I try not to be a fanatic - if you feel there is any question I am only showing one side - say what it is?
Your posts Thomas!
Covid-19 News
- Alan Smith
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So you admit that Covid is seanonal
Of course there is a seasonal element to COVID. spread. the main reason seem to be that when the weather is good people meet each other more outdoor and less indoors. In addition, when people meet indoors, windows will be open more often giving better ventilation. Surely these things are obvious?
However that is just one factor determining R - and whether COVID infections increase or decrease overall.
Not being a fanatic - I don't see that is the only factor or even the most important one!
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Your posts Thomas!
Yes - that is not an answer. You need to identify an issue where I post in a way which is unfairly neglecting one side of the argument. I'd be interested in what you or others think that would be: for example, I do have definite opinions on a number of issues. Are there arguments against those opinions I'm not considering, or dismissing unfairly?
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A Doomsday COVID Variant Worse Than Delta and Lambda May Be Coming, Scientists Say
A doomsday COVID variant worse than Delta and Lambda may be coming, scientists sayDelta has shown how destructive new strains of COVID can get. Scientists fear future mutations of the virus could be even worse: "Delta on steroids."www.newsweek.comU.S. DELTA VARIANT CDC
Scientists keep underestimating the coronavirus. In the beginning of the pandemic, they said mutated versions of the virus wouldn't be much of a problem—until the more-infectious Alpha caused a spike in cases last fall. Then Beta made young people sicker and Gamma reinfected those who'd already recovered from COVID-19. Still, by March, as the winter surge in the U.S. receded, some epidemiologists were cautiously optimistic that the rapid vaccine rollout would soon tame the variants and cause the pandemic to wind down
Delta has now shattered that optimism. This variant, first identified in India in December, spreads faster than any previous strain of SARS-CoV-2, as the COVID-19 virus is officially named. It is driving up infection rates in every state of the U.S., prompting the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) to once again recommend universal mask-wearing.
The Delta outbreak is going to get much worse, warns Michael Osterholm, an epidemiologist who leads the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy at the University of Minnesota. "The number of intensive-care beds needed could be higher than any time we've seen," he says. He adds that his team's analysis shows that almost every single one of the 100 million unvaccinated Americans who hasn't had COVID-19 yet will likely get it in the coming months, short of taking the sort of strong isolation and masking precautions that seem unlikely in the vaccine-hesitant population.
The variant is so contagious that it's set to smash through every previous prediction of how soon the U.S. might reach herd immunity. "We've failed to shut this down as we have other pandemics," says Jonathan Eisen, a biologist at the University of California, Davis, who studies how pathogens evolve. "It may be around forevermore, leaving us continually trying to figure out what to do next."
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The Delta outbreak is going to get much worse, warns Michael Osterholm, an epidemiologist who leads the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy at the University of Minnesota. "The number of intensive-care beds needed could be higher than any time we've seen," he says. He adds that his team's analysis shows that almost every single one of the 100 million unvaccinated Americans who hasn't had COVID-19 yet will likely get it in the coming months, short of taking the sort of strong isolation and masking precautions that seem unlikely in the vaccine-hesitant population.
To be fair, delta is only a doomsday variant in places like parts of the US where too many people refuse vaccination. Elsewhere it is worse than alpha by some way, but manageable.
And newer worse variants are always possible, no-one is saying when they will appear or how much worse they will be. Because we do not know.
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To be fair, delta is only a doomsday variant in places like parts of the US where too many people refuse vaccination. Elsewhere it is worse than alpha by some way, but manageable.
And newer worse variants are always possible, no-one is saying when they will appear or how much worse they will be. Because we do not know.
Go to google news it's the main headline all over the world. Fauci warns of more deadly mutations. Keep the gravy train rolling!!!!
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Go to google news it's the main headline all over the world. Fauci warns of more deadly mutations. Keep the gravy train rolling!!!!
Yes, none of that is different from what I said, if you pay attention.
Fauci, like everyone else, says that inevitably if you have high disease rates new variants will come along that are worse in terms of evading immunity. They may also be worse alng the axes of infectivity and lethality - alpha and delta were both that.
I have no idea what you mean by gravy train rolling and can I suggest that it is not a helpful way to be thinking about this stuff.
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Will the Delta Variant Peak and Then Burn Out?
