The Industrial Heat Answer

Quote from sifferkoll

It was also shortly after Darden visited the plant together with APCO operative Brian McLaughlin (ex.19)

This is the most interesting thing I've seen from Sifferkoll. Nice catch, Torkel. So I started looking. What was the email address with the cc with the IH March announcement. I've been looking. It would not be surprising if it was McLaughlin.

I do not draw the same conclusions. People who live on the blogs have a warped view of life. From Cherokee, which deals with environmental remediation projects, Darden would have connections in Washington, for sure, and some Cherokee projects may require public relations work. As I wrote before, that someone at APCO might be advising IH, pro bono or as an APCO client, would not be surprising. But this was surprising to see from our own Alan Smith:

Quote

Alan Smith • 4 months ago
Astroturf is my conclusion
Trolls who love to spread confusion
While right now they’re easy meat
APCO’s lot will be more discreet
Sneaking round the E-cat blogs
Like a pack of mangy dogs
They’re well trained in crafty tricks
What a bunch of clever Dicks

It seems to us there’s been collusion
A plot to buy up all cold fusion
But secrets cannot be contained
Wrapped in patents, all constrained
The truth will out, and Darden’s boys
Will have to share their shiny toys

For though the thought makes bankers weep
Some secrets really are too big to keep.

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Looking at the history of the revelation of the "APCO connection", back in March, it seems to have been assumed without question that if the email was cc'd to an APCO address -- and so far, even though the email was received by Lewan and Acland and others, I couldn't find a revelation of the actual address -- then necessarily APCO had been "hired." Quite simply, that does not follow. Someone at APCO was *interested* is what I conclude. And it could well be McLaughlin. And this is essentially meaningless. To jump from this to an APCO campaign on the blogs is a paranoid stretch. That's how the paranoid mind works. It finds some shred of evidence -- or even sometimes a hallucination or sensory interpretation -- and runs with it and constructs a whole world-view.

Okay, found it, with Mats Lewan, another post in April:
https://animpossibleinvention.…truth-on-rossi-ih-affair/

Quote

The person at APCO who was cc:ed when IH sent out its statement was Mr. Brian McLaughlin, who is also mentioned by Sifferkoll.

Which explains why Sifferkoll immediately recognized the name....

From the level of coincidence here, I consider it conclusive that the Brian McLaughlin who visited the plant, as mentioned, as being Brian McLaughlin of APCO.

Industrial Heat was, by then, looking ahead. Now, to advise re PR, McLaughlin would not need to travel to Florida to see the Plant. I think this evidences personal interest. And Darden accommodated it. Wouldn't you? And he may well be advising them.

Coordinating an army of sock puppets, no.

If there were some public battle, say legislation pending, or an election with a candidate they needed to support, and if they were hired for it, yes, maybe. Not for this obscure topic with where blogs and fora make no practical difference. More likely, and more powerfully and more economically, they would then organize a "grass-roots effort."

There is no such organized effort "attacking Rossi." There are a handful of writers with long interest in LENR writing opinions, as they have for many years. There are the usual pseudoskeptics, as there always have been. Increasingly, writers who supported Rossi, or the possibility of Rossi Reality, have turned. The basis for that is not blog FUD, it is the evidence that has been appearing, starting with Rossi's suit in itself. That immediately made any fundraising by Rossi far more difficult. It also generated reams of information to consider. The Answer has created much more, there is massive detail about what had been secret and concealed.

Quote from Alan Smith

Let us not overlook the fact that this is just your opinion. As for IH being stupid - they were either stupid to sign, or stupid not to pay - stupid both ways by your logic.

People who readily judge "stupid" are not necessarily the brightest bulbs in the pack.

It looks to me like IH got what they wanted by signing. They wanted to know. (and if the technology turned out to be real, to make large bundles of profit.) So now they know.

And those who have lots of money to invest, and who are institutionally careful where they put it, appear to have agreed. That $11.5 million investment was amplified later, by at least $50 million from Woodford, which was not put into Rossi technology, as far as we know -- though it may have supported IH continuing operations, and might be supporting legal expenses, for example. IHHI, which is where that money went, owns IH and might do what is minimal to keep it afloat, since it owns the License which is a major hedge against what Planet Rossi is calling an "October Surprise."

