Shielding from reactor emitting RF and RF measuring

  • Hello I don't find clear thread for reactor RF noise shielding, absorbers, frequency, polarization etc. ideas so new thread


    Broblem are that my reactor come critical and give huge amounts RF noise. My RF noise meter (0.1-8Ghz) show near zero values. Situation is dangerous because radiated RF hit brains (brains magnetite crystalls? ~1um region?)


    I built farady cage but noise come through it. Only ~3sec feeling that it quit when cage is closed then it continue as before. Material is ~0.5mm steel (from tin cans).
    @me365 report that he find RF go through 1cm Al.


    What level and frequency RF is if it can go through 1cm Al or 0.5mm steel? Some terahertz radiation or what?


    I need ideas to measure and protection for such intense RF. Good/cheap RF absorbers? Metering ideas?


    Intense RF/terahertz radiation is know to cause bilogical hazard. Need ideas before it kills me.. It hurt brains, eyes..

  • Hi Eros.


    First question. Is your Faraday cage properly grounded (earthed)? This is important because and electric field within the cage can cause charges to build up on the inside. This leads to an equally large net charge on the outside (of the opposite charge sign). Think of an un-grounded Faraday Cage as a large condenser. It is not impossible to imagine that the outside of such a cage could also act as an antenna, re-radiating RF - though my knowledge of THz


    So, if you ground the cage the additional charge will rather go to the ground than flow over your body when you touch the cage.

  • It is not properly grounded. Cap =antenna indeed. Have ideas how much ground current/volts it can generate? (=how low ohms it need to be grounded before save?)


    It go through cage without touching it and can feel long distance (>10m, sometimes some feelings up to 1km but may be other noise too)


    Is there posibilities that cage size matters? Too small and B/U ratio near transmitter effects?

  • The potential current is very small in all probability, if it was more than 100mA I would be amazed, but the potential antenna voltage could be very high - certainly in the hundreds of volts. Since the voltage is so high, the path to ground need not be very low resistance -but as always, the lower the better.


    If you are working in a building (barn, garage, cabin etc) then you need to check the earth. If you are using a ground-spike earth, simply wetting the ground around it can make it work better (if the ground is dry). If you are working inside a house or apartment then you need to check that you have a true earth. Much of the EU code on domestic wiring seems to me to be very vague on the topic of proper earthing.


    ETA- the effect of cage size is relatively small at high frequencies AFAIK,

  • This tread illustrates another factor in my belief that DGT has sometime. DGT complained about RF radiation taking down the phone systems in their building even through they had shielded their reactor with two faraday cages. If they were scammers, why say something so far fetched.


    In preparation for the ICCF-18 demo, national instruments could not clean up the RF interference that hindered their instrumentation of the DGT reactor.


    This RF comes from NMR active nuclei in the reactor under the driving force of extreme magnetic energy.







    RF generation from the LENR reaction must be greatly amplified by a coherence mechanism involving nuclear spin alignment of NMR active (non zero spin) nuclei. .

  • I think the explanation is more mundane. A Faraday cage (grounded enclosure) can act as a resonant cavity for microwaves. Any conductive pipe or wire leading away from a spot opposite the grounding point will then act as a ground-plane antenna. Even the outer shield of a coax wire can behave this way. Or a metal gas/vacuum manifold tube.


    Such resonant structures will likely have a series of sharp peaks and nulls, related to the physical dimensions of the enclosure. But if the stimulus is broad-band RF noise from some process in the reactor, all the peaks will be stimulated to some extent. This hypothesis can be tested by spectrum analysis of the external RF noise while making changes to the apparatus (grounding point etc).


    Alan Smith reported some success solving a similar problem in this way - eliminating heater waveform noise in cell instrumentation.

  • Hi David. It might be possible for you to ground the steel casing of your reactor. This is not only good practice, but should eliminate charge build-up. The Aluminium wall (as well as the reactor wall of course) will provide ample screening from Betas of course. Brehnstrallung via fast Gammas I am not sure about. Thermal Neutrons - who knows? Perhaps magicsound will have an opinion on these last two factors?

  • Alan and David, please pay close attention to what Magicsound writes above. Just look at John Clark Slater's classic Microwave Electronics, again available from Dover and used for a few bucks. Further any dielectric, air, vacuum TO conductor interface will act as a transmission line ALONG that interface. STATIC charges cannot pass orthogonally through a conductive surface (spherical in the Faraday idealization). But dynamic charges are quite a different story. RF and microwaves (the 'sharp' end of any voltage or current ramp whose risetime approaches even a 10th of a microsecond... 10 megahertz) is getting to that realm of pure RF. Further, ANY switched current has RF implications as AM radio and a brushed old motor often shows us.