Will the Delta Variant Peak and Then Burn Out?Some experts are heartened by the recent decrease in COVID-19 cases in the U.K. and India, both hard-hit with the Delta variant. COVID-19 cases in India peaked…www.webmd.comAug. 4, 2021 -- When the Delta variant of the coronavirus was first identified in India in December 2020, the threat may have seemed too remote to trigger worry in the United States, although the horror of it ripping through the country was soon hard to ignore.
Within months, the Delta variant had spread to more than 98 countries, including Scotland, the U.K., Israel, and now, of course, the U.S. The CDC said this week the Delta variant now accounts for 93% of all COVID cases.
Fueled by Delta, COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations, and deaths are increasing in nearly all states, according to the latest CDC data. After the 7-day average number of cases dipped by June 22 to about 11,000, it rose by Aug. 3 to more than 85,000.
Some experts are heartened by the recent decrease in COVID-19 cases in the U.K. and India, both hard-hit with the Delta variant. COVID-19 cases in India peaked at more than 400,000 a day in May; by Aug. 2, that had dropped to about 30,500 daily.
t 30,500 daily.
Are You Protected Against the Delta Variant?
WebMD's Chief Medical Officer, John Whyte, MD, speaks with Eric Topol, MD, Executive VP, Scripps Research & Editor-in-Chief, Medscape, about the COVID-19 Delta variant.
ABOUT
Andy Slavitt, former Biden White House senior adviser for COVID-19 response, tweeted July 26 that if the Delta variant acted the same in the U.K. as in India, it would have a quick rise and a quick drop.
The prediction seems to have come true. As of Aug. 3, U.K. cases have dropped to 7,467, compared to more than 46,800 July 19.
So the question of the summer has become: "When will Delta burn out here?"
Like other pandemic predictions, these are all over the board. Here are five predictions about when COVID cases will peak, then fall. They range from less than 2 weeks to more than 2 months:
Mid-August: Among the most optimistic predictions of when the Delta-driven COVID-19 cases will decline is from Scott Gottlieb, MD, former FDA director. He told CNBC on July 28 that he would expect cases to decline in 2-3 weeks -- so by August 11.
Mid-August to mid-September: Ali Mokdad, PhD, chief strategy officer for population health at the University of Washington, says that, "Right now for the U.S. as a country, cases will peak mid-August" and then decline. He is citing projections by the university's Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation. In its "most likely" scenario, it predicts COVID deaths will peak at about 1,000 daily by mid-September, then decline. (As of Aug. 3, daily deaths averaged 371.)
September: "I am hoping we get over this Delta hump [by then]," says Eric Topol, MD, founder and director of the Scripps Research Translational Institute in La Jolla, CA, and editor-in-chief of Medscape. "But sometimes, I am too much of an optimist."
Mid-October: Experts at the COVID-19 Scenario Modeling Hub, a consortium of researchers from leading institutions who consult with the CDC, say the Delta-fueled pandemic will steadily increase through summer and fall, with a mid-October peak.
Unclear: Because cases are underestimated, "I think it is unclear when we will see a peak of Delta," says Amesh Adalja, MD, a senior scholar at the Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security. He predicts a decline in cases as "more people get infected and develop natural immunity."
The predictions are based on different scenarios, such as most likely or worst-case. Factors such as personal behaviors, public mandates, and vaccination rates could all alter the projections.
What a Difference Vaccination May Make
An uptick in vaccinations could change all the models and predictions, experts agree. As of Aug. 3, almost half (49.7%) of the total U.S. population was fully vaccinated, the CDC says. (And 80.1% of those 65 and over were.)
But that's a long way from the 70% or 80% figure often cited to reach herd immunity. Recently, Ricardo Franco, MD, of the University of Alabama at Birmingham, said at a briefing by the Infectious Diseases Society of America that the infectiousness of the Delta variant may mean the herd immunity threshold is actually closer to 90%.
Mokdad of the University of Washington estimates that by Nov. 1, based on the current rate of infections, 64% of people in the U.S. will be immune to a variant like Delta, taking into account those already infected and those vaccinated against COVID-19.
Justin Lessler, PhD, a University of North Carolina epidemiologist involved in the modeling hub, says if enough people get vaccinated, it could stop the Delta variant in its tracks. But that percentage is high.
"I am relatively confident that if we could get 90% or more of the eligible population vaccinated that we would see the epidemic begin to recede,” he says.
