Quote from Alan Smith

Not to mention Dunkin' Donuts

Noooooooooooooooooooo

The coronavirus may sometimes slip its genetic material into human chromosomes—but what does that mean?

https://www.sciencemag.org/new…hromosomes-what-does-mean

People who recover from COVID-19 sometimes later test positive for SARS-CoV-2, suggesting their immune systems could not ward off a second attack by the coronavirus or that they have a lingering infection. A study now hints at a different explanation in which the virus hides in an unexpected place. The work, only reported in a preprint, suggests the pandemic pathogen takes a page from HIV and other retroviruses and integrates its genetic code—but, importantly, just parts of it—into people’s chromosomes. The phenomenon, if true and frequent, could have profound implications that range from false signals of active infection to misleading results from COVID-19 treatment studies.

Quote from Valeriy Tarasov

Sorry, I can not agree about vaccination, vaccination is absolutely right way. The only problem is that, at such critical time, politicians as decision makers should react fast and should approve fast. I don't see this in Germany.

As said some posts ago. Early vaccination is a criminal task. All constitutions/laws worldwide clearly state that the state should never damage the health of the population. The rules are clear. A vaccine never will be cleared without at least a two years monitoring phase.

This rule only can be broken for not treatable pandemic diseases like Ebola. CoV-19 is less damaging than a flue if you treat it in time with Ivermectin. Early vaccination for CoV-19 is a crime against humanity as there is absolute no medical need to do so.

All this has nothing to do with the fact that the vaccine works/protects as expected. It's is all about potential long term damage introduced by a well known high risk RNA cocktail. The same risks exists for the so called anti-body treatment, where you directly inject antibodies. May be you once should read into these projects that explain the problematic much deeper than Pfizer does and certainly knows!

There are chemical tricks to make such antibody short live! But this is very expensive and you would need cryogenic temperature...

Quote from Valeriy Tarasov

Sorry, I can not agree about vaccination, vaccination is absolutely right way. The only problem is that, at such critical time, politicians as decision makers should react fast and should approve fast. I don't see this in Germany. RNA vaccine is absolutely safe. Only some limited number of certain illness like allergy can be a problem (what was found recently). Your organism will just produce a protein from the RNA which then will degrade. The vaccine on the base of adenovirus has more limitations, but also for healthy people is quite safe.

You must mean 'relatively safe', not 'absolutely safe'. One can't say absolutely safe and then qualify it that some people might get sick. Yes, the mRNA vaccines *may* be relatively safe compared to other vaccines. Some people are apparently having allergic reactions to the generally inert polyethylene glycol in the mRNA vaccines. Also the vaccine *may* be activating otherwise dormant herpes virus in nerve cells, leading to things like Bell's Palsy in a few. Many others experience extreme fever and aches. Some might call the latter merely an unfortunate price of admission for acquiring immunity to a certain pathogen. Perhaps. But the fact remains that longer term general health effects from the mRNA vaccine, or most any vaccine for that matter, are under - investigated to say the least.

Quote from Mark U

You must mean 'relatively safe', not 'absolutely safe'. One can't say absolutely safe and then qualify it that some people might get sick. Yes, the mRNA vaccines *may* be relatively safe compared to other vaccines. Some people are apparently having allergic reactions to the generally inert polyethylene glycol in the mRNA vaccines. Also the vaccine *may* be activating otherwise dormant herpes virus in nerve cells, leading to things like Bell's Palsy in a few. Many others experience extreme fever and aches. Some might call the latter merely an unfortunate price of admission for acquiring immunity to a certain pathogen. Perhaps. But the fact remains that longer term general health effects from the mRNA vaccine, or most any vaccine for that matter, are under - investigated to say the least.

mRNA vaccine is absolutely safe in the same way as usual food, water and so on. Extreme allergy reaction you can have from usual food too. mRNA vaccine is not "may be" safe relative to other vaccines, but is more safe, because of the underlying mechanism of the immunisation. Polyethylene glycol is present everywhere it is not something special for mRNA vaccine.

