Quote from JedRothwell

It is outrageous that Messinger bills himself as "Senior Energy Analyst," he attended cold fusion conferences, yet he does not realize this

You simply should ignore idiots that have no clue of physics/chemistry.

Quote from Alan Smith

He visited my lab

IMHO the simple expts that your lab has done are way ahead of the anything the Cavendish

has done

Breakthrough is 100 yrs old there

Jonah Messinger

Jonah Messinger is a non-resident Senior Energy Analyst at the Breakthrough Institute, where he studies fusion technology and policy. He is also a Winton…

thebreakthrough.org

Quote from RobertBryant

Breakthrough

Jonah Messinger

" How might LENR be expected to fit into the vast nuclear energy innovation ecosystem? The nuclear technology landscape can be thought of as a spectrum from low science risk but high engineering or deployment risk on one end, and high science risk but low engineering or deployment risk on the other.LENR is firmly on the latter end of the spectrum."

wishy washy concepts...

rather than a vast ecosystem its more like a host-parasite relationship

where the host is taxpayer funded institutions

and high science risk is more like a high risk to academic reputations based on 100 yr old assumptions

I called that paragraph "bullshit." Messinger took umbrage at this. I should have made it clear that the bullshit did not originate with him. He is quoting other people. I apologize for not making that distinction.

On the other hand, he is now telling me the calorimetry is ambiguous. He should explain why, with reference to textbooks, instrument specifications, and other quantitative, refutable arguments. Just waving your hand and saying "it's ambiguous!" does not count.

The article is well crafted and nuanced to be logically balanced.
There are a few errors I noticed as well, but we should encourage exploration and different points of view on this topic.
All the theories and opinions we have do very little to the body of science imo.

If it is a healthy scientific dialogue we are after, then just give examples of where the article may be correct.
One example is the statement that there is no "LENR is a field without a reference experiment and still subject to both understandable, but respectful, skepticism as well as dismissive scorn and uncollegial mockery."

There is indeed many reference experiments which lack replication for there validity.

Just like the foolish nature of isolating Nuclear from Chemical science, I don't think it is progressive for the field to isolate LENR-Forum from younger academics or more "accredited" institutions.
This works both ways as I don't believe "accredited" institutions should just dismiss the creative endeavors of the independent researcher.

"One never knows what a person is going through in there life, so above all, be kind".

Quote from Diadon Acs

"One neve knows what a person is going through in there life, so above all, be kind"

Actually Jonah is working in Cavendish on Xrays?.. not on cold fusion

My late compatriot there recently died, he wrote a primer on quantum mechanics,

definitely he was part of mainstream academia,

I made an approach to him about CF about two years ago

definitely the response was a cold shoulder

...shortly after he died, sadly, google tells me now

Professor Mark Warner FRS (26 January 1952 - 24 December 2021)

www.corpus.cam.ac.uk

Science moves on .. as Planck said

Jonah gets around...a good communicator... part of the young world

Jonah Messinger and Helium 4 are excited by Cold Fusion | The Rational View podcast with Dr. Al Scott

In this episode I’m revisiting the topic of cold fusion with an MIT-affiliated researcher who is looking into the case for cold fusion. As you may recall, my…

therationalview.podbean.com

Quote from Diadon Acs

there is no "LENR is a field without a reference experiment

Test Results - Brillouin Energy

Quote from Wyttenbach

You simply should ignore idiots that have no clue of physics/chemistry.

There’s no need to be so aggressively indecorous. All it does is reflect poorly on you.

You can’t expect somebody to engage with you in good faith whilst failing to treat them with basic respect.

Quote from RobertBryant

Actually Jonah is working in Cavendish on Xrays?.. not on cold fusion

My late compatriot there recently died, he wrote a primer on quantum mechanics,

definitely he was part of mainstream academia,

I made an approach to him about CF about two years ago

definitely the response was a cold shoulder

...shortly after he died, sadly, google tells me now

https://www.corpus.cam.ac.uk/a…ary-1952-24-december-2021

Science moves on .. as Planck said

Jonah gets around...a good communicator... part of the young world

https://therationalview.podbea…e-excited-by-cold-fusion/

Display More

I believe he is well versed in that field and X-ray emissions. I wonder if he is familiar with SLAC and what Stanford is doing?
My understanding is he is interested in X-ray stimulation of deuterated lattices? I could be wrong though and I would have to do some digging which I can't make time for atm.