It's a huge leap from 50%, or even 64%, to 90%. Could the Delta surge really motivate that many people to head to a vaccination site?
That's hard to predict, Topol says. Some unvaccinated people may feel like soldiers in a foxhole, he says, especially if they are in hard-hit states like Louisiana, and rush to get the vaccine as soon as possible. Others, hearing about the "breakthrough" cases in the vaccinated, may dig in their heels and ask, "Why bother?" as they mistakenly conclude that the vaccine has not done its job.
Roles of Public Policy, Individual Behavior
Besides an increase in vaccinations, individual behaviors and mandates can change the scenario. Doctors can remind even vaccinated patients that behaviors such as social distancing and masks still matter, experts say.
"Don't 'stress test' your vaccine, " Topol says.
The vaccines against COVID are good but not perfect and, he notes, they offer less protection if many months have passed since the vaccines were given.
The best advice now, Topol says, is: "Don't be inside without a mask."
Even if outdoors, depending on how close others are and the level of the conversation, a mask might be wise, he says.
Mokdad finds that "when cases go up, people put on their best behavior," such as going back to masks and social distancing.
"Unfortunately, we have two countries," he says, referring to the way public health measures and mandates vary from state to state.
Once the Delta Variant Subsides, What's Next?
It's not a matter of if there is another variant on the heels of Delta, but when, Topol and other experts say. A new variant, Lambda, was first identified in Peru in August 2020 but now makes up about 90% of the country's infections.
There's also Delta-plus, just found in two people in South Korea.
Future variants could be even more transmissible than Delta, "which would be a horror show," Topol says. "This [Delta] is by far the worst version. The virus is going to keep evolving. It is not done with us."
On the Horizon: Variant-Proof Vaccines
What's needed to tackle the next variant is another approach to vaccine development, according to Topol and his colleague, Dennis R. Burton, a professor of immunology and microbiology at Scripps Research Institute.
Writing a commentary in Nature published this year, the two propose using a special class of protective antibodies, known as broadly neutralizing antibodies, to develop these vaccines. The success of the current COVID-19 vaccines is likely due to the vaccine's ability to prompt the body to make protective neutralizing antibodies. These proteins bind to the viruses and prevent them from infecting the body's cells.
The broadly neutralizing antibodies, however, can act against many different strains of related viruses, Topol and Burton write. Using this approach, which is already under study, scientists could make vaccines that would be effective against a family of viruses. The goal: to stop future outbreaks from becoming epidemics and then pandemics.
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I have no idea what you mean by gravy train rolling and can I suggest that it is not a helpful way to be thinking about this stuff.
yes you do and not helpful to who? Are you suggesting that greed has not played a part in Covid?
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But we really cannot tell yet how much high vaccination rate (it is still happening) will improve things.
Look at Israel: The gen therapy (vaccination..) has no long time value for most. Delta infects vaccinated at the same rate as non vaccinated. So cases are no longer an indication. Only ICU/death are important.
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The Delta outbreak is going to get much worse, warns Michael Osterholm, an epidemiologist who leads the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy at the University of Minnesota. "The number of intensive-care beds needed could be higher than any time we've seen," he says.
This is a lunatic criminal with no clue of data analysis. Fact is Delta is much more a cold than a serious infection. As usually only harmful for the older with weak immune system. Delta, here, will be the end of the pandemic. India has shown > 70% antibody rate in non vaccinated states like Uttar Pradesh thanks to delta. So what can happen?? End of RNA gen therapy is close. Bad for some shareholders income....
Swiss facts 8x cases with delta no measurable change in total mortality. Thus relative mortality extremely low.
So we will face even more THH commercials with fake info/studies/fear/anti vaccine hate.
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For the fear mongers:
Excess deaths UK: https://www.statista.com/stati…ths-in-england-and-wales/
Not seen since week 11/2021 in average below expectations...
Real deaths/age class Switzerland : https://www.covid19.admin.ch/de/epidemiologic/death
13 death over all (last 6 months) in the group of younger than 50. 3 for age < 40 (chemo patients)
Total Swiss RNA gen therapy deaths so far: 128
Verdachtsmeldungen unerwünschter Wirkungen der Covid-19 Impfungen in der Schweiz – Update4'319 Verdachtsmeldungen ausgewertet – Nutzen-Risiko Verhältnis der eingesetzten Impfstoffe bleibt positivwww.swissmedic.ch1/4 of serious cases in age group 16..44.. So obviously the vaccines in this group here did kill far more people than CoV-19...
