, Rossi never published a 100.1C temperature value. He has repeated 3 times in his blog that this value is bogus.

It might be in the report, since both Dewey and Jed have pulled that value from there, but then it is not a value from Rossi but from Penon.

Again, my hypothesis is that if this value is in the report, this could be because Penon is ignoring the power needed to heat the water from 60C to 99C and above 100.1C.

Rossi just confirmed that Penon ignored the power needed to heat up the steam above 100C:

Quote

Rossi (JONP): Yes, the ERV ignored also the energy spent to heat the steam above the boiling point, as well as the energy necessary to raise the temperature of the water from circa 60-70 °C to the boiling point, to be conservative.

LENR calendar wrote: "Would it not be possible to measure 1MW with a margin of error of 90% (i.e. 100kW + which would mean COP>5) if pressure and temperature were measured and under a less error prone scenario than 100.1C/1 atm?"

Yes. This is not only possible, it is mandatory. All industrial boilers have to be periodically inspected and tested. The tests includes a measure of efficiency (COP). A boiler that produces less than the nameplate efficiency is damaged or old and must be fixed. The methods of testing are spelled out in detail in state laws, which mainly refer to sections of ASME performance test codes:

https://www.asme.org/about-asm…ds/performance-test-codes

http://www.myfloridacfo.com/di…lerSafetyBrochure2015.pdf

http://www.myfloridacfo.com/Di…BoilerSafetyRules2016.pdf

Any licensed HVAC engineer in Florida who works with large boilers could do this.

Rossi's methods do not begin to meet code. They are nuts. That is why he almost caused an explosion when he tested a smaller reactor when the people from NASA were visiting him.

@Dewey Weaver

Could you spend a bit more time on the ERV report with an open mind and check if the 100.1C value that you saw everywhere could just be a placeholder for Penon to calculate a conservative value of power?

Is there another column for output temperature in the raw data? Is there one for pressure?

My belief is that Penon calculated power needed to heat water from 99.9 to 100.1C, thus being conservative. As long as ouput water was significantly past the boiling point (and the other columns of data would confirm that), I don't see what would be wrong with that.

Dewey, maybe you would prefer not to say, but if you were to venture a guess, do you think IH will formally respond to the lawsuit by June 12th, or do you think they will file an extension and we won't here their side of the case in the near future?

Quote from hank

The Japanese government and TEMPCO covered up the severity of the Fukushima melt downs. A massive amount of radioactive fuel (and spent fuel rods) was released into the atmosphere and into the ground water. I read just a few days ago that pieces of fuel rods were found miles away in the forest, recently. Plutonium is highly dangerous -- even more so than Uranium if I understand correctly. Neither of these two substances should ever be used as fuels.

Perhaps you could check whether what you read was accurate. Here is a vivid account of the current situation
http://www.popsci.com/fukushima-five-years-later

Quote from oystla

Thomas talks about Fukushima like it's over.But it's not over. Far from it. And they don't know how to decommision the reactors. Can't go inside. Even robots stop working after short time. So they don't know the extreme final costs of Fukushima that will haunt the Japanese for centuries to Come.And they don't know where core went, that is how far into the ground it's now located. Many experts believe the three reactor cores have melted even through the concrete basement floor. Which means the ground water will be contaminated even more.And the Industry talk about Cheap fission nuclear power, not counting in the imense costs of Chernobyl and Fukushima, and the future accidents to come.

It is true that long-lived isotopes are not "over" for a long time. But the likely risks from now on are small, and overall the accident was much less bad than Chernobyl (my point). It is easy to write up a scare story about possible future perils - the word nuclear on its own does that. I find that to work out the real likely dangers I need to read both sides, see where they differ, and drill down to what is the evidence over the area of difference. I did this a bit over Fukushima and it appeared to me much less bad than the popular write-ups would have you think.

And you make the common polemic mistake of mixing up unsafe old-style reactors with inherently safe modern ones. Why do this?

The risks to the whole world from global warming, in deaths, hardship, potential global disaster, are much much higher than from modern nuclear reactors.

This is getting off topic, but it is true that a large mass of radioactive debris from the Fukushima plant has spread over a large area. How much there is, and how much reached the land as opposed to the ocean is difficult to measure for many reasons. You need to be careful not to jump to conclusions.

I read about this in the Japanese mass media, and I heard about it from Tadahiko Mizuno, who is a cold fusion researcher with a degree in nuclear engineering. He and other superannuated 1960s nuclear engineers were dragged out retirement and set to work trying to measure the radiation. In places it was so high, they were afraid to work with the samples. Elsewhere it was below background. For example, in a field there may be nothing, but in a drainage ditch or stream nearby it may be quite high.

One indication of how widespread the debris might be was reported by NHK (Japanese National TV) in 2014. They report that 90,000 people have been dislocated from the towns and farms around the reactors. Wildlife has increased tremendously in the depopulated areas, especially wild boars. Quoting NHK: "Tests of the meat from boars shot in Fukushima Prefecture show radioactive cesium at levels up to 61,000 becquerels, which is 610 times the maximum allowed by government safety standards" (for meat consumption).

Some of these animals have been taken 50 to 100 km away from the reactor. The boars eat plants that have concentrated surface radioactive debris.

Some types of plants have little radioactive material in them, while others have levels that -- according to present medical knowledge -- would certainly cause illness in people, if people ate them. Although the boars are surprisingly healthy. Boars and pigs tend to like the same foods people do. The scientists are learning a lot about the effects of radioactivity on botany and biology. This is what you call unwelcome knowledge.