Rossi and Peter Gluck are claiming an additional $100 million, probably from the Chinese. I have seen no confirmation of that, but Darden is definitely working with China.

I will agree that if the technology clearly works, and if Rossi actually taught them how to make devices that would work without liberal and constant application of Rossi Grease, they'd have been stupid not to raise that money, because they could have. These people were experts at raising money, if it can be done without deception. They disclose risks and known negatives and probably everything they can make up that could happen to create a loss. These people are dealing with high-level investors, with deep pockets. the last thing they would want is a lawsuit from an investor. And in spite of those articles that Planet Rossi likes to point to, I have seen no investor lawsuits, only investigative reporters claiming that something stinks, and who are these out-of-state crooks with expensive shoes and fancy lawyers, anyway? The usual xenophobia.

Quote

My own suspicion (and it is no more than that) is that E-Cat works, but that IH feel that both its reliability and performance don't live up to what they imagined, or what AR claimed. In other words, they have been 'short-changed'.

No Alan. If IH could get appreciable energy from the ecats, they would make every effort to work with Rossi instead of countersuing him, claiming that his devices simply do not work. They couldn't be more clear on that score!

Quote from Alan Smith

Abd Ul-Rahman Lomax wrote:

I agree, Dewey, Guest and a few others are very well known as long-time writers on science and technology.

Dewey was certainly not long-established and shows no sign of blog sophistication. So ... Dewey initially wrote with a pseudonym at E-Catworld. He commented similarly on the Lewan blog. This is someone with an obvious conflict of interest, an IH investor, known, it's not in controversy. The issue here is of some organized effort, Sifferkoll has been claiming "paid FUD"ders" But then he names who? Dewey, Jed Rothwell, me, and there is FredZ something-or-other, about whom I know next to nothing. Guest, of course, is anyone who shows up, if I'm correct.

Alan, give it up. There is no campaign coordinated, APCO or otherwise.

Rossi is screwed, by his own work. And all those who are working on "confirming" the Rossi effect are in a tough situation. We know from years of experience with LENR that if you do a bunch of experiments, using techniques and approaches that are not well-studied, you can come up with "interesting results."

NiH work will continue, but that effort has largely been fueled by a belief that Rossi had real results worth investigating. It is now retreating to a minor bypath, weakly confirmed (compared to PdD), and not the main show. That has to hurt if you have spent some years working on it. But those are the breaks. I actually like and approve greatly of your efforts to make it easier to research these effects. Parkhomov's latest report seems interesting, but that's one report. Let's see where it goes!

IH were stupid not to require ironclad testing by truly independent and truly competent testers AHEAD of paying Rossi ANY money. Anyone investing in LENR should require proof that the proposed process absolutely works before giving money, the one exception being the funding of legitimate basic research such as may be being done by the Kimmel Institute and maybe a few others. Anyone claiming to have working high power reactors should be (MUST BE) subjected to extensive and rigorous testing PRIOR to investment. This is where IH and Darden screwed the pooch and IMO, with Brillouin and probably others, they are STILL doing it (screwing the pooch).

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/screw_the_pooch

Quote from THHuxley

That said, I still think IH have an improved version of the E-cat that they now claim as their own. The evidence for that is also quite apparent.

IH have a Court process in front of them with Discovery. they have said they cannot get Rossi's stuff to work. At all. If they have something based on his technology that does work this will come out and "equitable conduct" or whatever will mean that therefore they lose. So since they appear well legally advised I think it highly unlikley they have what you claim.

In addition, I have seen no evidence for your speculation that they have a working improved version of ecat.

The Answer leaves a little wiggle room. Suppose the Rossi IP didn't work. But suppose, then, they found a tweak that made it work. This would be a derivative invention patentable.

Remember that weird patent IH filed that included, in a later version, the Lugano report? They filed that patent before Lugano. This is what I've figured out. If the Lugano technology were not patented, there would be a risk that the demonstration would disclose a critical feature and ruin patentability. Patent first, then demonstrate! Rossi had not patented that design. So they did, before the test. And then they tossed in the Lugano report when it became available. This was all CYA, precautionary.