The choice is simple you can investigate as long as you want but people will die without vaccination every day. And, you can go to their relatives and talk with them about your investigation about aches and extreme fever in the case of some minority allergic people (which can have additional drugs to compensate negative effect of vaccination procedure). Incompetence leads to death.

Quote from Wyttenbach

As said some posts ago. Early vaccination is a criminal task. All constitutions/laws worldwide clearly state that the state should never damage the health of the population. The rules are clear. A vaccine never will be cleared without at least a two years monitoring phase.

This rule only can be broken for not treatable pandemic diseases like Ebola. CoV-19 is less damaging than a flue if you treat it in time with Ivermectin. Early vaccination for CoV-19 is a crime against humanity as there is absolute no medical need to do so.

All this has nothing to do with the fact that the vaccine works/protects as expected. It's is all about potential long term damage introduced by a well known high risk RNA cocktail. The same risks exists for the so called anti-body treatment, where you directly inject antibodies. May be you once should read into these projects that explain the problematic much deeper than Pfizer does and certainly knows!

There are chemical tricks to make such antibody short live! But this is very expensive and you would need cryogenic temperature...

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Criminal is to read report from Pfizer several weeks instead of a couple of days, when every day people are dying.

Sorry, but I cannot comment about risk of antibodies treatment, I can only repeat in this case that incompetence leads to death.

Quote from Mark U

You must mean 'relatively safe', not 'absolutely safe'. One can't say absolutely safe and then qualify it that some people might get sick. Yes, the mRNA vaccines *may* be relatively safe compared to other vaccines. Some people are apparently having allergic reactions to the generally inert polyethylene glycol in the mRNA vaccines. Also the vaccine *may* be activating otherwise dormant herpes virus in nerve cells, leading to things like Bell's Palsy in a few. Many others experience extreme fever and aches. Some might call the latter merely an unfortunate price of admission for acquiring immunity to a certain pathogen. Perhaps. But the fact remains that longer term general health effects from the mRNA vaccine, or most any vaccine for that matter, are under - investigated to say the least.

All true. I think the reactions so far can be explained by food allergies. 10% of the population have some type of reaction to certain foods and about 80% of those to sugar. In each dose of the vaccine 6 grams of sucrose is used as a preservative. That amount of sugar hitting the liver at one time is going to send signaling activating dormant herpes virus leading to temporary Bell Palsy. Unfortunately there will be more.

Quote from Fm1

Antibody drugs used to treat Trump, others could cut Covid-19 hospitalizations by half, but they're not being used by the general public

I read this is because they have not been made in sufficient quantities yet.

Quote from Fm1

All true. I think the reactions so far can be explained by food allergies. 10% of the population have some type of reaction to certain foods and about 80% of those to sugar. In each dose of the vaccine 6 grams of sucrose is used as a preservative. That amount of sugar hitting the liver at one time is going to send signaling activating dormant herpes virus leading to temporary Bell Palsy. Unfortunately there will be more.

6 grams! I think you still have dunkin' donuts on your mind. As do I

It's more like 6mg (from Pfizer) :

Active ingredient

• 30 mcg of a nucleosidemodified messenger RNA (modRNA) encoding the viral spike (S) glycoprotein of SARS-CoV-2.

Fats

• lipids (0.43 mg (4-hydroxybutyl)azanediyl)bis(hexane-6,1-diyl)bis(2-hexyldecanoate), 0.05 mg 2[(polyethylene glycol)-2000]-N,N-ditetradecylacetamide, 0.09 mg 1,2-distearoyl-sn-glycero-3- phosphocholine, and 0.2 mg cholesterol)

Salts

• 0.01 mg potassium chloride
• 0.01 mg monobasic potassium phosphate
• 0.36 mg sodium chloride
• 0.07 mg dibasic sodium phosphate dihydrate

Sugar

• 6 mg sucrose

Quote from Shane D.

And playing devils advocate; it may not be so much a problem with too many procedures being done, as it is Americans being so fat they need all those procedures. Obesity leads to blown out knees, backs, diabetes, cancer, heart disease, etc.