We can lead a horse to water, but can't make them drink if they aren't thirsty. My apologies for the analogies, but I think it helps get the point across without writing a paragraph.
Plank was quite an incredible man with a clear picture of science from what I can gather and he had a principle regarding this. I agree whole heartily with his quote.

An important scientific innovation rarely makes its way by gradually winning over and converting its opponents: it rarely happens that Saul becomes Paul. What does happen is that its opponents gradually die out, and that the growing generation is familiarized with the ideas from the beginning: another instance of the fact that the future lies with the youth.

— Max Planck, Scientific autobiography, 1950, p. 33, 97

I don't think Death has to be only in the physical realm.
I have died psychologically a few times in my life as nature smacked me with hard doses of reality.

This particular scientific endeavor (LENR/CMNS) seems to be on the boundary of observable physics, so perhaps all one can really do is direct there line of questioning towards the patterns of nature, and do there best to listen without fooling one's self?

I would take a bet that Mr. Messinger also gets similar responses from Professors and very intelligent academics when he brings up the topic of LENR and Condensed Matter Nuclear Science for energy production. 😅

Quote from Wyttenbach

https://brillouinenergy.com/test-results

I think this may be one of many experiments which demonstrate a phenomenon that isn't well understand and even less agreed upon in scientific communities. 😅
Not quite sure how to reconcile these challenges and perhaps it is something that will be worked out in time with diligent and consistent efforts? 🤷‍♀️

Quote from Diadon Acs

Plank was quite an incredible man with a clear picture of science from what I can gather and he had a principle regarding this. I agree whole heartily with his quote.

not so fast...

Post

RE: This paper shows how LENR can win

[…]

Interestingly, this seems to go against the conclusions of this 1988 study: Age Differences in the Reception of New Scientific Theories: The Case of Plate Tectonics Theory

[…]


If the example of CF research in the late 80s / early 90s is used - it is interesting to note that the main proponents were mostly elderly, and more experienced, researchers. They were certainly not the "eager young scientists, with radical new ideas" that is meant to be the progressive group implied in the often…

Frogfall

Sep 26th 2022

Young researchers are in a very vulnerable position - and have to be careful not to wreck their careers before they have even got started. It is possibly worse now than in Planck's day. Back then science was often for the independently wealthy - as a lot of junior research positions were unpaid.

For those with exotic interests...

Dear Colleague,

You may be interested in the following free collection of 26 Open Access papers by various authors
for your virtual library that we prepared following a number of requests

HADRONIC MATHEMATICS,
MECHANICS AND CHEMISTRY

https://www.santilli-foundation.org/docs/HMMC.pdf

Collection of OA papers Published by the
American Journal of Modern Physics
Volume 4, Issue 5-1, 2015, Part 1: Hadronic Mathematics
Volume 5, Issue 2-1, 2016, Part 2: Hadronic Mechanics
Volume 6, Issue 4-1, 2017, Part 3: Hadronic Chemistry

The R. M. Santilli Foundation
Website: http://santilli-foundation-org
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This collection is solely available in free pdf access without any hard copy.

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Quote from Frogfall

Young researchers are in a very vulnerable position

I think Jonah's research has low "science risk"

the last research was on Co-60 decay energy conversion... proof of concept

https://443.ece.illinois.edu/files/2021/05/GammaCellMessingerReport.pdf

on the other hand his verbal communications such as

"deuterons are an excited state of helium4"

may need a bit of experimental/theoretical backup

CleanPlanet (JP) represented by

Masami Hayashi

Global Strategy Director, Clean Planet Inc

Presents at a TedX in Boston

Planetary Stewardship | November 2023 - TEDxBoston

tedxboston.com

CO2-free “Quantum Hydrogen Energy"

Here's a forecast:

Carbon countdown 2038 - LENR News

Stephen Bannister is Director and Chair of the Master of Science in International Affairs and Global Enterprise and…

lenr-news.com

Also, was this posted?

Esa Ruoho has archived some history:

Index of /keelynet/

Quote from rubycarat

Also, was this posted?