Data source:: 75% of medical professionals... ==> very reliable.
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Despite Near-Total Vaccination, Iceland Experiences Its Worse Delta-driven Pandemic Surge
Despite Near-Total Vaccination, Iceland Experiences Its Worse Delta-driven Pandemic SurgeWhat’s becoming clear is that the most heavily vaccinated nations are in some ways an indicator for what can or will happen with COVID-19 in the future.trialsitenews.comWhat’s becoming clear is that the most heavily vaccinated nations are in some ways an indicator for what can or will happen with COVID-19 in the future. For example, in Iceland, one of the most vaccinated populations on the planet at 75.8% with at least one jab and about 71.3% fully vaccinated, the number of cases due to Delta are on the rise as the vaccines are not leading to herd immunity as predicted by many. In fact, Iceland is experiencing its worst outbreak of the pandemic, despite the heavily vaccinated population. With an accelerating Delta variant, it becomes clear that those vaccinated get infected with ease, and the vaccinated are becoming spreaders of Delta, much like TrialSite has found in other heavily vaccinated nations. There is a positive in that the rate of serious illness has declined due to the vaccinations, reports Iceland’s Chief Epidemiologist, Þórólfur Guðnason, but many assumptions will have to be reset moving forward.
The country has current social controls in place until August 13. Yet, health authorities have drafted a formal referendum, articulating concern about the most recent strains on the Icelandic healthcare system based on the present infection rate.
TrialSite summarizes findings from an Iceland Review live-tweeting of the recent COVID-19 situation. Included in the recent panel is Víðir Reynisson, Director of Civil Protection and the Chief Epidemiologist. The nation currently has 1,304 active cases, with 16 people in the hospital.
The Chief Epidemiologist (Þórólfur) reminded everyone that infection rates were very low by June, and the majority in the country were vaccinated. The only group with low vaccination rates is the age 12-16 group.
The Surge
The Delta variant has become the dominant variant in all of Iceland. Health authorities have found that vaccinated individuals can contract the Delta variant with ease, thus becoming vectors themselves. Much of the new infections, based on sequencing, have been determined to come from group events such as clubbing in downtown Reykjavík or group trips abroad.
Vaccination Prevents Serious Illness
Icelandic authorities report that only about 1% of the current cases end up in hospitalization compared to 4-5% for previous waves during the pandemic. 2.4% of unvaccinated people in Iceland that contract the Delta variant end up hospitalized.
Vaccines
Those in Iceland that received the Johnson and Johnson vaccine will be offered a Pfizer booster shot. Moreover, the authorities here will offer the Pfizer-BioNTech mRNA vaccine to 12 to 15 year-olds in the future. There are also concerns about the remaining unvaccinated elderly who face particular risks, and who could put a strain on the relatively limited healthcare resources on this small island nation.
Iceland’s Chief Epidemiologist reminded all that the COVID-19 pandemic is not nearly over and won’t be over until it’s over everywhere.
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Delta variant will lead to increase in breakthrough Covid infections among vaccinated, Moderna says
Delta variant will lead to increase in breakthrough Covid infections among vaccinated, Moderna saysModern said it believes a booster will likely be necessary before winter.www.cnbc.comKEY POINTS
The highly contagious delta variant will lead to an increase in breakthrough infections among the fully vaccinated as people begin moving indoors, Moderna said.
While Moderna's two-dose vaccine remains "durable" six months after the second shot, immunity against the virus will continue to wane and eventually impact vaccine efficacy, it said.
"Given this intersection, we believe dose 3 booster will likely be necessary prior to the winter season," Moderna wrote.
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10 is not zero..strange math from Georgia
~10/ 3.5k versus ~20/3.5k ..seems less to me..
Yes, 5 or 10 deaths per day is not quite zero, but given the population of Israel, and 3,800 people infected per day, it is likely that most of the dead were very old, or suffering from an advanced cases of cancer, or close to death for some other reason. COVID probably kills them because they are so weak. 5 or 10 would die from the common cold. Many more from influenza. So, as I said, it is no more of a threat than influenza. However, 3,800 infections per day is too many. This number needs to be reduced. I am confident it will be reduced with a second booster shot, and/or a booster targeted to Delta. And, possibly, with another round of masking and social distancing until the numbers fall.