    Also, to reiterate a nice earlier comment about mu metals, Faraday cages are not magnetic cages.


    When I conduct my centrifugation experiments, I always consider neutrons, RF, magnetics, gammas, hot betas, hot beta plus, protons and exotics such as tetraneutrons. I try to arrange to detect any and all. If I were exceedingly careful (I'm old enough to consider myself post-reproductive) I would have shielding (boron, mass, density, concrete, aluminum, copper, mu metal, steel... not necessarily in that exact order) perhaps redundantly in place. And I would take advantage of inverse square dissipation .... which in a centrifuge plane may be only simple inverse of distance due to directionality to the disc for at least neutrons and protons. Basically, much of that primary risk can be eliminated by simply being out of the centrifuge disc plane. Centrifuge in a "well", experimenter on the floor above. But conventional shielding is needed for any secondaries.


    All radiative fluxes, so far, are low.

  • Eros informs us that he is being affected by something coming out of his LENR research reactors. Could this be true? We do not have a reading on how much radiated EMF power is being produced by the LENR reaction. But is there any precedence for this type of physical effect coming from radiating power? Well yes there is.


    A directed-energy weapon (DEW) emits highly focused energy, transferring that energy to a target to damage it.



    The source for the Active Denial System energy is a Gyrotron. A Gyrotron is a high-power linear-beam vacuum tube which generates millimeter-wave electromagnetic waves by the cyclotron resonance of electrons in a strong magnetic field. Output frequencies range from about 20 to 250 GHz, covering wavelengths from microwave to the edge of the terahertz gap. Typical output powers range from tens of kilowatts to 1–2 megawatts. Gyrotrons can be designed for pulsed or continuous operation.


    The Active Denial System generates a focused and very directional millimeter-wave radio frequency beam. There is an eye-safe laser range finder associated with the system for range determination.


    Is the beam radioactive?


    No. The beam is not radioactive, nor does the Active Denial System beam have radioactive materials associated with it.


    Does this system work like a microwave oven?


    No. The ADS, a non-lethal directed-energy weapon, projects a very short duration (on the order of a few seconds) focused beam of millimeter waves at a frequency of 95 gigahertz (GHz). A microwave oven operates at 2.45 GHz. At the much higher frequency of 95 GHz, the associated directed energy wavelength is very short and only physically capable of reaching a skin depth of about 1/64 of an inch. A microwave oven operating at 2.45 GHz has a much longer associated wave length, on the order of several inches, which allows for greater penetration of material and efficiency in heating food. The ADS provides a quick and reversible skin surface heating sensation that does not penetrate into the target.


    The frequency of the EMF determines how far into the body that the EMF will penetrate. That frequency determines how dangerous that this EMF is.


    The frequency of the EMF also is proportional to how well a faraday cage will reduce the power of the EMF with lower frequencies being less blocked by the cage than higher frequencies are.


    Info about the Active denial system


    http://jnlwp.defense.gov/About…ctive-Denial-System-FAQs/

  • Hello axil, I have not detected big magnetic fields outside reactor. But that dosn't mean they can't exist inside. If magnon based BEC is inside, it can be so good B field conductor that B dosn't come outside particles? Or what you think? Shutdown reactor cooling below ambient may explained if magnon BEC decay and take energy = magnetic cooling?


    Some active denial system maybe, but maybe lower frequency because it go deeper. Or many frequences. From reactor I have got some small hand heating feelings, but it feels diffrent than any other heat source than I know. It is like small ticling/heating feeling in hand.
    RF cage I tested have some holes for heater leads H2 pipe etc. and it is not properly grounded. Sometimes standing near reactor give feeling in legs that some current flow in them, like little leaky AC machine. RF cage if I calculate correct have ~850Mhz 1.st reconance.
    My meter have not find RF in range 0.1-8Ghz. Cheap ideas to detect RF, measure frequency? It may be higly polarized due posible high B?


    David 1cm Al+ 1cm Fe don't hold X-rays ~150kev quite well. It is maybe cheap/easy to add 4mm lead jacket, it take 99.9% off, even 0.5mm take 95% off.
    I have not seen dangerous levels but my geiger is not sensitive for soft radiation. No idea for neutrons, but I think if there are dangerous levels then they activate my 20mm Fe shield and I see it from geiger before it kills. That before I done any tests.
    But it come true that nonionizing RF radiation is the bad boy. It really make brains sic / crazy. Shutdown reactor still emits it. Once I have feelings that used fuel in air radiates some RF week after use.