Esa Ruoho has archived some history:

https://www.merlib.org/keelynet/

Hi, so, ever since Jerry Decker died, KeelyNet went down. my aim with MERLib is to bring back as much lost-to-the-world old archival data, and the legendary KeelyNET BBS content is just the beginning. A lot of people have died in the last two decades, and their life's work is lost (looking at you, Energy From The Vacuum DVD Science Series, episodes 34 to 46 are lost to the world and nobody seems to have them, for instance. if you have them, please let me know).

One of the objectives of the MERLib reboot is to bring back these old articles and crossindex them together with wordsearch etc. So much has been lost.

The most powerful cosmic ray since the Oh-My-God particle puzzles scientists

Scientists spot a particle of intense energy, but explaining where it came from might require some new physics.

www.nature.com

Scientists have detected the most powerful cosmic ray seen in more than three decades. But the exact origin of this turbocharged particle from outer space remains a mystery, with some suggesting that it could have been generated by unknown physics.

The puzzling cosmic ray had an estimated energy of 240 exa-electronvolts (EeV; 10¹⁸ electronvolts), making it comparable to the most powerful cosmic ray ever detected, aptly named the Oh-My-God particle, which measured at around 320 EeV when it was discovered in 1991. The findings were published today in Science¹.

“It’s amazing because you have to think of what could produce such high energy,” says Clancy James, an astronomer at Curtin University in Perth, Australia.

A cosmic ray, despite its name, is actually a high-energy subatomic particle — often a proton — that zips through space at close to the speed of light. In their ultrahigh-energy form, cosmic rays have energy levels that exceed one EeV, which is around one million times greater than those reached by the most powerful human-made particle accelerators. Cosmic rays with energies of more than 100 EeV are rarely spotted — fewer than one of these particles arrives on each square kilometre of Earth each century.

Li–Pd–Rh-D2O electrochemistry experiments at elevated voltage

Carl Gotzmer, Louis F. DeChiaro, Kenneth Conley, Marc Litz, Marshall Millett, Jesse Ewing, Lawrence P. Forsley, Karen J. Long, William A. Wichart, Pamela A. Mosier-Boss, John Sullivan, Efrem Perry, Jr., and Oliver M. Barham

AFFILIATIONS

NSWC Indian Head Division, Indian Head, Maryland 20640, USA

NSWC Dahlgren Division, Dahlgren, Virginia 22448, USA

Energetics Technology Center, Indian Head, Maryland 20640, USA

Army Research Laboratory, Adelphi, Maryland 20783, USA

U.S. Naval Academy, Annapolis, Maryland 21402, USA

JWK Corporation, Annandale, Virginia 22003, USA

Fibretek Incorporated, Herndon, Virginia 20171, USA

Barham Scientific LLC, Washington, DC 20017, USA

Submitted: 30 April 2023, Accepted: 1 November 2023

"In 2013, the U.S. Navy disclosed an electrochemistry procedure intended to produce MeV-energy nuclear particles, based on eV-energy

electrical inputs, which may be indicative of a new scientific phenomenon. This work is based on the 2013 disclosure and shows initial

evidence validating the prior claims of nuclear particle generation. Additionally, several variations on the 2013 electrochemical recipe are

made in order to find a highly repeatable recipe for future replications by other teams. The experiments described here produced dense

collections of tracks in solid-state nuclear track detectors, radio frequency (RF) emissions, and anomalous heat flux, which are indicative of

potential nuclear, or unusual chemical, reactions. Experimental results include tracks in solid-state nuclear track detectors similar in size to

tracks produced by 4.7 MeV alpha particles on identical detectors exposed to radioactive Th-230; RF pulses up to 6 dB above the noise floor,

which indicate that these signals were likely not background noise and not caused by known chemical reactions; and heat flux of 10 s of kJ,

measured to 6σ significance, over and above input electrical energy, indicative of unknown exothermic reactions. Six out of six nuclear track

detectors, utilized in experiments and interrogated for tracks post-experiment, produced positive results that our team attributes to thousands

of individual particle impacts in dense clusters, likely with energies between 0.1 and 20 MeV. Similar nuclear particle, thermal, and RF results

have separately appeared in prior reports, but in this work, all three categories of anomalous behavior are reported. Results indicate that the

2013 procedure may be a useful guide toward a set of highly repeatable reference experiments, showing initial but not overwhelming evidence

of a new scientific phenomenon. Repeatable recipes are shared so that other groups may replicate and extend the present work."

For those with a business bent, Pitchbook publishes a clean tech report.

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