As I said, the situation is under control.
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"Given this intersection, we believe dose 3 booster will likely be necessary prior to the winter season," Moderna wrote.
A booster every six months until the folks die from a simple cold due to ACE-2 lock induced immune insufficiency...
I like this mass extinction program of the western nations. This will soon provide ample room for the naturally immune migrants from Africa,India...
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The timing of natural killer cell response in coronavirus infection: a concise model perspective
The timing of natural killer cell response in coronavirus infection: a concise model perspectiveCoronaviruses, including SARS-CoV, MERS-CoV, and SARS-CoV-2 cause respiratory diseases with remarkably heterogeneous progression. This in part reflects the…www.biorxiv.orgAbstract
Coronaviruses, including SARS-CoV, MERS-CoV, and SARS-CoV-2 cause respiratory diseases with remarkably heterogeneous progression. This in part reflects the viral ability to influence the cytokine secretion and thereby the innate immune system. Especially the viral interference of IFN-I signaling and the subsequent deficiency of innate immune response in the early phase have been associated with rapid virus replication and later excessive immune responses. We propose a mathematical framework to analyze IFN-I signaling and its impact on the interaction motif between virus, NK cells and macrophages. The model recapture divergent dynamics of coronavirus infections including the possibility for elevated secretion of IL-6 and IFN-γ as a consequence of exacerbated macrophage activation. Dysfunction of NK cells recruitment increase disease severity by leading to a higher viral load peak, the possibility for excessive macrophage activation, and an elevated risk of the cytokine storm. Thus the model predicts that delayed IFN-I signaling could lead to pathogenicity in the latter stage of an infection. Reversely, in case of strong NK recruitment from infected cells we predict a possible chronic disease state with moderate and potentially oscillating virus/cytokine levels.
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Are you suggesting that greed has not played a part in Covid?
Greed plays a role in all human affairs. In capitalism, it is usually a positive, helpful role. It spurs innovation. In COVID, it spurred Pfizer to develop a vaccine quickly, with their own money, without tax money. That is a remarkable accomplishment. It is wonderful. The fact that they did it without tax money is icing on the cake. So, greed has made a wonderful contribution to the COVID crisis, and it will ultimately save millions of lives.
There is no evidence that greed has caused problems in the COVID crisis. Assertions that greed have prevented the use of ivermectin and other drugs make no sense. That is not how free-market capitalism works. Greed and the capitalist lust for profit would never prevent the use of these drugs. On the contrary, it ensures they would be used if they are effective. As I have pointed out, if the drugs are effective and one company does not provide them, their competitors will. The competitors would like nothing better than to grab profits and market share from the company that tries to suppress the use of a drug. Competing companies never cooperate. They never help one another. First, because that would be leaving money on the table. Second, because it would violate antitrust laws and get them in trouble with Uncle Sam.
Saying that greed is a problem in the pandemic is like saying that greed held back progress in personal computers and software in the 1980s. That era saw the most progress in the history of computing. Every bit of it was driven by greed. Greedy people including Bill Gates and I made progress because we wanted money. Computers were a wide open, profitable business. In 2020 and 2021, probably the most profitable business on earth is making vaccines for COVID. If ivermectin or some other drug worked, that would also be fantastically profitable. There is plenty of market share for both vaccines and drugs, just as there was plenty of market space for PCs and Mac in the 1980s. The profit motive is good. It is what is saving millions of lives.
The only bad influence on the pandemic are the lies and fear spread by anti-vax people and the GOP. This is not motivated by greed. It is motivated by ignorance, fear, anti-science attitudes, the lust for political power, and the will to hurt your enemies and "own the libs." Do you want to know why rural people in Georgia are dying from COVID? Because they have the mentality of the Russian peasant in the proverbial story. God sends an angel to visit a devout peasant. The angel says, "God knows of your devotion, and he wishes to reward you." "Oh, thank you!" replies the peasant. The angel explains: "God will grant you anything, with one provision. Whatever he gives you, he will give it twice to your neighbor." The peasant is taken aback. Disturbed. Finally, he sputters: "Then take one of my eyes!"
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Delta variant will lead to increase in breakthrough Covid infections among vaccinated, Moderna says
I think this is well established by now. Moderna, the CDC and many others now have data showing this is the case. It is bad news, but not catastrophic for vaccinated people. There are more breakthrough cases than there were with earlier strains of COVID, but still very few serious cases or deaths. A second booster will probably be needed, but there will be plenty of time to develop it and deploy it in first world nations.
Delta not only causes more breakthrough cases, it is more contagious. I read there are indications it causes more serious illness among younger people, but that has not yet been clearly established. What is clear is that Delta is not catastrophic to vaccinated people, but it is catastrophic to the unvaccinated. Anyone can see that in the statistics from places like Florida. Unvaccinated people are in as much danger as they were in December. In the U.S., most of them are not protected by herd immunity because they live clustered together in places where very few people are vaccinated. In Georgia, they live in voting districts that went strongly for Trump. Democratic districts are ~70% vaccinated; Trump districts ~25%. ~25% happens to be the number of Democrats in these districts, which I expect is no coincidence. 90% of Democrats say they are vaccinated or they soon will be. In other words, the 75% of unvaccinated people in these districts are mostly Republicans, and they probably go to church together and shop together, all without masks or social distancing. They are actively opposed to vaccination. In short, they are in a Dance with Death, like gay people in the 1980s having unrestricted sex with strangers in bathhouses as AIDS swept through their community.
(metmuseum.org, Anonymous, German, 16th century)
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yes you do and not helpful to who? Are you suggesting that greed has not played a part in Covid?
No, I don't. greed plays some part on most human activity. In most countries (not all) greed plays less part in science and medical research than most activities. Now, drug companies, like all large companies, evolve to be successful and that means making money - so there I agree with you. I do not agree with you that regulators, research scientists, etc, are systematically corrupt and controlled by pharma companies. I do agree that in any country corruption is possible - I don't expect enormous amounts of it in the UK or the US - except perhaps in politics in the US, where things are pretty bad due to the fcat that you need above all, to get elected, lots of money.
Finally in the Uk (can't speak for US) we used to have every doctor given freebies, holidays, etc, etc by drug companies. it was not good. That is why a lot of effort went in to regulating the use of drugs and we have institutions - those things that keep democracies afloat when politicians don't - that require doctors to behave ethically and enforce this.
I'm not saying this is perfect. I'm not saying doctors and scientists are not human, capable of greed, etc. I know a lot of scientists. They tend to be not focussed on money because they start off very well qualified with great math skills and choose to go into science, which pays badly. The ones who are more focused on money go into merchant banks - which it is easy for them to do. They are paid initial salaries 2 -3 X as much, and salary progression is also much better, as are bonusses.
So - has greed played a part in COVID? I don't know of any obvious ways in which it has - except that in the frantic scramble to get PPE in Europe there have been a lot of unscrupulous cowboys. Since (in the UK) there are not many drugs approved for COVID (only for special circumstances) I can't say greed will play much part in that. Remdesivir is approved for limited use in some circumstances, and I have no reason to think that decision was corrupt, even though the evidence for remdesivir is not great. For the vaccines we don't know how good a deal the UK government got. We do know it put in a lot of money unconditionally for the development and testing which is why we got good early access. We also know that our own AstraZeneca vaccine is made by AstraZeneca at cost. We also know that the pfizer and moderna mRNA vaccines are extraordinarily successful - surpassing all expectations.
I guess that Moderna and Pfizer make a decent amount of money out of the vaccines. because they work. they might not have done so - if you look over all at the 200 or so candidate vaccines for COVID most have not worked.
You maybe have special things in the UK I don't understand. Some people seem to have apolitical grudge against Fauci - who as far as i canm see has been a straight-talking effective public policy and science communicator in the US for a long time. I guess now with the politicisation of medicine there that is a bad place to be.
I'd also point out that both anti-vaxx and anti-government internet memes play on people's feelings of insecurity, fear, and jealousy. In this case the idea there are a lot of powerful people doing bad things out of greed is attractive - but an attractive internet meme is not the same thing as reality.
of course there is corruption, greed,etc. is it systematic are particularly large in the science and medical establishment? In the UK, definitely no to science, and I'm pretty sure no in medicine.
THH
PS - Jed points out that as a prime motivator of capitalism greed is fundamantal, and not bad. That is true - but not the whole truth. In both science, engineering, and medicine other motives (wanting to understand things, make them work, heal people) are just as powerful. In the UK scientists, engineers, and doctors are not paid that well - perhaps that is why!
