The perpetual “is LENR even real” argument thread.

  • I'm curious; if you have read their most recent work as presented at ICCF24/25, which, if any, do you think is on the right track?

    Shane, people are so far from the right track to be useless. This situation is typical of how all great discoveries are eventually developed. Progress is only made after all possible mistakes are made and corrected. We are still a long way from success.

  • Thanks, I didn't know it cost that much. I would venture to guess few in the public do, nor appreciate what it takes in terms of skill, and time to attempt replication.

    Most of the expense is not for the device itself, but rather for the equipment such as vacuum pumps, and diagnostic equipment such as SEM. So, my offer to help pay for LEC replications is not very generous. I am offering money to pay for materials and perhaps an upgrade or repair to equipment such as a vacuum pump. I cannot afford to build an entire lab. Anyone who wants to replicate this must already have the equipment they need, and the skills to operate it. You cannot start from zero. Suppose I found an enthusiastic but inexperienced person who wanted to replicate. Even if I handed them $200,000, they probably could not do it.


  • Most of the expense is not for the device itself, but rather for the equipment such as vacuum pumps, and diagnostic equipment such as SEM. So, my offer to help pay for LEC replications is not very generous. I am offering money to pay for materials and perhaps an upgrade or repair to equipment such as a vacuum pump. I cannot afford to build an entire lab. Anyone who wants to replicate this must already have the equipment they need, and the skills to operate it. You cannot start from zero. Suppose I found an enthusiastic but inexperienced person who wanted to replicate. Even if I handed them $200,000, they probably could not do it.

    Very true!! This is not a project for amateurs. Even when the fusion reaction can be produced, the resulting behavior is not unambiguous. The reality comes only from many measurements being combined to show a common mechanism. Even when this universal mechanism is demonstrated, as I have done, people will not accept the results. I see no hope for progress until serious and trained people get involved while being supported at a level consistent with modern scientific study.

  • Shane, people are so far from the right track to be useless. This situation is typical of how all great discoveries are eventually developed. Progress is only made after all possible mistakes are made and corrected. We are still a long way from success.

    No, that's not how things happen. Remember Faraday with his great idea of a physical electromagnetic field, or Otto Hahn and Lise Meitner with the idea of the possibility of a chain reaction of fission of uranium nuclei when they are “bombarded” by neutrons. They were led along the right path by a great idea.

    A chain reaction of cold nuclear fusion is possible when nuclei are “bombarded” by neutrinos (neutrino wave, neutrino field).

  • Remember Faraday with his great idea of a physical electromagnetic field, or Otto Hahn and Lise Meitner with the idea of the possibility of a chain reaction of fission of uranium nuclei

    Their discoveries involved quite a bit of hard work and interaction with others,

    like 4. yrs meticulous work in the KaiserWilhelm laboratories

    Faraday Hahn Meitner all had expensive laboratory equipment available

    From earlier 'ideas.'. possibilities the path to evidence and recognition by others was not straightforward .

    Hahn and Meitner had one advantage... there was a war in the making..

    with a lot of. displaced scientists upset from their usual comfort


    unfortunately/fortunately ?? LENR is difficult to weaponise??

    . it took quite a few decades..and quite a few others for Faraday's peaceful ideas to become working technology

  • “There are no royal ways in science!” (Euclid)

    As for military applications, the “flying saucer” will have a cold fusion generator as its engine.

  • You are so condescending so useless to register your name for perpetuity.. To your ego's chagrin.

    Very true!! This is not a project for amateurs. Even when the fusion reaction can be produced, the resulting behavior is not unambiguous. The reality comes only from many measurements being combined to show a common mechanism. Even when this universal mechanism is demonstrated, as I have done, people will not accept the results. I see no hope for progress until serious and trained people get involved while being supported at a level consistent with modern scientific study.

  • Eventually, a correct understanding will lead to an entirely different approach. We are still a long way from that goal.

    Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts on my idea.

    It is a great honor to communicate with you here. I am still hoping that we can eventually develop a direct electric generator using LENRs with a more comprehensive understanding. Unlike hot fusion reactors or quantum computers, it would not require a lot of money to build. I hope to be able to present actual experimental data as well as simulation analyses someday.

  • Maybe not so much., Deuterided Uranium (UD3) is very tricky stuff. There is reason to believe that depleted uranium anti-tank rounds have a UD3 pellet inside.

    This was a particular concern of Fleischmann’s. Worry about the potential weaponisation of palladium deuterides was one of the reasons he began the work now known as LENR.

  • I don/t know about plutonium, but as conceived the idea is that when the round hits the tank the (created by kinetics) temperature at the point of impact where the UD3 is goes up to about 5k C. Behind the tip is a separator - a wad of expanded polystyrene which vaporises allowing another chunk of depleted uranium to slam into the back of the tip mass pushing the temperature and the pressure up even higher as the UD3 is now in a sandwich between armour plate and the DU mass hitting it from behind. . It's a mini nuke. Hot fusion I guess.


    There is a suggestion that Israel dropped a bomb based on this kind of technology in Lebanon some years ago.

  • The UD3 part is apparently enriched uranium, not waste at all. The rest of the slug is depleted uranium. This is known/suspected from analysis of the wreckage of the Iraqui army's tank columns caught in demolition alley as they tried to retreat from the Gulf states.

  • The UD3 part is apparently enriched uranium, not waste at all. The rest of the slug is depleted uranium. This is known/suspected from analysis of the wreckage of the Iraqui army's tank columns caught in demolition alley as they tried to retreat from the Gulf states.

    Is there anywhere that more can be read about the use of UD3 in depleted uranium shells?

  • Some of that came 'from the horse's mouth' But I have a book somewhere with some other details. I'll go look for it.

    Alan, I doubt enriched U is used in tank rounds. The fission reaction would add too little energy to make the cost of the depleted U worth the effect. As for D being present, this source of fusion energy was explored years ago and found to be too small to be important. So, I doubt this claim. Nevertheless, the use of uranium in the round is bad enough. This is just another method we humans are using to wipe ourselves out. For every person who is making life better, 10 others are working to destroy what is created. These ten are now winning.

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