  • Cheapest way to look for RF is to use a little inexpensive transistor radio. Try the AM (LW/MW) and FM/VHF bands with it tuned to various 'dead spots' (no broadcasts) along the way. If you have a radio with SW even better. Because your possible RF source is not designed to be a particularly efficient emitter of RF, it will broadcast over a wide spread of frequencies/frequency harmonics which you may be able to detect this way.


  • Cheapest way to look for RF is to use a little inexpensive transistor radio. Try the AM (LW/MW) and FM/VHF bands with it tuned to various 'dead spots' (no broadcasts) along the way. If you have a radio with SW even better. Because your possible RF source is not designed to be a particularly efficient emitter of RF, it will broadcast over a wide spread of frequencies/frequency harmonics which you may be able to detect this way.


    ED88T should detect them better than AM radio, at least it show radiated energy mw/m². But it dosn't show any high levels. It is sensitive in 0.1-8Ghz area.


    Some papers from LENR show peak frequencies near 80Ghz. Frequency may be spiked heavy. Harmonics may generated.
    I think frequency from my reactor is more than 8Ghz but don't have idea how much.


    Maybe build some fast shotky array or better ideas?

  • ED88T should detect them better than AM radio, at least it show radiated energy mw/m². But it dosn't show any high levels. It is sensitive in 0.1-8Ghz area.


    Some papers from LENR show peak frequencies near 80Ghz. Frequency may be spiked heavy. Harmonics may generated.
    I think frequency from my reactor is more than 8Ghz but don't have idea how much.


    Maybe build some fast shotky array or better ideas?


    Any relatively high frequency RF as you suspect might be deeply penetrating and potentially damaging to your body.


    Your reactor would be in the RADAR frequency range, however the strength level is unknown. There is experience with RADAR irradiation of tissue.


    http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/273787.pdf


    You mentioned discomfort in your head, so this caught my eye.


    Quote

    Gross Post-Mortem Findings


    Exposure of the head in the near field (at 5. 3 cm) caused hyperemia (congestion of blood) with petechial and some diffuse hemorrhages in the tissues under the skin. The skin was discolored (greenish-gray). Muscles of the head and neck (directly under the antenna) looked "cooked.' The capillaries of the cerebral cortex and meninges were distended with blood and *leaking.' In the lungs, there was marked congestion with hemorrhagic areas apparently caused by thrombic emboli. The heart was contracted and filled with blood clots.

  • using a radio to detect wideband random radiation is a good idea.


    another simple tool is a simple loop with a filament lamp (low voltage, typ 2.5v), which can detect usual microwave (used to detect leaks in microwave)


    about radiation, does experts here agree that a layer of concrete (bricks), of water, can reduce radiation efficiently, and by the way reduce damage by explosion (bang) or fires ?


    about long term radiation, beside the electronic devices, why not put "canaries" detector made of radiation sensible living cells/animals, like fishes, cell cultures...
    or simply CR39.


    This is a naive proposal?

  • I think the fish (wrapped it watery shielding) would be relativly unharmed by radiation that would kill a man. But they might get a bit warm...


    On the topic of radios for detecting RF emissions, cheap Chinese radios are better than expensive German ones- they do not have the discrimination circuits and the signal detector/tuning circuit is easily overloaded by strong signals of any frequency.


  • Your reactor would be in the RADAR frequency range, however the strength level is unknown. There is experience with RADAR irradiation of tissue.


    Power level is quite sure less than 100w because no thermal tissue damage (yet). Maybe only few watts?. But frequency+power (polarization?) is level that cause erratic currents in nervous system, ecpecially head is in big danger. Low dousage give memory broblems (mainly), simply loss moust of memories during exposure days. Little bigger level "freeze", simple you stay in exposure and can't do anything, like escape or it need extreme concentration to do something. If situation last long enough it mix everything in head, dreams, true etc mix nice sleepwalking half reality dream and it need hospital to find back to this world. But people are diffrent, I can give only one hint: don't test..


  • for RF, most animal are unharmed or else warmed then cooked.
    electronic components are more sensible


    Lab rabbit is still ok condition. During exposure it usually stay / move only minimal. Human is more height antenna as rabbit so get easilly more RF in head..


    Electronics not found yet one that say RF present. I'll search more. Filament lamp maybe, but it need high level RF power.


    I have some smd bands of BAT54 shotkys. How high freq they can rectify? and what arrangement/antennas is good for over 10Ghz ? Bare legs? Horn?