Obesity can be greatly reduced with a combination of public health initiatives, free market mechanisms and improved primary education. Oklahoma City is one of the best examples in the U.S., and where I live in Atlanta has also been greatly improved. See:

How America’s Top Junk-Food City Went on a Diet (and Fattened Its Economy)

https://www.politico.com/magaz…ht-loss-what-works-213445

See the book "Prescription for a Healthy Nation" for details, and also this website:

http://www.nwcr.ws/

Obesity is not a problem in many countries such as Italy and Japan. It was not a problem in the U.S. until the 1970s. If we go back to diets and foodways of 1965, the problem will go away. We don't even need to exercise much, because most adults did not exercise much in 1965, and most do not exercise much in Japan today.

Obesity resembles the so-called energy crisis in that there are many good solutions to it, and the experts know what has to be done. Unfortunately, most people do not listen to the experts, and many crackpot solutions to the problem are promoted, such as the ones championed by Taubes.

Free market capitalism got us into the obesity mess. It can be rejiggered to get us out of it, with a better educated population and a few changes to government regulations. I strongly believe that capitalism is the best solution to problems of this nature. Obamacare was a resounding success. It greatly reduced the number of uninsured people and it reduced costs by trillions of dollars because it is based on free market capitalism. It was designed by the Heritage Foundation and first implemented in Massachusetts by Mitt Romney. If it had been proposed by a Republican president, instead of Obama, I expect every single GOP member of Congress would have voted for it, but alas they all opposed it. Apparently, partisan victories and "owning the libs" are more important to them than their own party's 150-year tradition of supporting capitalism.

The GOP also seems to be opposed to wind, solar and other modern energy sources, for reasons I cannot fathom. These things are cheaper, more reliable, and less polluting than coal, yet the GOP is all-in supporting coal and other obsolete technology. Even incandescent lights! This is like advocating whale oil, or vacuum tube computers. It's nuts. They also favor monopoly control of energy and the internet by bloated, inefficient energy companies, which should be the opposite of GOP economics. Here is good video showing how bad this is:

Reminder that every major chemical / pharma failure in history starts with hyper confidence about a new technology that is spread to the world. Then the industrial co avoids scrutiny and disputes the data. Then finally years down the line the damage is unequivocal. Then, they get fined (built into the cost of doing business) and everyone flushes the event from their collective memory.

How much was paid to the 10,000 people (would love to find the source of this) with narcolepsy from the Swine Flu vaccine disaster of 2009? If you think about it a 1mil compensation might be valid for a life-altering consequence. That would be 10,000,000,000.

Allergic reactions are not minor things. They can be signals of complex immune function. Eczema, as an example, is an auto-immune disease -- despite the fact that people say "just throw some oatmeal cream on it."

Quote from Valeriy Tarasov

And, you can go to their relatives and talk with them about your investigation about aches and extreme fever in the case of some minority allergic people (which can have additional drugs to compensate negative effect of vaccination procedure).

Just to be clear, aches and fever are quite common side effects of a vaccine and not to be confused with the rarer allergic responses. Allergic response symptoms include rash, difficulty breathing, puffiness, etc.

Of course, these are all short term responses. As you should be aware, mRNA vaccine attempts in the past have resulted in death in animals who were challenged later with the real virus. Presumably a breakthrough has been achieved where this is almost certainly not going to happen with this vaccine, with this coronavirus, with humans. But when one is dealing with the intricacies of unique features of individual immune systems, predictability is certainly not assured, especially at this early test phase. I applaud your confidence about the vaccine's safety, but really only time will truly tell.

Quote from Valeriy Tarasov

Sorry, I can not agree about vaccination, vaccination is absolutely right way. The only problem is that, at such critical time, politicians as decision makers should react fast and should approve fast. I don't see this in Germany.

I do not know about Germany, but they moved quickly in the U.S., Canada and the UK. Not only did they approve quickly, but before approval the companies began large scale mass production. That was a very good idea. Also, months ago UPS, Fed Ex and Delta Airlines began planning and building equipment to ship millions of vaccines at -80 deg C. It wasn't clear they would need such extreme cold, but they went ahead, with support from the government. That was a very good decision.

Quote from JedRothwell

I do not know about Germany, but they moved quickly in the U.S., Canada and the UK. Not only did they approve quickly, but before approval the companies began large scale mass production. That was a very good idea. Also, months ago UPS, Fed Ex and Delta Airlines began planning and building equipment to ship millions of vaccines at -80 deg C. It wasn't clear they would need such extreme cold, but they went ahead, with support from the government. That was a very good decision.

Yes, the decisions in U.S., Canada and the UK are optimal for this critical situation, when saved time means saved lives. I have sympathy to such politics. And, now I understand why Brexit has happened. Because EU bureaucracy is opposite. What I have read today is that the approval is expected to be at 29 December and vaccination at the beginning of January. So, 12 more days of lost lives because of the irresponsibility of some anonymous experts reading all these 12 days the Pfizer report.

Quote from Navid

How much was paid to the 10,000 people (would love to find the source of this) with narcolepsy from the Swine Flu vaccine disaster of 2009? If you think about it a 1mil compensation might be valid for a life-altering consequence.

Nothing was paid to them in the U.S. because that vaccine was never used in the U.S. The total number of victims from this nonexistent problem in the U.S. was minus 7. That is, there were 2 cases, which is 7 fewer cases than normal out of the 873,530 potential victims. See:

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25320099/

In the Netherlands the total number of victims was 0 out of 7 exposures, and I doubt any money would be paid to zero victims. Quote:

• Case-coverage analysis for Pandemrix-ASO3 in children in the Netherlands did not show evidence of an increased risk of narcolepsy, but the number of exposed cases was small (N=7).

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesaf…story/narcolepsy-flu.html

If you would "love to find the source of this" bullshit you posted, I suggest you look in a sewer. Or, just make it up the way other people around here do! If you want actual scientific information, I suggest you look in a legitimate, grownup source of real information such as the NIH or the CDC.

Quote from Navid

Reminder that every major chemical / pharma failure in history starts with hyper confidence about a new technology that is spread to the world.

Not hyper-confidence. Just ordinary confidence, based on rigorous science. Let me remind you that all successes in the history of chemistry and pharma also began with confidence. The successes greatly outnumber the failures. So, confidence at the outset tells you nothing. It is not a sign of impending failure. All airplane flights begin with a cockpit check done by a highly confident flight crew. Does that mean all flights are doomed, and must end in catastrophe? No. It means professionals are confident they know what they are doing.

There have been very few failures in recent decades after the thalidomide disaster. For the same reason there were very few fatal passenger shipwrecks after the Titanic disaster. Because the Titanic disaster triggered reforms that prevented most disasters after that, and greatly reduced casualties when disasters did happen.

More on long haulers, this is a little scary

expert reaction to preprint suggesting patients who recovered from COVID-19 could suffer serious cognitive decline

https://www.sciencemediacentre…erious-cognitive-decline/

This manuscript suggests that the brains of people that have had COVID have aged approximately 10 years compared to those that haven’t – this is much worse than we usually see with other post viral syndromes. The main caveat is that it is cross sectional rather than longitudinal – i.e. it doesn’t show that individuals age quicker, it shows that people who’ve had it are biologically older. It’s a very small difference, but it’s entirely possible that people who start out with lower levels of brain function are more likely to catch it and/or have a bad outcome from it. An equally plausible hypothesis – an individual’s ability to reason predicts adherence to face masks, hand hygiene and social distancing. A lower IQ may mean more social interaction, less wearing face masks, higher viral loads and a higher likelihood to get really unwell. This is in keeping with the QCOVID report that pre-existing dementia is a really strong predictor of poor outcome if you catch COVID.

This result must be treated with great caution. First of all, the study is based on individuals reporting their own symptoms, and only a tiny fraction had a positive COVID test. There is likely, therefore, to be some uncertainty about the reliability of the information about severity of symptoms.

“Secondly, this is what is called a “cross sectional” study. It does not look at whether COVID makes your cognition worse – it instead looks at whether people who have recovered from possible COVID do worse on the cognitive test than a control group. This type of methodology is more subject to error than a longitudinal study that looks at the same people before and after an illness.

Covid 19, long Covid, alzheimers, YKL-40 and vitamn D deficenccy.......... Follow the evidence

Quote from JedRothwell

Nothing was paid to them in the U.S. because that vaccine was never used in the U.S. The total number of victims from this nonexistent problem in the U.S. was minus 7. That is, there were 2 cases, which is 7 fewer cases than normal out of the 873,530 potential victims. See:

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25320099/

In the Netherlands the total number of victims was 0 out of 7 exposures, and I doubt any money would be paid to zero victims. Quote:

• Case-coverage analysis for Pandemrix-ASO3 in children in the Netherlands did not show evidence of an increased risk of narcolepsy, but the number of exposed cases was small (N=7).

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesaf…story/narcolepsy-flu.html

If you would "love to find the source of this" bullshit you posted, I suggest you look in a sewer. Or, just make it up the way other people around here do! If you want actual scientific information, I suggest you look in a legitimate, grownup source of real information such as the NIH or the CDC.

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Tsk tsk, your ugly behavior will cause less people to take the vaccine.

The actual count was 2000 narcolepsy cases in Northern Europe. Germans refused the vaccine despite doses for the entire country being bought, and the death rate was 0.02% or 2 in 10,000. Current death rate 0-50y is about the same for Covid19, but much higher of course in elderly.

Quote from Navid

How much was paid to the 10,000 people (would love to find the source of this) with narcolepsy from the Swine Flu vaccine disaster of 2009? If you think about it a 1mil compensation might be valid for a life-altering consequence. That would be 10,000,000,000.

I know that Sweden was the most compliant to get the Pandemrix vaccine (60 percent), and perhaps had the most cases of narcolepsy from the vaccine in Europe.

From

https://medicalxpress.com/news…-spurs-covid-vaccine.html

The Swedish Pharmaceutical Insurance has so far approved 440 of 702 narcolepsy claims linked to Pandemrix, paying out a total of 100 million kronor (9.8 million euros, $11.6 million) in compensation.

That's less than 30K per person for a lifetime of disability!

Take a vaccine developed in haste? Never again, says Meissa Chebbi, who, like hundreds of other young Swedes suffered debilitating narcolepsy after a mass vaccination campaign against the 2009-2010 swine flu pandemic. The experience has shaken Swedes' confidence in any future vaccine against the new coronavirus, compounding fears about unknown long-term side effects.

Quote from Valeriy Tarasov

The choice is simple you can investigate as long as you want but people will die without vaccination every day.

Quote from Valeriy Tarasov

Sorry, but I cannot comment about risk of antibodies treatment, I can only repeat in this case that incompetence leads to death.

Mafia methods by stopping early HCQ and hiding Ivermectin did lead to millions of deaths. Spending Billions for crap drugs like Remdesivir of Gilead scoundrels did torture thousands of dying people and did spread damaging hope as you do now too.

Anyway you seem to be the replacement troll for an almost silent member that can no longer lie to the forum.

Quote from Navid

How much was paid to the 10,000 people (would love to find the source of this) with narcolepsy from the Swine Flu vaccine disaster of 2009? If you think about it a 1mil compensation might be valid for a life-altering consequence. That would be 10,000,000,00

In Europe most courts are dominated by the FM/R mafia and consequently almost no damages are paid (A little bit in Ireland). Further in Europe the Fm/R mafia still blocks the implementation of class action suits.

Quote from JedRothwell

There have been very few failures in recent decades after the thalidomide disaster.

Oh true only 3 million deaths of narco-gate. May be to few for you...

Ivermectin-gate did also kill 280'000 Americans so far.

Quote from Valeriy Tarasov

So, 12 more days of lost lives

12 more days to kill people by not administering Ivermectin you should say!

Everybody is free to take a vaccine with complete unknown future damage potential. I did buy Ivermectin. It's, the by far best solution!