They were totally free under the License to do this. If that new invention were marketed outside their territory, there would be an issue to work out with Leonardo, that's all.

So when they denied that there was any XE, this was not a claim that IH has never found XE in any testing of any device. Just the Rossi technology, as received.

On the other hand, I consider it unlikely. New directions in LENR are not likely to be built on a Rossi foundation.

I do not follow the "Rossi Saga" on multiple blogs. I used to read ECW some, but it became 90% complete nonsense for me. I started reading this blog on occasion just to pick up "hopefully factual and truthful data".

With that said, I would like to inquire about Mats Lewan. I do not read his blog (if it is still available?) and I see his name pop up on occasion here as well in various posts. I know for a while, he had Rossi's ear to some extent and had done research for his book.

What is his status? Has anyone heard from him at all? When and what was his last public comments on Rossi? Has he dropped of the radar?

Quote from IH Fanboy

JedRothwell wrote:
Again, unless you are an investor or stockholder, this is none of your business.

Well, given the nature of the importance of LENR to humanity, I think it is my business, and yours, and that of everyone. And if IH participated in a fraud in any way, then it would be a matter of public concern as well. I think the video evidence in this case is going to be very interesting, assuming it comes to light.

Sure. However, humanity has created process whereby it expresses itself and makes decisions.

In this case, there is no investigation of fraud and required disclosure unless someone actually harmed has standing and complains. I may think that that insane rich guy running for President is a fraud, but I have no standing to sue him for it. I can't demand that he disclose his records, other than is required by law. If Woodford was misled, they are the ones who have the right to complain. Nobody else. And that's obviously necessary for public order, or else we would see a lot more crap flying about.

Yes, LENR is important, but I started writing in 2011 that if Rossi wanted to be secretive, it was his business, not ours. That this was like a magic show. If nobody was actually cheated -- merely fooled -- so what? I said, then, that I assumed he was telling the truth to any investors.

Apparently not. He was lying to them, too, but managed to set things up so he could wiggle out. He bought licenses back. So it was like a Ponzi scheme, he paid off the early investors or at least they got their money back, while attracting bigger money.

Ponzi schemes eventually collapse.

Quote from Bob

With that said, I would like to inquire about Mats Lewan. I do not read his blog (if it is still available?) and I see his name pop up on occasion here as well in various posts. I know for a while, he had Rossi's ear to some extent and had done research for his book.

What is his status? Has anyone heard from him at all? When and what was his last public comments on Rossi? Has he dropped of the radar?

Last post on https://animpossibleinvention.com/blog/ was May 16, on the occasion of Rossi's visit to Sweden.

I suspect that Lewan realized he was in over his head. He had shut down comments on his blog, because it was overwhelming. I think I have seen some comments on E-Catworld from Mats Lewan. He is around. His account here shows that he was reading on Saturday, when the Answer news hit.

Quote from "Abdulla FUD factory"

I suspect that Lewan realized he was in over his head.

Well, I suspect you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about, but regardless of that you feel an urge to make this comment .... Wonder why?

Quote from "Abdulla FUD machine"

I do not draw the same conclusions. People who live on the blogs have a warped view of life.

View of life.... Are you serious ABDulla!!!! Lets compare the number of words produced on absolutely nothing; then you can regenerate your definition of "warped"

BTW! APCO as an entity is the definition of malicious. Any connection with them is a sign to watch. Astroturfing is their core business. You know that.

Quote from "Abdullas APCO subsidiary"

Alan, give it up. There is no campaign coordinated, APCO or otherwise.

Oh... But we can be sure Apco is involved at least since july 15. And we can be sure that their core business methods includes professional astroturfing. And we can be sure they would not be involved unless their core competencies are needed... And finally, we can be sure they are not involved unless the agenda suits the establishment. (Not sure.... Have a look at their network of high end politicians and bankers...)

Abd wrote "... that insane rich guy running for president ....."

OK, I cannot resist.... are you saying he is insanely rich or that he is richly insane ! ? ! :crazy: